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Discussion Starter #1
I was thinking of making an adjustable panhard arm.

Does anyone know if the panhard arm is thick enough to cut in half, cut a section out of it, make a thread in it and fit an adjuster like whats in the steering arm? If so do you know what internal diameter it is ect ect

Is the correct way to get the panhard arm length as follows?
Remove the panhard arm, let the car sit naturally, measure the length where the panhard arm would be "middle of holes" and match this length with the panhard arm "middle of holes"

Or should the front be made parallel with no toe in or out on both sides and then adjust the rear until it is central?
The front is set to toe in 4 on one side and toe out 4 on the other side, so it’s parallel and reads 2 on both rear axle gauges but if the rear is off to one side, wont this put it all out?
Any tips as I have no idea about all this?
 

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The original Panhard rod is actually Z shaped, so if you just shortened it the ends wouldn't line up any more.

Ideally it needs to be adjustable and Rose-jointed.

You obviously don't want one front wheel toe-in and the other side toe-out...!
 

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I just cut my panhard and shortened it. Then weld it back togehter and put made some reinforsment.
You can make it adjustable like a strutbar, or you can enlarge the hole on the car then make excentric spacer (i dont know how to say) so you can adjust it, like front camber on some cars.
Cheapest solution is to put a wheel spacer of correct thicknes on one side only :) god knows what would happen with the behaviour of the car, maybe nothing...
 

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Discussion Starter #4
hey David, I didn’t know about it being Z shaped, is that the same for all of them, mine is ser 3 and only has leading arms and no trailing arms, if so how would shortening it in a straight section affect the ends?

I would like to make an adjustable one as my Koni's are made for an 80mm drop (from my ser 2) and I have to get a set of springs made to get the drop to what it should be for my shocks, I was thinking of running with no top rubbers on the springs to bring it down a bit.?

Alan lol to the one spacer, I have no idea. Can you remember the internal diameter and outer diameter and if there is enough meat to add an internal thread?
 

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Not sure about the S3.
But I know I needed to get the rod & axle at exactly the right height when putting it back together otherwise the bolt wouldn't go through the bush.

I was using springs with a 2" drop (I think) and no rubbers. But that wasn't on the road.
It was also a very long time ago...!



There was a story years ago that all the panhard rods were bent from where they were tied down on the boat...!!
 

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Discussion Starter #6
It’s been a while for me too, can’t remember having a problem getting the panhard arm back in, I put the car on axle stands, on the rear jacking points and jacked up the rear axle until the bolt slide in.
I was hoping someone had made one and could remember what they used, so I could just go out and buy the equivalent to a steering arm adjuster with the correct size thread and tap and die opposite threads into the panhard arm.
 

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This is what I did:
Remove back axle complete
Measure between shock absorber holes / turrets / chassis legs to find true centre of car and then marked it.
Cut panhard rod in two about 6" from the body mounting end so wasnt in body housing or butted up against beam.
Removed a section to allow for two nuts and adjustment.
Got the biggest thread I could find that fitted inside rod and two suitable nuts.
Weld a nut on on one side and a long piece of the thread you want on the other. Maybe 6".
Before you refit the beam again find the true centre by measuring between the shock absorber holes.
Sit the car on its wheels with normal load applied
Once refitted then wind the body end in / out until the two lines on body and beam line up. I used a plumb line.
Looking from the rear of the car as the car is lowered / suspension raises, then the beam moves to the right (o/s).
Ideal situation is for therod to be horizontal. This is because the arc of movement is then at its most vertical, most suspension movement for minimum deflection of the beam.
I'll see if I can find the bit I cut out to give you a bore size for the rod but from memory it was about 18mm?.

rsfruitbat
Lock the free nut against the fixed
 

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Discussion Starter #8
thanks fruitbat, I await yr conformation on the bore size. I tried to source a spare panhard arm but couldnt, so i have to do all this in one go as quick as possible, so i wanted to have the parts ready.
Whats the going rate for a second hand panhard arm these days?
 

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Panhard rod has a bore of 21.8mm
Thread I used was a weird english one that is 21.9mm od.
M20is a safe bet. Might get M22 to fit?

My mk1 version used a drop link of a tractor with a reverse thread on one side. With this you didnt haveto disconnect either end . Just wound it in and out.Thread dia was 16mm od but it snapped on a forest stage. Probably would have been ok on the road.
Havent used my mk2 in anger yet. If it does fail mk3 will be made out of either steam pipe or 1" box section.

rsfruitbat
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
thanks again rsfruitbat.

on that pic the bar in the middle is what i'm after, what is the technical name for the adjuster in the middle? Is it called a tie bar, i would like to order the correct "tie bar" so i can take off my panhard arm, cut a section out, weld in the "tie bar" and then fit.

Admin, why doesnt the pic show up when i put the link in the correct format, as in "
"??
 

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Your adjuster is the same as I called my drop link. Dont think it is the right name though. After it broke the first time I just thought the reverse thread on one side was too much aggro so thats why I did as I described.
Now if I want to adjust between forest and tarmac ride heights all I have to do is unbolt the body end, undo the lock nut, let that end of the panhard rod drop out of its housing, wind it in or out and then bolt it back together. Not a lot af aggro. Sorry I cant help more.

rsfruitbat
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
RSFruitbat,
you have been very helpfull, thank you. I will only be using mine on the road and is neeeded to stop the left tyre rubbing whilst cornering to the right and to be adjustable for when the ride height is what what it should be, as in what the shocks were made for. Although it wont be changed that often i would like to go with your mk1 version, as in the middle one in the pic. By the looks of it the threaded tip section has been welded on, which is better that what i was thinking, which was to tap a thread into the panhard rod itself, on your mk1, do you think welding 2 nuts and having another 2 lock nuts would have made it stronger?
Just phoned my main alfa stealer and a standard new one is £39.39+vat inc bushes!!!!
 

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Having 2 nuts welded on and 2 lock nuts was how I built it. It was the thread that snapped. Whether it got hit by a rock or couldnt take the strain I dont know. What I do know is it knackered both rear shockers in the process.
Rallying forces can be quite extreme so as you say I think it would have been fine for the road.

rsfruitbat
 

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What are you trying to achieve overall (yes I get the centering, but is it going to make enough dofference for the hassle)?

Mine is lowered (rubber almost touching arches) and has the standard rod and handles great.

As David C asked, toe in one one side and toe out at the other ? that doesnt sound right? Toe out 1 degree both fronts and toe in rear for turn in.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Hi veesix75
If it doesn’t work no harm done. I am trying to get round the problem of having different wheels on a lowered car. I have tws evo wheels that are from a 155 narrow body, the offset is different and I can’t get hubcentric wheel spacers that are thin enough as they start at 10mm, which is too much. Because of the panhard rod pushing the axle over the leading arms are at more of an angle in relation to the inside left rear tyre and therefore rubs when cornering. There is no problem with the other side. I could end up with rubbing on both sides after centralising the axle:lol:
I too had a ser 2 with a drop of 80mm at the rear and had no problems, but they had original 14" 5 spoke revos on them.

The tracking reads, -4 on one side and +4 on the other side = no toe out or toe in, usual practise is parallel on a lowered road car, I’ve been told.
Hope that all makes sence:)


Just spoke to rallydesign, who said it’s called an in situ adjuster and are £10+vat, “the O.D of the threaded insert that you weld into your is 20mm.” The rods internal diameter is 21.8mm, so I guess I need a 1.8mm ish sleeve for strength and to keep it centralised, or would the chamfer help this? He said that after cutting the rod put a chamfer on it and slide the rod into the recess and weld up, then clean up thread.


just got a reply from rallydesign, who said "This is the only available size we have. You would need to sleeve or weld
it and drill a hole to puddle weld it."
 

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Discussion Starter #19
6mm is still quite a bit, are they hubcentric? If doing the panhard rod doesnt help then........
 

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I think either would do the job. Both give you different problems.
Being a bit anal I would want the smaller one centralised.
I prefer the bigger one. it looks big enough to turn some of the hex threaded section to maybe slide over the panhard rod? Is the thread small enough to go inside the rod?
Personally just dont like the idea of the axle being out of alignment. I had to do it a a result of a bit of overexuberance with the handbrake and a kerb that was lay in wait for me (tarmac rally of course). Apart from bending the stub axle it moved the body mounting for the rod and it all ended up being out of alignment by about 6mm. This was enough to start causing wear on the shocker body casings.

rsfruitbat
 
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