Alfa Romeo Forum banner

1 - 13 of 13 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,309 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi all

Im repairing the holes on my 156 in the normal place ( rear footwell ) What i want to know is when welding a plate in does the plate have to be 100% seam weld. I ask because my welder is playing up again and is too hot and blows holes unless i lift

Thanks in advance
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
I'm not an MOT tester but I have been in the trade quite a while, I think the wording is excesive corrosion within 30 cm of a seat belt or suspension mount. I believe technically you can have holes in the middle of floor pans and get away with it!

Repairs ought to be seem welded for strength but a lot of people disguise bad welding or even no welding with well crafted filler and get away with it (not that I condone that sort of thing).

If you are having issues blowing holes, try and do really short runs like 1 cm or less at a time and leave to cool before going back.

Good luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
30,221 Posts
I'm not an MOT tester but I have been in the trade quite a while, I think the wording is excessive corrosion within 30 cm of a seat belt or suspension mount. I believe technically you can have holes in the middle of floor pans and get away with it!
Remember the front seatbelts mount on the seats, so the above "within 30cm of" zones include the front seats.
It doesn't leave much of the floorpan outside the 30cm zones.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,309 Posts
Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
This is the rust point and what ive done is just cut out the rust leaving the structure there so ive just got a few circle holes, then ive shaped a plate and welded over the top.

I am going to weld it all the way round but in spot weld style ( weld / stop / move along weld overlapping the weld before ) im sure you know what i mean
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
30,221 Posts
This is the rust point and what ive done is just cut out the rust leaving the structure there so ive just got a few circle holes, then ive shaped a plate and welded over the top.
Is that first pic after you've cut it out or before?
The metal surrounding those holes looks quite bad itself...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,309 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Is that first pic after you've cut it out or before?
The metal surrounding those holes looks quite bad itself...
Thats the 1st pic before the rots been cut out, i took it back to bear metal
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,271 Posts
I'm doing this in August. Hoping it can be pretty shoddy as I am worlds worst welder. I don't think the tester looks too carefully. Depends really on how long you're planning your repair to last.

If you're planning on keeping the car for a few more mots you can buy an entire floorpan from autolusso. I'm just going to put a plate in and hide my mess with as much under seal as will stick. The part of the job that depresses me most is all the prep work. If that second picture is from inside the car you've done the tedious work already. I don't want to go digging too far into my rust as I'm sure I'll find the entire car is rotten. How are you going to cope with the corrigated nature of the original floor? Ideally I'd like to make a flat plate to fit but this doesn't look easy. I just know I'm going to do a slap dash job on this!

Yours looks really bad! How did it get a ticket last year?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,309 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Yours looks really bad! How did it get a ticket last year?
Its been off the road for 2 years its having a full restoration . but i didnt notice it when i got the car as the under seal was still intact it looks bad as ive given it a good poking.

But all is ok now i cleaned the cobwebs from the welder and put a new tip on.

As for shaping it depend on how much you have to cut out , If similar to mine where you cut out the rot and are left with big holes but the floor pan is still joining at the high points.

All i did was shape a sheet a metal and make it a little longer then it needs to be , Then weld one end then shape with a hammer so it bends to the pan shape , then weld that bit in place , and keep moving along until your done. im doing the other foot well today i will take some photos of how i do it maybe it will help :thumbup:
 
  • Like
Reactions: dgmayhead

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,309 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
This is how i shape it . yes it looks messy now but once all is welded i will heat and tidy it up with hammer and block of wood and then rubberise paint it, plus no one will see it but its a sturdy fix.

1st i use heat gun and scrap off the tar blanket
2nd strip to bare metal
3rd weld end of plate and start hammering the shape and weld as i go. just need to invest in a good new welder :yes:

will post finished pic when done
 

Attachments

  • Like
Reactions: dgmayhead

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,271 Posts
I'd be happy with that as a repair it looks really good once shaped. My current welding experience is limited to my garden wheelbarrow which I've been practicing on by cutting to pieces and putting back together with varying degrees of success. I've bought a reactive mask and magnets which both help enormously but it's certainly a skilled job and I'm at the bottom of the learning curve.

What thickness plate is that? I think I may have gone too thick as shaping is proving even more challenging than the welding.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
446 Posts
panels have to be seam welded together where that was the original method of closure. Seam welding however does not have to be completed in one continuous bead or even in one continuous session, sensible heat reduction techniques such as step-back welding would be impossible if this was the case. All the rear footwell panels in the 156 147 and GT have holes punched in them anyway just ahead of the rear seat base lift for the draining of spills and condensation and these are the most common starting points for corrosion in my experience ( your pictures are typical of lots of 156 147 and GtS ) so holes in a panel do not in themselves mean an MOT failure. holes due to corrosion do usually signify serious thinning of the metal in the immediate area, loss of structural strength or safety device anchor point strength and it is this which causes the MOT failure. In short you can have holes but the MOT tester must consider the panel strong enough to do it's intended job, most don't have the time or resources to test this accurately so if there are rusty holes that shouldn't be there its a fail. if there are nice round or rectangular holes with paint around them it probably isn't.
Your pictures show a good degree of enterprise and congrdulations on that but I have to say youl get far better results by shaping the piece first. you need a press, which is fairly cheap from Machine mart but can also be hired for a day from various places and cut some strips of hardwood which you glue and screw to thick quality plywood at the correct intervals for the corrugations in the panel you need to do two of thewse so when placed face to face the strips interlock leaving about a 5mm gap between each interlocking strip. these don't need to be very long at all as the presses available are quite narrow place the steel in between and crush one down on the other then move across and do it again until you have the correct number of corrugations. once that's acheived move along and do another row till you have a long enough piece to cover all the corrosion. tack that on all over and then weld it at in short runs at successive points as far away from the last one as possible,( a bit similar to the way you tighten the bolts of a cylinder head) in order to spread the heat A.M.A.possible.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,309 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Thanks for that Keith i will be ok then with the repairs.

As for metal thickness i think its 20 or 25 gauge .


Well its all done besides sealing it. ive just got to wire brush under the car to rid all the surface rust and then seal it all then its ready to start being put back together.
I will be glad when ive de-rusted it all as its not on the top of my list of favourite jobs even though i have the patents of a saint :paranoid:

i ordered 5 ltrs of hydrocloric acid today so i dont have to wire brush all the rusty nuts and bolts :biglaugh:
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
Top