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Discussion Starter #1
Fast Driver over a lap,Yes.
But he does seem to drag Teams down.
Williams had untold bad luck while he drove for them,he left and there has definitely been an upturn.Joined Red Bull who should be on the up but it just seems to have come to nothing.
 

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Fast Driver over a lap,Yes.
But he does seem to drag Teams down.
Williams had untold bad luck while he drove for them,he left and there has definitely been an upturn.Joined Red Bull who should be on the up but it just seems to have come to nothing.
Do you work for his PR company by any chance :lol: :D
 

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Hmm...

Red Bull's reliability for the 2007 car (the first one Adrian Newey has had any significant input into) has taken a turn for the worse. This years McLaren (the first in recent years that Newey had no hand in) has been their most reliable for years.
 

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Newey designed the best cars in the late 80s/early-late 90s, but not in the 00s. The RB Renault is good, but not good enough. You can be the best, but can't stay the best forever.

McLaren's problems in the past few years was down to bad engine design IMO, not a Newey issue?

As to Mark Webber. He's a good fast driver, but has a habit of going to the right teams at the wrong time! Williams will get back to their glory days but it'll take a while.
 

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McLaren's problems in the past few years was down to bad engine design IMO, not a Newey issue?
Probably true, but I doubt we'll ever know whether they were engine problems per se, or engine problems due to packaging constraints (too hot, too much vibration, whatever).

I'm sure I read that Newey's move to Red Bull was conditional on them getting the Renault engines, as he felt he'd be able to package them better than the Ferrari units which (I think) run hotter.

To be honest, I'm not really suggesting he brought unreliability with him, it was more just a rejoinder to the idea that Webber is able to bring whole teams to their knees.

I think Webber and DC are well matched at Red Bull, and are probably a good option for the team - they're quick enough to grab a few points when they're on offer, they're experienced enough not to throw it off the track too often, they know that sulking when it's going wrong doesn't help, and I suspect they're grateful enough to still be in F1 that they likely won't be wasting much effort looking to other teams for a better deal.
 

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Wel as far as I can see, the 'bad luck' at Red bull seems to be Shared...Webber one race, DC the next! ....... ;)
 

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Newy pushes the boundaries of F1 design and as such teams he has worked for endure their fair share of unreliability. John Barnard designed cars had the same problem until the designers (and the engineers) sorted it out.

I don't think MW is the new Schumi as some have suggested however the Jaguar team he drove for (which is now RB) held him in high regard and his engineers and mechanics loved him as he became a focal point for the team.

Lets give Newey a year and Webber a year and then judge but to be honest he won't ever win a WC IMHO.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Wel as far as I can see, the 'bad luck' at Red bull seems to be Shared...Webber one race, DC the next! ....... ;)
That's My point,the Bad luck came with webber. Red Bull were on the way up and although I Never thought they would suddenly be Championship contenders it did look like with Renault engines,Newey Design,plenty of money they would move up the pecking order.

Newey has been there seen it won it,but all Webber has done is failed to deliver.
 

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T it did look like with Renault engines,Newey Design,plenty of money they would move up the pecking order.
To look good on paper doesn't mean anything. It doesn't guarantee success. And it is not bad luck if you can't get your reliability(lack of it) sorted out. Williams had completely unreliable cars and RedBull can not sort out their gearbox/hydraulics problems. Honda have a winging pom in the car. Does that mean HE brings bad luck??? And he wanted to go to Williams for a while:)
 

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Discussion Starter #10
So your saying He's not Unlucky.:D
 
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I think MW (and others) are suffering a mid-field crisis.

What looked like a career with lots of silverware attached is beginning to look a little like a career of nearly finishing in the points. We'd all get hacked off with that. I'm sure the moneys a nice compensation, but they'd all like a podium or a win, and not just Louise Goodman pointing her mike in their face and saying "How do you feel about not finishing another race Mark"... (don't get me wrong I could happily cuddle up to Louise Goodman if I was pushed:D :D )

I bet they all hate Lewis Hamilton....well you would woudn't you;) ;)
I bet Jenson Button sticks pins in a Lewis Hamilton doll. But hasn't he livened it all up a bit...terrific:D

AlfaLincs
 

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So your saying He's not Unlucky.:D
Luck has nothing to do with reliability....if the teams are not competent to provide him with a reliable and competitive car then he can't do anything about it except hope for improvement and keep positive which must be hard.

His path to F1 was long and hard but he achieved his dream and i'm sure he'll say that it is not because of good luck but because of bloody hard work and determination.
 

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He's had a rough trot with unreliable cars but I think he's had plenty of opportunity (when his car is running) to impress....and has never really delivered.

The sentiment here in Australia (from Aussie media especially) is that he's the most unlucky bloke ever, and that he would be wildly successful if only his car would work, and while I see where they're coming from I really don't think he's got the goods to make it big time.
 

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The sentiment here in Australia (from Aussie media especially) is that he's the most unlucky bloke ever, and that he would be wildly successful if only his car would work, and while I see where they're coming from I really don't think he's got the goods to make it big time.
You are right about the very unlucky part in the media but I've never read anything close to 'wildly successful if he has a good car' in the media. My view is that he will never get a fast/reliable car and he is getting older as well.The only thing i'm sure of is that he was able to beat his team mates.
 

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I hope Webber gets some good luck soon, or he too might become the forgotten man of F1. I wonder if he regrets leaving Williams at the moment, as they seem more competitive than RBR. Webber and Button have a lot in common...I do remember him winning the F3000 race at Silverstone in the rain, and was lucky enough to get his autograph afterwards - he's a top bloke :)
 
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