Alfa Romeo Forum banner

1 - 20 of 59 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,536 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I can't post a link but Lisa pointed out an article in todays paper and the guy is called Adrian, looks a dead ringer so I guess it might be.

Him or not it is a disgraceful story of political correctness and stifling free speech and fairly expressed personal opinion. For privately, if perhaps naively on Facebook, explaining his personal disagreement with gay marriages in churches, his employer, a housing trust or something - having been told by a "friend" - demoted him, cut his pay by about a third, and gave a final written warning for not thinking correctly.

Total disgrace given the reported nature of his comments.


Mr D if it is you, you have my support. And that does not make me anti gay if anyone is impetuous enough to assume I am!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,236 Posts
Worlds gone bliddy daft I tell thee all.

Sad sad day if a man can't express his thoughts on his PERSONAL web page. His bosses should be lined up and demoted themsleves for having taken leave of their senses. Didn't fascism start off with people telling other people what to think????
 
K

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
That is quite shocking.

It seems that people with christian beliefs are exempt from the protection every other bugger gets in this politically correct world.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,405 Posts
Doesn't that contravene Article 9 of the Human Rights Act:

'Article 9
The freedom of thought, conscience & religion states:

“Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief, in worship, teaching, practice and observance.”

“Freedom to manifest one's religion or beliefs shall be subject only to such limitations as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society in the interests of public safety, for the protection of public order, health or morals, or for the protection of the rights and freedoms of others.”

He's not broken any law has he? That Housing Trust fires everyone that gets caught committing an offence?

Isn't there also some Human Rights legislation about the right to having a private life, or did I just make that up?

I'm in a quandary over this. I'm not a big fan of religion, but it seems some beliefs are more valid than others, but equally there are other places people can get wed aren't there?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,405 Posts
Article 10

Freedom of expression -

1. “Everyone has the right to freedom of expression. This right shall include freedom to hold opinions and to receive and impart information and ideas without interference by public authority and regardless of frontiers. This Article shall not prevent States from requiring the licensing of broadcasting, television or cinema enterprises.”

2. “The exercise of these freedoms, since it carries with it duties and responsibilities, may be subject to such formalities, conditions, restrictions or penalties as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society, in the interests of national security, territorial integrity or public safety, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, for the protection of the reputation or rights of others, for preventing the disclosure of information received in confidence, or for maintaining the authority and impartiality of the judiciary”

I don't see how casting an opinion in a private capacity squares with 'for the protection of the reputation or rights of others'?

It seems he's just been persecuted for having an opinion and voicing it.

I won't be joining FaceBook either. :)

The least FaceBook could do is out all of their users that used their services to organise and conduct the looting spree in the summer. FaceBook want to help? Well just out them then. Easy no?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,405 Posts
It seems a bit off that his accusers are anonymous. Surely there's some scope there for bullying or organised victimisation? Did his accusers have anything to gain by their complaint?

:(

If there was no reference to his employer on his FB profile then I'm not sure that they would have had a case. Hopefully the housing trust gave training and guidance on the out of hours web use by its employees?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,798 Posts
I too believe this anonymity rule is rubbish as you say Monza it gives any idiot with a grudge to cause undue stress and grants vindictive individuals free reign!:rant: If you are going to make a statement against an individual then you should have the guts to put your name to that complaint instead of hiding like a spineless, jealous nobody that they generally are!:rant:

Society gone mad!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,405 Posts
'The proposed new law, on which the Government is consulting, will allow churches to open their doors to gay ceremonies if they wish, although the Church of England is refusing to participate.'

It's not law yet.


But Trust commercial director David Barrow said: ‘The Trust has an equal opportunities policy and Mr Smith’s comments on Facebook, where he identified himself as a Trust employee, went against this policy.

‘We expect employees at all levels to act respectfully. This applies in person and on social media.’

The above taken from the Daily Mail article.

How was it disrespectful? He stated an opinion.

It could be argued that same sex marriage in churches is far more disrespectful to a 'holy book'.

According to legal documents lodged at Manchester County Court, Debbie Gorman, a ‘neighbourhood manager’ also at the meeting, said Mr Smith’s comment could cause offence.

She said she had interpreted it as saying ‘gay people are not as equal as people who are not gay’ and that the comment could be viewed as homophobic.

Mr Corfield said it was not the comment but its potential misinterpretation that was at issue, but still ruled that Mr Smith had committed a serious breach of discipline for which he could be dismissed.

Any text based electronic communication is open to misinterpretation due to the lack of non verbal cues and such a deficiency in such communication has been well documented.

'Somebody could misunderstand'? :confused: Well, it happens doesn't it?

Anybody that offers a different opinion must be shouted down? Anyone that dares mention immigration must be a racist, anyone that doubts the effectiveness of speed cameras must be a foaming at the mouth speed crazed boy or girl racer? It's just another indictment of the dumbed down age and country in which we live.


They need to get hold of the author of the Bible and ask him or her really.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
57,288 Posts
If you're reading this Adrian I'm on your side, disgraceful behaviour on the part of Trafford Council :tut:
 

·
Registered
Giulia Quad, Cayman GT4, Cayenne Turbo
Joined
·
23,458 Posts
Mr D's a great guy. Glad to be one of the few that have met him in person :)

Where have those lucious locks gone Mr D? Haircut?
 
K

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Typical hysterical Daily Mail headline. Cutting through the stadard DM rhetoric, I read the article last night last night and, from what I can see, all Adrian has really done is question why people with no faith want to get married in church. A perfectly valid opinion it seems to me.

Absolutely, utterly and completely ridiculous. That it has a dramatic effect on someone's life in this way is disgraceful.

As for the whistleblower, I have nothing but contempt for such people.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,594 Posts
I emailed the trust, got this reply;


Trust's Comment On Mail on Sunday Article
23 October 2011
In the light of a story in the Mail on Sunday about the disciplinary action taken against one of our employees, the Trust has issued the following statement:

Trafford Housing Trust is a not for profit organisation that provides housing and support services for our customers across all of Trafford's neighbourhoods. We cater for the housing needs of around 20,000 people from diverse backgrounds. We are rated as one of the best 100 public sector employers in the UK by the Sunday Times. We strive to improve housing and communities and our work has been recognised with a Philip Lawrence Award for tackling gangs and gun crime in Old Trafford and a Big Tick award from Business in the community. We were Trafford's Business of the year in 2010.

We employ 360 people from a wide range of backgrounds. We are an equal opportunities employer, have the Two Ticks Disability symbol for our approach to the recruitment and support of disabled people, and have been accredited by the Albert Kennedy Trust and recognised by Investors in People with their Gold and Health and Wellbeing Awards. In June this year, we received the Government-sponsored Customer Service Excellence Award.

At the end of 2010, we updated our Code of Conduct for Employees and provided it to all staff. This version of the Code clearly set out what use employees can make of social networking sites such as Facebook.

Some three months after this new code was issued, Mr Smith, without our authority or knowledge and on a Facebook page that identified him as a manager at Trafford Housing Trust, made comments that were found, by a full disciplinary investigation in which he had Trade Union representation, to be in breach of the company's code of conduct and other policies.

Mr Smith was disciplined for his breach of company policy. The Trust made no comment about any personal beliefs that he holds.

Mr Smith has commenced legal proceedings against the Trust and so it is not appropriate for us to make any comment on the circumstance of this particular case other than to say that the Trust will vigorously defend its position.

Contact Us

Email here or call on 0300 777 7777
Old Trafford Masterplan
New developments
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
515 Posts
The world truly has gone mad. All of this "Political Correctness" is a load of old nonsense. I could use stronger words, but i fear the Mods would demote me from this site... that's another story.

I fully agree that we all have the right to a freedom of speech and belief. I'm on your side Mr D. I do not see how the trust can enforce their "code of conduct" outside of their business. It was a private comment and I do not see how it could have been taken offensively. A lot of people in this country have the same perspective on that very matter, especially the ... older mature... generation.
Yet again, i suspect it's one or two little "do-gooders" who have gone to daddy and told tales.
I think that we, as a country, should have the right to face our accusers. Just as they do over in the states. I disagree with the anonymity - it shows plain cowardice.
 
1 - 20 of 59 Posts
Top