Alfa Romeo Forum banner

21 - 39 of 39 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
103 Posts
Discussion Starter #21
The expected timing belt kit did not arrive.......maybe it will arrive in the future. At this stage, who can say? I am now formally done, they can light the **** on fire for me, short of it being free I will never have another Alfa Romeo ever again. Through all this I hasten to add the dealer has done everything they said they would do precisely on schedule with when they said they would do it. They just can't get parts from AR, and when AR do provide a 'date' for delivery (as opposed to saying 'backordered') they then miss said date.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,624 Posts
Actually tezmo, I think your issue is the dealer. Your original issue was
Check engine light, diagnosed as 'leaves', followed by air flow sensor replacement, followed by turbo replacement, now talking about 'carbon build up in the throttle body'
At this stage changing a timing belt is mere hope. Hope is a poor strategy. They have misdiagnosed this problem continually, and are doing so again. Unless the timing belt has snapped, which it hasn't as the engine would be in bits, then there is no way on this earth it would cause a check engine light. This is not a fault of the car, its a failure of a dealer and the tech team to identify the issue. You could demand to have the car moved to another dealer. Because they may as well be saying it is the colour of the shirt your wearing at the moment which is causing the engine light as saying a timing belt replacement will turn it off.
What exactly is 'leaves' ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
103 Posts
Discussion Starter #23
So the air intake (bear in mind I barely have an idea what I'm talking about) is in the gap between the top of the bonnet and the bottom of the windscreen. Allegedly full of leaves, described to me as being the cause of the fault until the error (having been cleared down) came back. Subsequent changing of various sensor parts, the turbo, and now the timing belt job.

At every step of the way the dealer has apologised to me for the try X, try Y, try Z approach with the explanation that they are following the diagnostic steps given to them direct from Alfa, and that every operation performed has been selected not by the local technicians, but by Alfa techs themselves - this I've no reason to believe, and it makes sense to me that they would follow an escalation path for something apparently so complicated.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,624 Posts
Yes, your right, I am familiar with the tortuous path imposed upon the dealer when faced with an unknown such as this. The leaves were a red herring however, that air intake is for the heating and ventilation system, would never cause a check engine light. The air intake for the engine is towards the front of the engine and could never get blocked with leaves.
I am saddened for you, and I totally get your frustration. Would it be possible to sit with the dealer and ask about a deal whereby you change the car early at a favourable to you price ? Or maybe a like for like swap with a car in the stock system ? The car is worth it, our diesel has 66 k on it and its as brilliant today as it was when picked up first day. It would be a double shame for you if you had to walk away on top of what you've already endured.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,077 Posts
I also think there is usually a "loss in translation" between the workshop technician and the service desk rep. I usually ask to speak directly to the technician when the problem is even remotely drawn out. I agree with Hugh above. Leaves in the scuttle panel (below the windscreen) are common in the autumn and winter, this can cause blockage of the water drainage to the floor at best or cause HVAC issues. Nothing to do with engine. If they are saying the "air intake" was blocked with leaves, it means the ducting at the front of the car via the grille leading to the air filter was blocked. I cannot see how this is possible unless you drove through a tree! It is not uncommon for a couple of dry leaves to be present in the airbox before the filter. The air flow meter is after the filter before the turbo. But ultimately the air filter will stop any debris from being sucked into the turbo considering the paper filter mesh can filter "micron" sized particulates. I too do not see how a timing belt can be faulty, it either works or doesn't usually and in the latter case cause engine damage. Timing chains can stretch due to lack of oil lubrication but that will result in CEL and other errors. The diesel has a timing belt so I don't get their diagnosis. You should ask for the diagnostic report in full from start to finish to be scanned and emailed to you. If you post that here perhaps we can make more sense and come up with some meaningful conclusions.

I agree this is totally unacceptable. They have not got to the root cause... yet.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
103 Posts
Discussion Starter #26
Thank you both for your thoughts. Hugh, since the car is mine through a lease company, the dealer has nothing to lose and no axe to grind, the car has a fixed return date and its replacement will have nothing to do with the dealer who is working on the current car. I'd like to leverage the poor show in some way, but from the perspective of all involved everyone is meeting their obligations (particularly with the provision of the hire car which is on its 42nd day with me) and no-one involved (bar Alfa) stands to be involved in my next car. Metalgod I surely will request the diagnostic report, will share it here of course.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,624 Posts
An awful position to be in. A great mechanic would pinpoint the issue in half a day. Do you know what code is attached to the engine light ? They would be given a code from the ecu (engine brain) when they interrogate it, if you could get that we would have a far greater chance of assisting. Usually its a letter and 4 digits.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,467 Posts
...A great mechanic would pinpoint the issue in half a day. ...
I'm not sure that's really true. The Giulia, amongst other modern cars, is so complex, the workshops are dependent upon the fault indications the car provides and they may not be helpful with diagnosis in all cases.
I'd guess that the root cause of the OP's problems are a duff sensor somewhere and I'd expect WiTech2 to give helpful indications to track it down. Though that would not seem to be the case.
One would hope that the competent mechanic with appropriate training would be able to pinpoint the cause of this CEL without having to rely on email ping pong with Torino.
The problems that the OP has experienced are unreasonable. So far as I'm aware, he hasn't told us which dealer has his car. One to avoid I'd suggest. Not least, on the basis of the initial diagnosis of 'leaves'.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,467 Posts
I think it’s time he leaves the dealer and tries another!
I think I would have gone elsewhere immediately after the 'leaves' explanation
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
103 Posts
Discussion Starter #32
Even the leaves thing I am half inclined to give the dealer the benefit of the doubt - please bear in mind my auto-vernacular isn't up to par. If the initial diagnosis found a sack full of leaves somewhere in the engine bay, the error was cleared down, and the word from the dealer is "its fixed but we want to keep it overnight and cold-start it in the morning to be certain" - after which the rigmarole and "email tennis" began, I don't think thats unreasonable on their part. Even the diagnostic path doesn't grind my gears, its just the parts availability. I had 3 new rims and a full head unit under warranty on my 3-series and it barely took over 48 hours. I really dont want to blast the dealer for this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33,248 Posts
Bmw are under investigation in the US for dumping pretend sales on the forecourt based on them being loaners during warranty work. Alfa has missed a trick there. Audi has a big fleet of loan cars which are then closed-auctioned very cheaply to subsidise them with profitable used stock.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,624 Posts
Have you actually seen the car since you left it in tezmo ? I'm reminded now of the individual in the early days who kept being told his new QF needed this part and that part until he finally went into the workshop one day and found his QF with the entire front end stripped down, engine out, and nobody had a clue as to what had happened, how much damage there was, or how it was going to be rectified. He had to walk away from the deal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
103 Posts
Discussion Starter #36
Haha I remember that! I have seen it yes......I go past on sundays just to let it know I’ve not forgotten about it. It’s not been in bits until the start of this week. Mostly it’s just been outdoors (probably getting battered by other customers cars :/) There’s a tracker in it too and it’s real movements reflect those the dealer claims.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
103 Posts
Discussion Starter #37
I have it back! and it’s absolutely fantastic to be in my car, I know an XE aint automotive poverty but I feel like I’ve come home. There was a phone book worth of notes in the file at the dealer with all the witech diagnostics and the technicians write up describing the process. Im not exactly elated by the experience but I am just so pleased to have it back and working.
 
21 - 39 of 39 Posts
Top