I'm sure with an odd tweak here and there the GM unit would suffice. Like I mentioned in the other thread I'd still have one if I had the resources...it's all about power!!!!!!!!!! :lol:

 

yes its GM`s 3.2 V6 from the vectra GSI and Omega Elite but heavily reworked by alfa.

 

Yes, it's a G.M. engine, "BADLY REWORKED BY ALFA." However, the only cars that have any connection with the "Alfa Romeo Proper" are the 916 GTV's and Spiders, the 3.2 GT. and the 147/156 GTA's. 147 and 156 twinnies are loosely connected to the early twin sparks - they pulled the heads out of their museum and reproduced them at a time when the competition started to get too close, but they used a Fiat Steel block. I'm afraid you are two generations too late, if you want a real Alfa engine. So, your choice is limited to the aforementioned Busso powered cars. The diesels are great engines, for what they are, but were developed by Fiat Power - Trains.

If you want the 159, 3.2 to perform like an Alfa, find a way to get rid of 600 kilos, open the V.V.T. Phasors up and pack them out with spacers to mimic the Busso's Valve Timing. This will enable you to run on a decent grade of engine oil to protects the mechanicals. Then design an interface box to fool the ECU into believing the V.V.T. solenoid valves have set correctly. Make sure the car is a Q4 and be prepared to work the the gear changes as of old, perhaps changing the gearbox ratios at the same time. Economy probably won't be any worse but emissions will go through the roof. Christ it will be a good engine though. Indeed, it is a good engine, just Alfa F----d it up. One of the prettiest designs still to this very day, pulled early. A really decent chassis, pulled early. A car that goes round bends; Q4, like it is on rails, pulled early. A car that is almost impossible to un-stick and so easy to recover, pulled early. Why?

Crap Corporate Thinking. The average Joe Public has more love for the Alfa Marque and it's heritage, than those Wooden Headed T---s that fill the boardrooms at Fiat. The greatest service they could do for Alfa Romeo is to sell it to - Mmmmmm? Anyone. Never have financial decisions impacted more on the reputation of this once great company. They will never be allowed to compete in Maserati or Ferrari's territory, so what is the point. A chap who had a 8C at an Auto Italia day complained bitterly about the amount of Maserati components under the bonnet. They hadn't the common sense to change the identity of cheap plastic components with a stamp which said Alfa Romeo.

The new Giulia is a recipe' car, designed to fit in and not to compete. with other models within the Fiat Empire. They are not interested in taking the fight to their competitors, just in making sure Alfa "Know Their Place". they will never be allowed to steal the thunder of Maserati or Ferrari as they did of old. And all B.M.W. and Mercedes have to do is step it up a notch. And then Fiat will return to selling the cars based upon the Badge, rather than their performance.

I love Alfa Romeo. I loath Fiat.

 

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It may be heavily re-worked by Alfa, but it's still a GM Holden V6 block made in Australia, it's a pile of old rubbish, and is about to be ditched.......and about time too!:lol: Should never have gone anywhere near an Alfa Romeo, thanks very much:lol:

Actually the GM engine block is very strong - I think you'll find that the Alfa ancillaries are considerably less reliable..

 

Get the 2.4 diesel, thats more of an Alfa engine than the Brucey V6!

 

it was a bit of a bad idea, but surely it cant be all that bad, the whole top end is all alfa, its just the bottom thats gm

 

The new v6 is a holden design the block is cast by fiat in mexico then shipped to port Melbourne Australia were the engine is assembled including gm heads then shipped to Europe for the opel factories with some going to alfa/fiat were the heads are removed and fiats designed heads are put on the cheapest way of doing it i been told:lol: ciao daz

Holden V6 ready to power Fiat, Alfa and Opel - www.drive.com.au

 

The new v6 is a holden design the block is cast by fiat in mexico then shipped to port Melbourne Australia were the engine is assembled including gm heads then shipped to Europe for the opel factories with some going to alfa/fiat were the heads are removed and fiats designed heads are put on the cheapest way of doing it i been told:lol: ciao daz

Holden V6 ready to power Fiat, Alfa and Opel - www.drive.com.au

Now maybe I don't just understand the global economies of scale ... but surely that can't be cost effective :lol:

 

Its also the same block that is used in the Saab Aero 2.8 V6, reduced in capacity, but then they do whack a turbo on it!
Also found in the Vectra VXR.

 

It's a great engine once well run in. It's sounds brilliant, is chain driven and uses no oil. It doesn't look much though and is quite thirsty in the "substantial" newer cars. I wish I'd got a 3.2 Ti when they first come out.

 

So you wish you'd have got a red 3.2 Ti. You are getting worse than me Simon :lol:

 

Give it a whirl and see what you think. I have heard good reports of it. Having phased out the GM sourced 2.2 though I dont know how long they will keep on with this engine?

 

A few things regarding the current 3.2 in the Brera/159.

Only the block is GM. The cylinder head, pistons, induction and exhaust are all from Alfa - assembled in Italy.

Having driven both the Arese V6 and the Brera V6, the current 3.2 doesn't sound as epic. But it definitely does still have that Alfa rasp and power. And it has Q4, something the 3.2 GTA's and GT were sadly lacking in the showroom which resulted in diffs blowing left, right and centre.

Yes, it's thirsty. But so too was the Arese.

I'm with RSK and Squadrone Rosso on this one.

Try not to judge until you have driven one. You may be pleasantly surprised.

I was.

 

A few things regarding the current 3.2 in the Brera/159.

Only the block is GM. The cylinder head, pistons, induction and exhaust are all from Alfa - assembled in Italy.

Having driven both the Arese V6 and the Brera V6, the current 3.2 doesn't sound as epic. But it definitely does still have that Alfa rasp and power. And it has Q4, something the 3.2 GTA's and GT were sadly lacking in the showroom which resulted in diffs blowing left, right and centre.

Yes, it's thristy. But so too was the Arese.

I'm with RSK and Squadrone Rosso on this one.

Try not to judge until you have driven one. You may be pleasantly surprised.

I was.

Thanks Kalel, finding one to test drive is the next problem!

 

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I do find your continued defence of this engine rather intriguing RSK, given the terrible experience you had with your ex-Brera 3.2? Or was it the engine that was actually ok, and everything else about the Brera was bad?

From my time on this forum, the one thing I like and respect about RSK is his balance.

Usually it's those who could never afford a (insert random marque/model here) who are always the most critical. The same story time and time again. Deep rooted envy and insecurity maybe? Who knows....

The Brera has its faults. As does the spider. As did my former 156. They all have their different strong points as well.

But to be critical without ever having owned a Brera or to draw on only the negatives from some third party.... ????

 

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the new 3.2 has more bhp/litre, more torque, + in a like for like comparison you can bet it's much more economical, so it can't be that bad really.

I think people just slag it off because when the 159/Brera came out the performance wasn't quick, but this was blatantly due to extra weight not a poor engine.

 

Also the 4WD ... (a lot more transmission losses ...)

 

Absolutely spot on.

The Mito has certainly divided opinion over the so called 'Alfa Purists' I generally love all Alfa's and think the Mito is a decent car compared to what it's put up against. My partner has a Mini that she dearly wanted (BMW one) and the Mito certainly stands up well against that, what it certainly has done is put Alfa back on the map, there's a lot of interest now and build quality post 159 has been mainly comparible to the German cars which don't look anything like as good. I personally think the new Milano/149 from the pictures I have seen looks stunning, i'm sure it will be translated into sales as has been evidenced with the Mito.

We have to accept with global economies, that a certain amount of 'part sharing' is going to happen, at least the Alfa's are still retaining a certain degree of Italian Charm, even if that is traded off somewhat against mass market appeal.

Saab have been nothing but glorified GM products for many years and lost any of their former charm, it will be interesting to see whether they get it back after the breakaway from GM.

 

How far do people want to take this "Real Alfa" thing? I mean if you're serious about driving a Real Alfa, then you shouldn't have anything with a German Bosch ECU in it, which is every single Alfa since at least the 90s, including the 147/156GTAs!!

My bet is you won't find a single car going back for several decades where the components are all made in a single country, let alone a single company.

 

My bet is you won't find a single car going back for several decades where the components are all made in a single country, let alone a single company.

You'd be quite right there CF ... no car contains parts solely from it's country of origin, the US has tried to do it but has resorted to parts being built in the US but still by non-US companies.

There was an article in one of the sunday papers when the Aston DBS was launched and it detailled whee all the 'main' components come from and it showed that it was England, Italy, Germany and many more involved

to get a TRUELY Italian Alfa wouldn't be the best product you could make ... says the man happy with his Vectra block in his Spider that the platform was developed in conjunction with GM but never used on a production car by them

 

I drive Police cars which use the 3.6l Holden Alloytec engine - the block is that is talked about in this forum. I can assure you these engines get thrashed - and seem to take it in their stride. It's the high mileages and crashes that cause cars in our fleet to be replaced.
Having said that, I'm not a fan of the Holden/GM Commodore car and would not buy one. I have a v6 156 and a 5 cylinder turbo Volvo - great engines in my opinion. I'm yet to drive the Brera, but I'm bidding on one at an auction tomorrow so we'll soon see how it compares.
The cam chain kits (all 3 chains, gears and guides) are about AUS$450 over here and there are plentyu

 

I drive Police cars which use the 3.6l Holden Alloytec engine - the block is that is talked about in this forum. I can assure you these engines get thrashed - and seem to take it in their stride. It's the high mileages and crashes that cause cars in our fleet to be replaced.
Having said that, I'm not a fan of the Holden/GM Commodore car and would not buy one. I have a v6 156 and a 5 cylinder turbo Volvo - great engines in my opinion. I'm yet to drive the Brera, but I'm bidding on one at an auction tomorrow so we'll soon see how it compares.
The cam chain kits (all 3 chains, gears and guides) are about AUS$450 over here and there are plenty of those engines in use = alot of experienced techs about.

 

That 159 is a Fiat with Saab design and the 3.2 is a Holden engine and the 2.2 is an Opel.

If you wish for a "real" Alfa, go for a rear wheel drive model.

 

Is this horshiitee still going on?

Usually brought up by people driving re-bodied Fiat Tipos with Glagglag engines.

I had two of the later 3.2V6 Brera cars & a Busso GT. All excellent in their own way.

As above, if you want a real Alfa, stick with the a 75 or S4 Spider.

The latest stuff leans too heavily on Chrysler & Jeep.

If you believe either of those last two paragraphs, go buy a BM or something true to its bloodline.

 

I've currently got 13 cars - mostly Alfas. The only real problem with having 13 is when I jump in the manual 147 I forget the clutch when I start it... Then after a few days I go back to the Selespeed 147 and press on the brake pedal with my left foot when changing gear! The V6 156 is a little honey, but can't be compared with the 3.2 Brera - just totally different cars really. I drive Holden V6 patrol cars using the GM 'Alloytec' engines all day. They seem to be indestructible. As similar as they are to the Brera engine in construction they just aren't recognisable as cousins in their different forms.
Favourite engine? Volvo T5.
Favourite car? Alfa 147 2.0 Selespeed
Prettiest car? Alfa Brera SV Q4
Oldest car? Mitsubishi Galant GTO 1973
Last to get rid of? Volvo 940 turbo estate.
First to get rid of? Alfa 156 V6.
Wackiest car? Volvo 480es.