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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all! I'm from España ( Spain ) and two weeks ago i have purchased a beautiful 916 24v.

Mine is from 3/99 and it has Euro 2 compliant ( 220hp unit, 162KW). I love that engine and that beautiful car too ( it's a dream accomplished :) )

I love to touch engines, ever engine i haved, i performed ( specially 1.8 and 2.2 Opel 16v engines)

I read a lot of the Busso engine, and i discovered the most powerful OEM busso 3.0 engine was in the 164 QV ( reaching 232hp ) I searched and searched but without any result, only a few comment that the difference between the 220hp and the QV is the bigger inlet pipes. But i don't know that is true.

Anyone can leave me a hand with that deal??


I like to make a big project with my Gtv, but stage by stage and month per month ( lot of €€€€ cost the pieces hehe)

I have in mind, buy the piece of make that 12hp gain, mount a good sport filter ( BMC CDA i'm looking for) and a chipping when the engine have already done the chain belt, and all the liquids, and the Selenia 10w60 filled inside.

The final stage of my project is the Compressor, but it stills stop for a year or 2 too ;)


Sorry for my bad :( english, a lot of time without practicing it :S


Any help is welcomed.

Thanks!!
 

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Discussion Starter #2
No one? I used fiat E per to search, but i'm not an expert of that kind of program and i don't see the dismemebering of one engine an the other :S

First time i think in the cat. but that two are catalissated.

a youtube gtv fan guy, named alanq4 performed his 3.0 V6 giving an impressive acceleration, he related a few mods it have ( 164 V6 exhaust manifolds without precat, lightened flywheel, kevlar clutch, Q2, cold air intake, and " some minor mods") I don't see any real hp gain with this mods, "cold air intake"? when y putted in BMC CDA with silicon hoses, and Ram Intake, i win 9 hp, putting kevlar, q2, and a manifols that i have already mounted, don't give u extra hp, improved acceleration yes, but not ( at least over 260hp...)?? without eletronics.

I know that the 3.2 bottom end is 100% compatible with my engine, and transform it in the GTA 3.2 engine, but my engine only have 86k km and i don't really watching that mod.

If anyone know any thing about it, please comment me.

Thanks
 

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You can follow Alan's work on the GTV here: http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/motoring-images/137704-my-gran-turismo-veloce-6c.html
Now, I'm no expert, but i think the difference is indeed in the missing cats (see here: http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/motoring-images/137704-my-gran-turismo-veloce-6c-2.html#post2377083) and (maybe) in the ECU (since it's running with no cats).
Also, from what i've read, a cold air intake wouldn't do much since the real limitation in the intake seems to be the plenum (do a research in the tuning area, I'm sure you will find alot of interesting threads).
Now, regarding a possible remap, I'm not sure what options you have in Spain, but since you're not so far away from Netherlands, you could try and get in contact with these guys: Home - Squadra Tuning
 

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Thanks ALXege for the help. I readed all the 29 pages of Alan's project, and I so impressed what that guy can do :O. A lot of things i need to be done, but it seems that the 916 is a great car :)
 

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De-cat and a remapped 3.0 GTV will give you the same if not more power than the 164.
Inlet runners on all the post 1996 3.0 and 3.2 24v are the same so no need to change them.
Things to do on a 3.0 to make more power without breaking the bank or sacrificing drivability or reliability.

1. Proper service including cam belt, tensioner and idlers.
2. Replace inlet cam with 3.2 (GTA) cams. (Preferably while doing the cam belt change).
3. Remove the cats
4. 3.2 (GTA) flywheel and clutch. 2.5 156 flywheel will also work.
5. Q2 dif.
6. Replacement air filter with the type that fits in the oe air box K&N or similar.
7. New shocks. Koni o0r similar
8. Powerflex suspension bushes.
9. Better brake pads with proper brake fluid.

With all of this done you will have a fast reliable 3.0GTV.
 

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De-cat and a remapped 3.0 GTV will give you the same if not more power than the 164.
Inlet runners on all the post 1996 3.0 and 3.2 24v are the same so no need to change them.
Things to do on a 3.0 to make more power without breaking the bank or sacrificing drivability or reliability.

1. Proper service including cam belt, tensioner and idlers.
2. Replace inlet cam with 3.2 (GTA) cams. (Preferably while doing the cam belt change).
3. Remove the cats
4. 3.2 (GTA) flywheel and clutch. 2.5 156 flywheel will also work.
5. Q2 dif.
6. Replacement air filter with the type that fits in the oe air box K&N or similar.
7. New shocks. Koni o0r similar
8. Powerflex suspension bushes.
9. Better brake pads with proper brake fluid.

With all of this done you will have a fast reliable 3.0GTV.
this is what process im going thru ;):thumbs::thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
 

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It is a well tested and documented process with guaranteed results.

If you need a bit more we re profile the outlet cam so that it is the same as the 3.2 inlet as well and it works.
Replacing the oe head gaskets with 1mm gaskets will raise the cr to just under 11.1 for some added punch and economy.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Lot of thanks turbonutters!

Only one question ( for the moment heheh :) )

Why an K&N in the OEM box??? why not a BMC CDA or similar carbon dynamic airbox? ( it cost's 200€ but in Opel, it gain's too much, in Alfa not? or for example the horsepower gain is minimal than the K&N OEM box and the money spend will no satisfied the hp gain??

I putted your info in my notes heheh, i like the idea of the cams :)

( In my astra GSI16v i putted in Cat Cams 258º and the power gain, and punch gain in very high rpm was too noticeable :) )
 

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It is a well tested and documented process with guaranteed results.

If you need a bit more we re profile the outlet cam so that it is the same as the 3.2 inlet as well and it works.
Replacing the oe head gaskets with 1mm gaskets will raise the cr to just under 11.1 for some added punch and economy.
Anybody know where to 1mm head gaskets in UK? If you fit these is there a need to run on super unleaded??
 

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Lot of thanks turbonutters!

Only one question ( for the moment heheh :) )

Why an K&N in the OEM box??? why not a BMC CDA or similar carbon dynamic airbox? ( it cost's 200€ but in Opel, it gain's too much, in Alfa not? or for example the horsepower gain is minimal than the K&N OEM box and the money spend will no satisfied the hp gain??

I putted your info in my notes heheh, i like the idea of the cams :)

( In my astra GSI16v i putted in Cat Cams 258º and the power gain, and punch gain in very high rpm was too noticeable :) )
:thumbs:
The Astra had an excuse for an air cleaner and the GTV’s oe air cleaner have 5 times the filter surface of a cda id not more.
On a ts 147 a cda could help but on a 156 or GTV you are wasting your time a replacement filter works better.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks again man ;) The OEM filter remember me the filter of the big-old vans too big and cylindric hehe.

I buy K&N then ! :thumbs:

I read in spanish alfa forums that the OEM brake system ( 305mm with OEM pads, and rear 240) are very bad, I noticed (in my car) that when i brake the steering vibrates a lot and when i come to 220 kmh to 80 when i go to 140 the car don't brake.

I change all the system but i question that if it's necessary ( they use that) to pick up the GTA 147 brake system ( 330mm front discs, etc) or with my experience in Opel putting a good disk and a good pad, i make the brake much better?

I think ebc grooved and drilled discs front in std diam 305, ebc yellowstuff front, and ebc oem disc rear and ebc redstuff, with a good brake oil ( dot 5.1)

Is a good solution? or I only see the 147 GTA front brakes as a only option to brake hard and well??

( sorry again for my bad english)
 

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I read in spanish alfa forums that the OEM brake system ( 305mm with OEM pads, and rear 240) are very bad, I noticed (in my car) that when i brake the steering vibrates a lot and when i come to 220 kmh to 80 when i go to 140 the car don't brake.

I change all the system but i question that if it's necessary ( they use that) to pick up the GTA 147 brake system ( 330mm front discs, etc) or with my experience in Opel putting a good disk and a good pad, i make the brake much better?

I think ebc grooved and drilled discs front in std diam 305, ebc yellowstuff front, and ebc oem disc rear and ebc redstuff, with a good brake oil ( dot 5.1)

Is a good solution? or I only see the 147 GTA front brakes as a only option to brake hard and well??

( sorry again for my bad english)
I fitted 305mm replacement discs with fast road pads and they were a very good upgrade, especially when the brakes got hot!!:thumbs:
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thanks! it's all i can hear :D

i try to show pictures for the performance issues, like Alan, he is an Specialist, i'm an a begginer in Alfa's hehehe but it's more enjoyable too see pictures and the processing, etc.

Thanks again guys!

( a fully round of beers guaranteed when you came in summer to my beaches haha)
 

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Uff i see you found my thread, well you have already got some infos. If you woul like to tune your engine it's best to decide first will you put a compressor on or not. Because if you will then it's no need to raise the compression or change the cams. You need to make a reliable engine and maybe lower the compression than you can use some boost :D
Turbonutters can tell you more about that i'm sure.

If you wanna go NA tuning (it's expensive but for me more "pure" way) then you can lower the heads for 1mm (little over 11:1 CR) port and polish all, use some wild cams (AHM regrinds are cheap) and add a good remap (all about eshaust and intake was written a lot of times so i didnt mention that)
That should give you quite a strong engine. The basics ofcourse are that you have changed all the bearings, belts etc....

For more power you need more revs but i wouldnt go there without very well balanced bottom end. Safe side for v6 i would say is around 7500rpm if balanced and stock components are used. for more there will be problem with hydraulic lifters first and then wiht everything else really :D
 

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Thanks for posting Alan, it's an honor :) Well i like ever the "pure", my better performed engine was a C18XE 1.8 16V ecotec engine from my astra F GSi 16V. A lot of people say me to mount the C20LET calibra's turbo engine, but i like to be bit different with that untouched engine. I worked hard seem as you on the engine ( but with only 4 little pistons hehe) putting the exh valves at the see when you see the head from transverse ( brutal 12.6:1 compression ratio) and mounted mechanical pushers for the cams ( i have hydros but rally speciallist recommend me the mechanical pusher for the high revs and oil quality in hot, etc).

I changed everything, bearings, rod bearings, piston head rings.. and the car, the 3000km worked fine, was a beast. 980 kg and 177hp at 6800 (never putted remap, no one can touch that siemens simtec :( and i destroy a rod last that 3000km for excesive detonations, that the OEM detonator sensor can regulate much more the º that they need to correct that)

In the other project, the Z22SE i do thinks better, and go with good ecu range, and the car was solt without problems, and working to 203hp than 147 stock, and beating/eating a astra coupe turbo 192bhp stock ( that provably the best day of my life in that coupe hahahah).

Well i speaking too much. I like to maintain the N/A pure and strong, I like as you Alan to go to outside roads and racetracks and drive hard. And i think a strong N/A is the better option for all racetracks, a turbocharged it's not enough better in corners than the N/A.

And, I think if i make a strong V6 seems like yours ( i don't really mind reach a greater engine than yours ) and at last i'm bored... i put a compressor changin cams for std again and putting a upgraded heat seal ( more mm to downsize comp. ratio?

Or it's no way back with the same engine?
 

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Busso, pásate por Club GTA que estaremos encantados de conocerte, además en Barcelona solemos quedar muy a menudo y nos solemos juntar también algunos 916...

Sorry everybody for this words in spanish....
 

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Anybody know where to 1mm head gaskets in UK? If you fit these is there a need to run on super unleaded??
Pud 237's got cad drawings I am sure he can arrange for a set of 1mm copper gaskets. :thumbs:
Just spray them with copper gasket spray and install. Nice 11.1 CR without removing 1mm from your heads.
 
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