Alfa Romeo Forum banner

1 - 20 of 30 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi All,

Hoping someone can give me some advice..

I bought my Alfa back in February.. Its a car I've wanted for a long time and finally decided to take the plunge:paranoid:

its a 159 Ti 2.4 JTDM :thumbup: bought from western Alfa in Edinburgh

So, it ran fine for around a month before I had my first problem, two wheel bearings.. easily fixed and as I had a warranty it didn't cost me anything..

Around a month ago I had a warning that the glow plugs were finished.. This was a bit of a relief since she's been a bit smokey on startup and very rough running...

I took it into my local specialist (who I'd been told about through some work contacts), and sorted the glow plugs.. unfortunately as these are classed as serviceable they weren't covered by the warranty, and neither was the fuel filter which I had changed after I discovered that the existing one was about 3 years old (shoddy alfa services :( ).. so that was my first £200..

at the time the mechanic mentioned that he thought she was running a bit rough, and suggested I get the injectors tested, which I did on a later visit. They were sent away for burst testing, and two were found to be faulting on the upper and lower limits. They were refurbished, and the other 3 re-calibrated then placed back in the car. It was at this point the fuel rail sprung a leak. I went to see this for myself, and sure enough just above the fixing on pipe 2, fuel was spurting out, which i found strange.. After several toos and fros to the warranty company they finally authorized the purchase of the rail and pipes, which were fitted.. I finally had my car back :D, although £1400 down.. I'm currently in the process of trying to get most of this back through the warranty company..

its now two weeks later, and still on startup a large plume of blue smoke emits on ignition, and initially she's very rough.. only lasts maybe half a minute and then she's fine, and on the roads she's no problem..

considering £1400 has been spent on the engine I'd expect some improvement, but I can honestly say she's running pretty much exactly the same as before she went in for the glo plugs to be replaced..

so, any ideas on the what the cause on the blue smoke/rough running on startup (considering whats been done)

and, does this garage sound a bit fishy? or am i being paranoid:paranoid:

I'm very wary of mechanics, so possibly being a little over cautious..

sorry for the essay, and to close.. despite the issues I absolutely love my 159 :D

thanks!

Sean M
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,125 Posts
Hi there,
There are stacks of threads on here about smoky/rough running, you'll find a vast array of different suggestions. You could ask the garage you use or bought from if the software needs updating, that helps poor starting.
I was really surprised how much 'Diesel Rhino' additive helped rid my car of a smoky start, for the money, it's worth a try. If you've a 210hp model, you might want to check it has the correct length Beru plugs- plenty of threads about this too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
85 Posts
Could well be the manifold that's knackered (my brera had this, after everyone said it was the injectors), that set me back about £1000.
So far had about £3000 spent on it since I bought it in October last year. From near Edinburgh too!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Great :)

thanks all.. yes I'll keep looking.. seen suggestions about EGR, so thats my next port of call.. I have also tried Rhino, and that did help a little.. perhaps I didn't put in enough on my last fill..

Really hope my manifold is ok, another £1000 would make me cry:alien:

Thanks All..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
395 Posts
Blue smoke can only be caused by one thing - oil.
Glow plugs, manifold, diesel rhino or any other snake oil additive will not fix it.
There are 4 potential sources of oil getting into the combustion chamber: valve guides, turbo, crankcase breather, rings.
All of those are either very expensive to repair and are repaired by replacing the component with new/recon one and very expensive to repair (turbo, valve guides, rings), or are quite normal (crankcase breather).

Rough running on startup might be unrelated to the above though.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Could well be the manifold that's knackered (my brera had this, after everyone said it was the injectors), that set me back about £1000.
So far had about £3000 spent on it since I bought it in October last year. From near Edinburgh too!
could ask what exactly was wrong with your manifold ??

just i'll get mine checked out next time i'm near the garage.. I'm assuming you would of needed a new fuel rail/pipes as well??
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,755 Posts
If it is a 'big' could of smoke on start up, but fine the rest of the time, have at look at the turbo, the bearings are known to give up and leak a load.


Any spelling/ grammatical errors are purely there to annoy!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,620 Posts
I sometimes get a big puff of blue smoke on startup, especially if i press the start button too quick, this may also be a weak battery im told (which i think mine is)

my engine never uses oil

i dont think this engine is particularly happy during cold starts and makes a lot of noise
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
85 Posts
The car was running really rough, starting badly, coughing a bit and had a bit of a misfire.
I was told it would be the injectors but when they looked at it the manifold was totally gummed up with gunk, soot etc.
It cost about 1000 but 150 odd of that was getting the injectors checked at the same time, I used a bosche specialist in white craig near Dalkeith. They blanked they egr for me at the same time and then I got CM garage in East Kilbride to remap and remove the dpf, runs like a different car now but is really smokey from a cold start. After that it goes like a train!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Cool..

Was thinking of getting the EGR blanked, and I am gonna get that checked out!

Quick one.. whats your average MPG? i'm getting around 33, and just wondering if this is normal?

Thanks:thumbup:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,620 Posts
blanking the egr valve is perhaps the est thing you can do to this engine.

doing 70 miles a day i get around 480 miles per tank full with my 2.4, with blanked egr, remapped and dpf appears to be empty
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
blanking the egr valve is perhaps the est thing you can do to this engine.

doing 70 miles a day i get around 480 miles per tank full with my 2.4, with blanked egr, remapped and dpf appears to be empty
Blimey! Thats much better than me.. i do around 16-20 miles a day (more on the week-end), and i'm getting around 360 miles per tank :(

Looks like I'll be checking her in for a DPF bypass and an EGR blank off :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
85 Posts
I just got the dpf removed, means I can always put it back on, the garage that removed will do my mot so no issues there.
Not sure what I'm getting, maybe 33 or so, not great really
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
261 Posts
Hi All,

Hoping someone can give me some advice..

I bought my Alfa back in February.. Its a car I've wanted for a long time and finally decided to take the plunge:paranoid:

its a 159 Ti 2.4 JTDM :thumbup: bought from western Alfa in Edinburgh

So, it ran fine for around a month before I had my first problem, two wheel bearings.. easily fixed and as I had a warranty it didn't cost me anything..

Around a month ago I had a warning that the glow plugs were finished.. This was a bit of a relief since she's been a bit smokey on startup and very rough running...

I took it into my local specialist (who I'd been told about through some work contacts), and sorted the glow plugs.. unfortunately as these are classed as serviceable they weren't covered by the warranty, and neither was the fuel filter which I had changed after I discovered that the existing one was about 3 years old (shoddy alfa services :( ).. so that was my first £200..

at the time the mechanic mentioned that he thought she was running a bit rough, and suggested I get the injectors tested, which I did on a later visit. They were sent away for burst testing, and two were found to be faulting on the upper and lower limits. They were refurbished, and the other 3 re-calibrated then placed back in the car. It was at this point the fuel rail sprung a leak. I went to see this for myself, and sure enough just above the fixing on pipe 2, fuel was spurting out, which i found strange.. After several toos and fros to the warranty company they finally authorized the purchase of the rail and pipes, which were fitted.. I finally had my car back :D, although £1400 down.. I'm currently in the process of trying to get most of this back through the warranty company..

its now two weeks later, and still on startup a large plume of blue smoke emits on ignition, and initially she's very rough.. only lasts maybe half a minute and then she's fine, and on the roads she's no problem..

considering £1400 has been spent on the engine I'd expect some improvement, but I can honestly say she's running pretty much exactly the same as before she went in for the glo plugs to be replaced..

so, any ideas on the what the cause on the blue smoke/rough running on startup (considering whats been done)

and, does this garage sound a bit fishy? or am i being paranoid:paranoid:

I'm very wary of mechanics, so possibly being a little over cautious..

sorry for the essay, and to close.. despite the issues I absolutely love my 159 :D

thanks!

Sean M
Hello mate,

Im having similar symptoms with mine. I've also uploaded some videos to YouTube which show the poor cold start and smoke initially.

In summary so far I have:

1.) Had all injectors tested, 2 of them failed and have been refurbished, this helped, but didn't cure my problem.
2.) EGR and Throttle Body cleaned
3.) Software Version checked with Ned at Auto Lusso - Seems my car already has the latest software version which helps with some cold start issues.
4.) All Glow Plugs changed.
5.) Checked injector correction values using multi ecu scan, these are a bit erratic when cold even after injector refurbishment so problem appears to lie elsewhere.

I've got the car booked in this week to be looked at by a local specialist - they suspect the inlet manifold could be badly clogged, or an issue with swirl flaps.

See my thread below:

http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-159-brera-andamp-946-spider/840706-clattery-smoky-159-2-4-jtdm-on-cold-startup.html
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Brilliant! thanks!

Yeah i'll be booking mine in to get the inlet manifold cleaner, and EGR blanked. The only thing i worried about regarding blanking the EGR is that i'll fail the emissions test on the MOT? anyone have experience with this?

I'm also considering a DPF bypass...:paranoid:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Great Read Otis, looks like we've got very similar issues.. also very keen to get to the bottom of it.. the rewards of doing so are waiting for us :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
261 Posts
I'll keep you posted with an update once we've removed the manifold - they seem to get quite sooted up.

Its a big job to remove and clean the intake and its worth changing the cambelt and water pump at the same time so you need to budget for that too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
I find what really helped with smokey and rough starts with mine is to glow the plugs twice before turning on. I wait until it says press brake to start and just push the start button twice with out touching any pedals, and it will begin the ignition process again. Seems to work for me! I pulled my throttle body apart and cleaned it up, made a big difference to rough running. EGR is blanked so no more rubbish is going to enter the manifold.. Make sure you clean the MAP sensor on the manifold too if the EGR is still pumping in muck.
 
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
Top