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Discussion Starter #1
Guys I know this will sound fanciful to you but it is 100% truth.

Parking tickets aren't fines - they aren't a demand for money because it is unlawful for anybody to make this demand of you. Bill of rights 1688 states that you have to be convicted in a court of law to be liable to pay anything.

The things you're sent in the post or have stuck on your windscreen all say 'notice' on them (penalty charge notice etc...) Notice doesn't mean the same as you would normally use it (notice wet paint) - in the law dictionary it means contract.

Look at my attachments thats what I wrote to the penalty tribunal after the council pretended I still had to pay even though I knew I didn't.

If you send the contract back within 3 days with this stuff written at a 45 degree angle in red you are then legally covered so you're not liable to pay anything:-

REFUSAL FOR CAUSE
WITHOUT DISHONOUR
WITHOUT PREJUDICE
WITHOUT RECOURSE
NON-ASSUMPSIT
SERVICE REJECTED

This is the explaination of what this stuff means

PENALTY CHARGE NOTICE (PCN) (FINE) (CONTRACT)
Deception under the threat of a price asked for. A Negotiable Instrument!

REFUSED FOR CAUSE :-
This is a rejection of the contract that affects the result.

WITHOUT DISHONOUR :-
Remaining in honour in contract law while refusing to make any payment.

WITHOUT PREDJUDICE :–
Terminate and dismiss a contract. Nothing said or done is admissible in any trial. Protection from liability which can only be waived by the consent of both parties. You cannot use this document against me in a true court of law.

WITHOUT RECOURSE :–
The act of overturning the application to a person or thing for security or aid and cancel the right to demand payment from the endorser of the original stationary contract of deception i.e. the PCN.

NON-ASSUMPSIT :–
He did not promise. With no promise whatsoever. Denial of action. With no guilt implied.



read this forum:-

Parking Ticket
 

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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Dyclecksik and prowd

Nope - they didnt let me off I'm just not liable to pay. Trust me they don't just cancel appeals because it's too much hassle.

Even if they tried to persue it, it wouldn't get anywhere because legally I did everything I should.

The council doesn't have legally trained people but the penalty tribunal place does. That's why the council ignores everything you send and just sends template letters. They were supposed to get back to me in a month or 2 and they did it in like 5 days.

When I got home after reading the e-mail at work there was a letter waiting for me from the council. The solicitor at the tribunal must have seen I knew my **** and rang them straight away to say 'you're barking up the wrong tree guys'.

Oh by the way the High Court has released a thing talking about the bill of rights saying it isn't a defence because the only reason you need to go to court is to defend yourself but you can do it when appealing this tickets.

THIS IS A MOOT POINT!!! It's irrelevant because they've still just sent you a contract which you can refuse as usual.

Bill of rights isn't a defence - that's correct.
Bill of rights is the reason they send you a contract though which you can refuse versus an invoice which is the only way they can DEMAND money.
 
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System here is easier.

You just wait until a local election and the mayor announces an
amnesty on unpaid fines, or you have to pay them when you sell the car.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
YEP!

They're completely unenforceable - just ignore those.

If you don't create joinder you're not liable.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Car parks - double yellows etc..... works for all.

Pretty sure I'm gonna get a speeding ticket soon - will do the same with that and let you know what happens.

What they send you in the post:-

Notice of intended prosecution

Contract (please agree!) that we can prosecute.
 

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Pretty sure I'm gonna get a speeding ticket soon - will do the same with that and let you know what happens.
The difference though is that whilst parking was decriminalised, speeding is still a crime. All that will happen is that you then get a summons and end up in court ( bigger fine, victim levy and more points? ).
 

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love it, makes perfect sense to me, but might not be the safest thing to use against local authority fines http://www.lawfulrebellion.org/2009/12/18/toolbox-stop-taking-the-pcn/

I will try it on the horrible people that run MK parking next time they ticket me in an empty car park with a ticket that is 3 minutes expired (18:57pm) just 1 second before the CP becomes free at 19:00....

sadly I can't see it working for a speeding fine - that is an absolute offence in statute and carry statutory penalties, and they are doing you a favour letting you pay and take points. You don't have to agree, you are welcome to go to Court and pay £1000 and get double points...

you need other defences for speeding, or don't speed.
 

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Is this why alot of private parking firms clamps/remove your car as quickly a possible because they know if you have some common sense you will rip up their parking ticket and throw it in the bin.

To the OP, I really can't read your hand writing, maybe they gave up because they couldn't either and thought there were 100 suckers waiting to pay without arguing.
 

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Just in case anybody was going to rely on this it should be pointed out that it's complete tosh. Parking tickets (on public land) are not contracts, the local authority is entitled to issue parking tickets by powers granted under statute. For what happens if you fail to pay see here: http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/t_parking_fines.pdf
If you make enough fuss they may well decide it's not worth the trouble of going to court, but don't for one minute think they don't have the power to if they want.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Just in case anybody was going to rely on this it should be pointed out that it's complete tosh. Parking tickets (on public land) are not contracts, the local authority is entitled to issue parking tickets by powers granted under statute. For what happens if you fail to pay see here: http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/t_parking_fines.pdf
If you make enough fuss they may well decide it's not worth the trouble of going to court, but don't for one minute think they don't have the power to if they want.
Mate - you don't know what you're talking about. You've put a link from a government website up. Of course they're going to tell you it's legal.

I'm not trying to be funny but take it from someone who has experience.

It's all in the wording. Everything they try to give you is a contract because 'Notice' is what they title each document. In law dictionaries:- notice = contract. As long as you return a contract within 3 days it's cancelled. It's that simpole

I didn't make any fuss - this argument holds no water. All they had to do was carry on sending nasty intimidating template letters as usual but they literally called the dogs off within a week. To be honest they'd prefer to drag it out to make the price higher.

Read what I wrote to them - All laws have a hieracrhy - Constitutional statutes follow constitutional rights. The former cannot repeal the latter unless you sign away your rights somehow (in a contract) Laws can only give rights. They cannot take rights away.

You're straight up completely wrong. 100%

You don't want to hear it but it's true.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Just in case anybody was going to rely on this it should be pointed out that it's complete tosh. Parking tickets (on public land) are not contracts, the local authority is entitled to issue parking tickets by powers granted under statute. For what happens if you fail to pay see here: http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/t_parking_fines.pdf
If you make enough fuss they may well decide it's not worth the trouble of going to court, but don't for one minute think they don't have the power to if they want.
Also, they're not fines!!!!!!

That website you've linked to is dangerous. You cannot be fined unless you go to court. You waive this right by contracting with them.

They have the 'power' to issue what they want but at the end of the day it's still just a contract.

What you go to court for is not fulfilling your end of a contract that you've tacitly agreed to by ignoring or by trying to argue with them and contracting directly. In my case I was nowhere near court as they still had a bunch of letters and price hikes yet to threaten me with, and as soon as someone legally trained at the tribunal (just retarded administrators at the counil sending out template letters) had seen what I'd written they cancelled everything so fast - They were sposed to take a month or two.

If they were to fine you for the actual act of parking or whatever nonsense it is there has to be an injured party for a start. And they can only fine for damages/loss of earnings. This is either nothing or the cost of an extra ticket etc...

It's not economically viable for them to take people to court to pay a £1 fine each time.

It's a massive money maker because they can set whatever price the way that they do it.

I don't know how else to say it. Please everyone wake up and stop paying. Have faith, don't let them intimidate you.
 

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So, you're saying it's perfectly OK to park on double yellow lines, etc, and who cares about the consequences or impact on others?
 

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Leg - this is brilliant, I always admire those that check the facts and stand up to authority. If what you are saying is correct and that councils have been deliberately using threatening documents to get you to pay a fine for a contract that is non-enforceable (without your tacit agreement), then you should make it much more widely known than just on this website. Cheers for your enlightenment!
 

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Discussion Starter #16
So, you're saying it's perfectly OK to park on double yellow lines, etc, and who cares about the consequences or impact on others?
No.

Don't behave like a ********. The world needs good people.

However, there's yellow lines everywhere where there's no need, where you're causing no obstruction it's just an excuse to attempt to extort money from people.

I wouldn't park on yellow lines at traffic lights because I would hold up traffic, maybe cause an accident and also probably get my car crashed into.

On a sidestreet with no traffic causing no obstruction, I would.

I don't need nonsense and being treated like a **** to make me behave appropriately.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Leg - this is brilliant, I always admire those that check the facts and stand up to authority. If what you are saying is correct and that councils have been deliberately using threatening documents to get you to pay a fine for a contract that is non-enforceable (without your tacit agreement), then you should make it much more widely known than just on this website. Cheers for your enlightenment!
Mate - this stuff is everywhere.

Look it all up - don't just take my word I learnt it off other people.

I've got my dad fighting all types of tickets at the minute he thought it was too good to be true until he'd seen what I did and how I got on.

People forget that just because someone says something or tries to make it appear a certain way doesn't make it so.
 
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What about parking on the zebra crossing zig-zags?

:confused:

Could you post some more links on where you got all this info LofL? :)
 

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No.

Don't behave like a ********. The world needs good people.

However, there's yellow lines everywhere where there's no need, where you're causing no obstruction it's just an excuse to attempt to extort money from people.
That's your opinion, not fact.


I don't need nonsense and being treated like a **** to make me behave appropriately.
Does your definition of "appropriately" include dangerous driving, e.g. speeding in a built up area so you can "defend" another "fine"?

Now, perhaps you are a perfectly sensible person who is just sharing this "advice", but if someone reads your post who is not as "smart" as you, they may take your comments to believe that it is perfectly acceptable to park on double yellow lines outside an ambulance station, or that driving at 60mph past a school is also OK - because you said it was.
How long before one of them phones up one of the sleazy lawyers that advertise on TV, who then quotes you in their defence?


...or am I just nuts, and should we all follow your example and park where we think it's OK to park, and drive at the speeds we want to?
 

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Mate - this stuff is everywhere.

Look it all up - don't just take my word I learnt it off other people.

I've got my dad fighting all types of tickets at the minute he thought it was too good to be true until he'd seen what I did and how I got on.

People forget that just because someone says something or tries to make it appear a certain way doesn't make it so.

Is your Dad some sort of " serial penalty parker " !!

Interesting post discussion

Alan
 
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