[kevjtd]

went to donington park grand prix museum yesterday with the east midlands guys, never been to the museum before as i'm usually too busy watching the racing.
but one particular engine caught my eye, an H16 by BRM

bit of info about it on the board

i couldn't figure it out at first but it is basically 2 flat 8's laid on top of each other, 2 crankshafts joined together at one end
a very compact engine lengthways, not really that much longer then a sud engine, but quite tall. it has 16 cylinders and was built to the 3.0ltr engine rules.

a quick search found the sound, just please crank up the sound and listen to this

The Sound of BRM - Car Videos on StreetFire

bit more info courtesy of wikipedia

H engine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


they also had the BRM V16 engine there with a cut-away section showing just how tiny the pistons are

a few more pics from the day here

http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/meets-and-events-images/202534-donnington-meet.html


chris, when you come over in the summer i would say if you like old F1 cars then it is well worth a visit for you :thumbs:

 

[melv]

wow that engine is a beast.
looks like you hed a good day out.

 

[alfa302]

Now that I like alot, shame it never went any further, can you imagine the amount of Suds that would have gone this way given the chance. :wow:

 

[Supercharged16v]

who's gonna take me there ? Not fun looking at this stuff with the wife

If I do that , the next place I'll be visiting will be a spoon factory or something....

I'd love to go though

 

[kevjtd]

who's gonna take me there ? Not fun looking at this stuff with the wife

If I do that , the next place I'll be visiting will be a spoon factory or something....

I'd love to go though

if you fancy going mate, i will tag along :thumbs: your better half could have the day in nottingham spending your cash :lol:

 

[Spacenut]

The BRM H16 was an amazing engine, but the main problem was with the enormous forces on the geared crankshafts - at the time the metallurgical technology just wasn't sufficiently advanced and it has only been in recent years that the H16 has been able to run reliably.

I did wonder about how you might go about making an H8 engine out of two Alfa boxers. But I think that flat-8 project is probably more realistic.

The aviation industry has always had some interesting engine designs, mainly as a result of the need for more POWER!!! The Napier Lion W12 (nothing like the silly Audi/VW stuff) had three inline 4-cylinder engine blocks displaced radially and sharing a common crank. But the ultimate for me was the Rolls-Royce Vulture engine, used on the Avro Manchester, a twin engined precursor to the Lancaster bomber from WW2. The Vulture was an X24 configuration, using two Merlin V12s on a common crankshaft. Very unreliable, by all accounts!

I believe BRM only had success in F1 when they replaced the unreliable H16 with a more conventional V12 engine instead. A fascinating history though!

Lauren

 

[kammatic]

............."The Napier Lion W12 (nothing like the silly Audi/VW stuff)"...........

sorry but the VW w12 is not "silly", its actually a bloody impressive piece of engineering... if you ever take one apart, as I have, you will see why !

 

[Dralf1965]

Kev. Played the sound link and recognise it as that of Nick Mason's V16, not H16, as included on the CD of his cars which cam with the excellent book 'Into the red'. Sorry to be pedantic. Anyway, play this on your home hi fi and i guarantee it will make every hair on your body stand up, excellent stuff.

 

[Dralf1965]

Or did i get that wrong?

 

[kevjtd]

funny you mention that, i searched the last night for a soundbite of the V16 (also there at donington ) and found one supposed to be the V16 but it sounded indentical to the one supposed to be form the H16
now i know they could sound similar, but the clip sounded the same. gearchanges, missfires etc all in the same place


does sound great though, whichever engine it was

 

[Spacenut]

sorry but the VW w12 is not "silly", its actually a bloody impressive piece of engineering... if you ever take one apart, as I have, you will see why !

I'm sure it is - I just don't like the narrow angle vee approach. It creates poor conrod thrust angles. As well as being less efficient (higher friction losses) I can't help thinking that engine life will suffer as a consequence. There again, with modern materials maybe it won't...

Lauren

 

[kammatic]

NNNaaaaaa it will be perfect, the Germans themselves told me so lol

Lauren i know you like your techy stuff, have a watch of this,... i know its not alfa.... but a billet alloy block is unreal!

YouTube - W16 Engine Block Machined From Solid Billet

 

[kammatic]

actually, how about his for a Sud???

http://image.europeancarweb.com/f/8...om+Volkswagen_Passat_W8+W8_Engine_Cutaway.jpg

its a bit like a sud engine, pretty wide but very short ... but 8 cylinders!

.... ok the VW streak is coming out of me... i'll go away now !!

 

[jason]

.

 

[Spacenut]

actually, how about his for a Sud???

http://image.europeancarweb.com/f/8...om+Volkswagen_Passat_W8+W8_Engine_Cutaway.jpg

its a bit like a sud engine, pretty wide but very short ... but 8 cylinders!

.... ok the VW streak is coming out of me... i'll go away now !!

Is there an engine in there somewhere???

As for a VW streak, well, the Alfa boxer was designed by Rudolf Hruska, an Austrian who had previously worked for Porsche... so maybe there was a slight Germanic influence, although I understand the boxer engine brief was driven by a combination of aerodynamics and visibility requirements rather than a desire to copy VW.

Lauren

 

[Alfasixnut]

That billet block machining is fantastic to watch! yep I'm a sad git!!

 

[kevjtd]

That billet block machining is fantastic to watch! yep I'm a sad git!!

missed that link first time round, amazing to look at

 

[kammatic]

vw w12 billet block ....its the best bit of machining i have ever seen !


has anybody ever put a tape measure around a porsche 911 engine? its flat, its powerful and it can be that much longer than a sud engine lol

 

[kammatic]

actually i think i just had one of those stupid ideas i have..... if you get an air cooled one it will not need the rad or anything in the front of the engine bay, more room for the extra two pots .... all i need now is a porsche lump and a sud to throw it in.... Bad panel's sud !!!!! mmmmmmm

 

[kevjtd]

actually i think i just had one of those stupid ideas i have..... if you get an air cooled one it will not need the rad or anything in the front of the engine bay, more room for the extra two pots .... all i need now is a porsche lump and a sud to throw it in.... Bad panel's sud !!!!! mmmmmmm

sounds like a plan as long as the porsche gearbox could be reveresed

not sure if the sud 'box would handle the torque