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Most of our Alfas use R134a. I wonder if its just new cars it is being phased out in, or if they will prevent old A/C systems being gassed with R134a at some point?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I would think its just new cars. I cant imagine the systems are compatible with a totally different gas
 

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If the coolant is no longer allowed in new cars, the German approvals agency should not have issued the type approval. Whether the replacement is "as safe" or not doesn't come into it; the old refrigerant is not permitted for new cars under the EU type approval laws.

This isn't a new ban: A quick search for R134a shows the cut off for new approvals was 2011. Production of existing models that use R134a is allowed until 2017; after that no car produced in the EU is allowed to use it at all.

Next, I expect the upstanding men and women of Mercedes's competitors to follow the example of Peugeo France and take a stand against this evil and secure bans in other countries...
 

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****ing French, they've got the best land on europe the cheapest energy and tasty breakfasts and cos of that think they can do anything, right, im boycotting croissants, pain au chocolat and bonne maman strawberry Jam as of now :rant:
 

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They use R134a still. I only know this from Toyota.. They were supposed to be using the new gas in the new prius and a few other models including the lexus range. Due to shortages they went with R134a and only the LS model has the newer gas if my memory serves me. At my work we have a new AC machine for the new gas but we dont have any gas and toyota only provide it as a last resort.
 

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Sounds like great stuff to put in systems known for leakage problems...

I'd expect people in the know to start stashing R134a in quantity before the price starts to rise, as has happened with R22 in static commercial applications.

There is still plenty of R12 out there too, and its best not to think about how its being disposed of if gas agents won't take the bottles back!
 

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Sounds like great stuff to put in systems known for leakage problems...

I'd expect people in the know to start stashing R134a in quantity before the price starts to rise, as has happened with R22 in static commercial applications.

There is still plenty of R12 out there too, and its best not to think about how its being disposed of if gas agents won't take the bottles back!
I dont think R134a will rise by much as it has been known for a while now that it will be phased out eventually and the supply doesnt seem to have an issue considering all modern cars are using it.
R12 is illegal is it not? and cars with it are retrofitted with systems fit for R134a. There are companies that collect R12 to dispose of.
 

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If the coolant is no longer allowed in new cars, the German approvals agency should not have issued the type approval. Whether the replacement is "as safe" or not doesn't come into it; the old refrigerant is not permitted for new cars under the EU type approval laws.
I think the point is that the cars have been type approved only for the new refrigerant, but Merc has filled them with the old stuff. So they are not meeting their own type approval. Merc's reasoning for this is that the new refrigerant is less safe.. There are some scary reports out there about the new refrigerant.


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Of course, this could just have more to do with propping up the ailing French car industry than any real concern for the planet ......... oh those little tinkers, the French.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Its an EU rule, if they dont like it they should get it changed.

Germany recently said Britain could not "cherry pick" the bits of the EU it wanted and those it did not. Hmmmm :p;)
 

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Germany recently said Britain could not "cherry pick" the bits of the EU it wanted and those it did not. Hmmmm :p;)
I found that comment from Germany particularly curious given that we're probably one of the very few EU Countries that tends to abide by EU rules. The French particularly have never given a monkeys about adhering to something that they don't want.

Can you imagine France putting up with Abu Qatada for as long as the UK did, for example? Not a chance! Germany schemes their way out of anything that doesn't suit, too. The only reason I have slightly more time for them is their tax payers are probably getting an even worse deal than ours, by being made to keep the Euro Zone afloat.
 

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More interestingly that report states they would remove any car 'currently' on the road, could be a lot of drivers stung on that one!


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I found that comment from Germany particularly curious given that we're probably one of the very few EU Countries that tends to abide by EU rules. The French particularly have never given a monkeys about adhering to something that they don't want.

Can you imagine France putting up with Abu Qatada for as long as the UK did, for example? Not a chance! Germany schemes their way out of anything that doesn't suit, too. The only reason I have slightly more time for them is their tax payers are probably getting an even worse deal than ours, by being made to keep the Euro Zone afloat.
Exactly. VW law springs to mind. Highly illegal, still in force
 
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