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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi Guys,

Sorry to make my first post a problem (and a long winded one), but I could use some sage advice!

To give some history.

I have a 2.0 JTDM 159, its been regularly serviced and maintained by local alfa specialists, had a couple of jobs done under warranty (power steering pump, back box due to rust). It's now out of warranty and has started with an odd problem. Its fast approaching 100k Miles.

Since new its had an occasional struggle picking up on power low down in the revs, however I've always understood that as one of the "joys" of this model. Sometimes scares the crap out of me at a roundabout when i put the foot down to pull out into a gap and the car struggles forward slowly until about 2000rpm.

Anyway, recently it started to chuck out black smoke (blinding anyone behind) and bunnyhop when I put my foot down to overtake on the motorway (over 3-4k revs). It was also terribly lumpy at idle, it was clearly not happy. My initial thoughts were a blown turbo hose, however on inspection I saw no issues other than what looked like grease around the manifold vacuum inlet, the car had also not thrown any error codes.

I took it to the local specialists who replaced 1 of the injectors which according to computer was almost constantly wide open. This was thought to have fixed the problem as the lumpyness was gone and I drove back from the garage fine, the next morning however it managed approx 2 miles before stalling at a set of traffic lights.

The car battery/alternator was fine as radio etc working, the car was turning over but just would not kick in, after about 15 minutes I tried to start it again, it kicked in, managed 3 or 4 seconds of running then stalled again. The local specialists kindly came out and picked the car up and said that the fuel kill switch had been triggered. As a result, they were able to simply drive the car back to the workshop. (~3 miles)

Since then they'd had the car for a week trying to troubleshoot the problem, however as no error was being throw (apparently it has cut out on them a couple of times on test runs) they were unable to identify the fault. They've tried draining the fuel tank (though it had not seen a petrol station with me for almost a week and had driven 3 or 4 40 mile journeys to and from work since, unless they accidently put something duff in.....) I generally use either asda/bp regular fuel depending on price, but every 3 or 4 fill ups I brim the tank with Shell V Power+. Anyhow, this hasnt solved the problem and the car continues to cut out.

The next suggestion by them as it was apparently knocking (Its now back with me on the drive and seems to be fine at idle) was to replace the remaining 3 injectors, which I cannot at this point honestly afford to do (at £300 odd each, they're not cheap!), especially given there is no guarantee this is the cause since there is no error code. My main concern is that it wasn't stalling before the original injector was replaced, only since the repair, and i'm not sure why 4 injectors would fail/need replacing at the same time?

As a result I've had to borrow a car from a friend and take my car back, hoping its something cheaper I can fix myself. I've managed to drive it back from the garage without any issues, I didn't want to push it however so kept the revs low and havent been out on a proper run yet.

I'm handy with a set of spanners and have on the recommendation of mechanic friends ordered a new crank sensor which we intend to fit at the weekend and give it a test drive.

If thats not my culprit, suggestions/questions/answers please? :confused:
 

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It might be worth a trip to an Alfa specialist.

First thought is it may be related to a faulty/sticking EGR valve.
 

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It might be worth a trip to an Alfa specialist.

First thought is it may be related to a faulty/sticking EGR valve.
check the egr valve first. its probably clogged with soot
+1 on both of these.

I had what sounds like a similar problem when i first got mine, it unfortunately, was cured by getting the injectors replaced. I was lucky in the fact it was done under warranty though!

Cleaning the EGR may help. Blanking it may cure it. If it's still there after clean/blank, I would look at the injectors!

Just a quick question, is it lumpy at low revs? And on occasion does it feel like it's a rocket ship?
 

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Really does sound like EGR is sticking open...
Had very similar problem with my old 159...
 

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I'm with the above, change the EGR first, or fit a blanking plate.... (handy hint, if you're a member of the AA they carry universal ones...if you know of someone with a platinum account at lloyds, they'll come out to you at home..."my car isn't starting, i think its' the egr" they'll fit a blanking plate and you can see what happens!

You may get an Engine management light come on...but if it works and starts and runs fine, you'll know what the problem is!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for the suggestions, to answer the questions so far.

The garage wanting to replace all injectors was an Alfa specialist. I'm just not confident enough in their 'guess' that it's the injectors to spend £1000 especially since I've had the car on the ecuscan at home and all injectors adjustments are within +\-0.5 and all respond in line as/expected the throttle increases.

Just want to rule out everything else first!

The EGR desired and actual position also both seem to be with .1/2 mm of each other, so sort suggest it's not sticking. I do have a blanking plate and will fit it if crank sensor doesn't resolve.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Are there any guides/how to for doing the EGR on the 2.0. All that I've seen and read suggests its different from the 19./2.4 and is integrated into the manifold.

I'm handy with the spanners, but it'd be nice to have a reference/common pitfalls etc
 

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Are there any guides/how to for doing the EGR on the 2.0. All that I've seen and read suggests its different from the 19./2.4 and is integrated into the manifold.

I'm handy with the spanners, but it'd be nice to have a reference/common pitfalls etc
from what I can remember from other posts, the 2.0 EGR is in a difficult place, but it literally a bolt off bolt back on job, on the 2.4, it's literally 4 bolts!

I hope for your sake it's not the injectors as it's an expensive fix!
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Me either, already had one done by the specialist and cost me a small fortune, hence not really wanting to shell out out for 3 more! Will post the ecuscan graphs later, but in pretty confident they're fine!
 

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Thanks for the suggestions, to answer the questions so far.

The garage wanting to replace all injectors was an Alfa specialist. I'm just not confident enough in their 'guess' that it's the injectors to spend £1000 especially since I've had the car on the ecuscan at home and all injectors adjustments are within +\-0.5 and all respond in line as/expected the throttle increases.

Just want to rule out everything else first!

The EGR desired and actual position also both seem to be with .1/2 mm of each other, so sort suggest it's not sticking. I do have a blanking plate and will fit it if crank sensor doesn't resolve.
Don't replace the injectors! Send them off to be reconditioned by a bosch diesel specialist. Plenty of companies do it for a fraction of the cost to replace. PFjones is one, but tones more.
 

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I bet the injector they removed from your car was recon'd and sold on.

Sounds like your car is struggling to breath or maybe even not getting enough fuel pressure. So i second the suggestions about the EGR, other things could be the MAF and there is the DPF, may be worth doing a forced regen.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Don't replace the injectors! Send them off to be reconditioned by a bosch diesel specialist. Plenty of companies do it for a fraction of the cost to replace. PFjones is one, but tones more.
Am I correct to assume injectors can also be 'tested' to verify if they're at fault or not?
I just struggle with the idea that all have simultaneously failed unless something something bad had gone through it??
 

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You are correct, any good injector specialist, will ultrasonically clean and flow test your injectors, telling you whether or not they are knackered or not!
 

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Am I correct to assume injectors can also be 'tested' to verify if they're at fault or not?
I just struggle with the idea that all have simultaneously failed unless something something bad had gone through it??
Yes all diesel specialists test and rebuild/recondition the injectors if required. If they don't need to be reconditioned then they just charge your for testing them. But you need to remove the injectors and post them off, so your car is off the road for a few days.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I bet the injector they removed from your car was recon'd and sold on.

Sounds like your car is struggling to breath or maybe even not getting enough fuel pressure. So i second the suggestions about the EGR, other things could be the MAF and there is the DPF, may be worth doing a forced regen.
Can an stuck EGR cause stalling though, I've heard of performance issues, hesitation, lack of power, but not actually killing the engine.
 

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From my own experience my faulty egr caused me starting and stalling issues intermittently aswell as hesitation and no low down grunt. Once replaced all issues dissapeared.
 
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