Alfa Romeo Forum banner
1 - 13 of 13 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
752 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
As per title, was just wondering if anyone has made the change from a 2.4 to 2.0 JTDm(170)?

And if so, how did they find the change? Is the 2.0 more econimical, do you miss the 2.4 etc etc?

I've seen a nice 2011 2.0 Ti, which I have pretty much fallen for, but I still like my 2.4 also....lol:paranoid::alien:

Opinions and thoughts welcomed! :thumbs:

CS:biglaugh:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
194 Posts
I imagine that driving a 2.0 will feel like your old car has lost a cyclinder :biglaugh:

Joking aside, these are heavy cars and unlike a petrol, its harder to compensate for lower power by working it higher up the rev range.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Would say it would depend on your 2.4 is it standard? I've driven both and own a 2.0jtd believe the mpg is slightly better on the 2.0, it's has far fewer DPF issues due to new close coupled design and EGR is also less troublesome. Seems to passively regen really well on dual carriageways n motorway runs. Rarely see the DPF light. If you decide it's too slow you can remap it to around the same power as your old 2.4, although if you think this may be an option youll want to check what gearbox is has (you want an F40 rather than M32) as they fitted a range to the 2.0jtd. Depending on spec things you might miss include - electronic seats? Q4? Second tail pipe? That five pot sound?

Evo
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
752 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Would say it would depend on your 2.4 is it standard? I've driven both and own a 2.0jtd believe the mpg is slightly better on the 2.0, it's has far fewer DPF issues due to new close coupled design and EGR is also less troublesome. Seems to passively regen really well on dual carriageways n motorway runs. Rarely see the DPF light. If you decide it's too slow you can remap it to around the same power as your old 2.4, although if you think this may be an option youll want to check what gearbox is has (you want an F40 rather than M32) as they fitted a range to the 2.0jtd. Depending on spec things you might miss include - electronic seats? Q4? Second tail pipe? That five pot sound?

Evo
My 2.4 is currently mapped etc, and to be honest after having now driven the 2.0, I was pleasantly surprised by it....I was expecting to come away from it feeling extremely underwhelmed, but it really wasn't the case. Don't get me wrong, it is not as quick as the 2.4, and I knew it wasn't going to be especially with mine being mapped, but I was impressed. It pretty much felt very similar to what my 2.4 was like before the map. It's a little flat under 2000rpm, and 1st & 2nd gear I believe are torque limited (as they are also on the 2.4 in standard pre-map form) but once it gets going, it does feel quite lively with a smooth increasing power delivery right upto the redline, a little like driving a petrol. I often felt that the 2.4 seems to choke out at higher rpm, but is drastically improved with a good remap.

As you say, I've heard that they are meant to have less DPF and EGR issues, and to be honest this usually is a concern for me, as my work commute is a relatively short, city one which does not help and was the main reason for me having a remap and dpf removal on the 2.4.

I checked the gearbox, and although I couldn't actually see "F40" stamped on it, it did have the same selector/linkage setup as my 2.4 so I think it is safe to assume it does have an F40 box fitted, as the M32 selector is noticeably different as is the one on the Giulietta(forget model number "C" something)

Spec wise, my 2.4 is quite highly specced, I believe the only option missing was the sat nav(even has the rare tri-zone climate control and usually obsolete cd changer) but this 2.0 is also highly specced, which probably contributed to me falling for it.....it has the newer MY2011 interior with the red piping (which I love) and like mine is full electric along with dipping wing mirror(and folding) it HAS the sat nav(the later one with SD card, which really is nice and something I always wanted) it only has rear parking sensors, where as my 2.4 has front and rear with the function display(this I will miss, as I liked the display feature but can live without) mine isn't a Q4(I really wanted one of these!) both have xenons, which I think are a must!

Now the second tail pipe! YES this I will miss, along with the 5 pot sound! The 159 rear end was conceived to have twin tail pipes, and I will be sad to see this go....especially since mine has a alfatune stainless system! I so wish I had kept my standard exhaust!, but I'm not sure if this could even be fitted to the 2.0? :depressed:

Thanks for your input Evo! Appreciated! :thumbup::thumbup:

CS
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
My 2.4 is currently mapped etc, and to be honest after having now driven the 2.0, I was pleasantly surprised by it....I was expecting to come away from it feeling extremely underwhelmed, but it really wasn't the case. Don't get me wrong, it is not as quick as the 2.4, and I knew it wasn't going to be especially with mine being mapped, but I was impressed. It pretty much felt very similar to what my 2.4 was like before the map. It's a little flat under 2000rpm, and 1st & 2nd gear I believe are torque limited (as they are also on the 2.4 in standard pre-map form) but once it gets going, it does feel quite lively with a smooth increasing power delivery right upto the redline, a little like driving a petrol. I often felt that the 2.4 seems to choke out at higher rpm, but is drastically improved with a good remap.

As you say, I've heard that they are meant to have less DPF and EGR issues, and to be honest this usually is a concern for me, as my work commute is a relatively short, city one which does not help and was the main reason for me having a remap and dpf removal on the 2.4.

I checked the gearbox, and although I couldn't actually see "F40" stamped on it, it did have the same selector/linkage setup as my 2.4 so I think it is safe to assume it does have an F40 box fitted, as the M32 selector is noticeably different as is the one on the Giulietta(forget model number "C" something)

Spec wise, my 2.4 is quite highly specced, I believe the only option missing was the sat nav(even has the rare tri-zone climate control and usually obsolete cd changer) but this 2.0 is also highly specced, which probably contributed to me falling for it.....it has the newer MY2011 interior with the red piping (which I love) and like mine is full electric along with dipping wing mirror(and folding) it HAS the sat nav(the later one with SD card, which really is nice and something I always wanted) it only has rear parking sensors, where as my 2.4 has front and rear with the function display(this I will miss, as I liked the display feature but can live without) mine isn't a Q4(I really wanted one of these!) both have xenons, which I think are a must!

Now the second tail pipe! YES this I will miss, along with the 5 pot sound! The 159 rear end was conceived to have twin tail pipes, and I will be sad to see this go....especially since mine has a alfatune stainless system! I so wish I had kept my standard exhaust!, but I'm not sure if this could even be fitted to the 2.0? :depressed:

Thanks for your input Evo! Appreciated! :thumbup::thumbup:

CS
Sounds like you've found a really nice one, glad you were pleasantly surprised. I quite like the 2.0 diesel its got fairly nice drive-ability in standard form (bar those pesky first gears). Im planning on getting mine mapped later this year for a little more power so can update you as an d when I do (looking like October thanks to re-mortgaging woes).

As for the rear end i've recently been under mine and can say im not 100% sure about your alfatune system but fitting a new twin exhaust will be a doddle - the hangers are already there on both sides. The bumper already has a blank on the right side ready to be removed. Just begging for something like this https://www.gazzellaracing.com/product.php?productid=19558&cat=2318&page=1 (im no exhasut expert nor do i recommend using this particular vendor - was just somewhere to grab the picture).

Evo
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
752 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Update on the map would be good please yeah! Might be a bit fat for you, but would highly recommend Gus at Alfatune.

A friend of mine has a 2.0 JTDm 170 Giulietta which I have driven a fair few times prior to the 159 and was always impressed with the same 2.0 engine in that, but was apprehensive of the same engine in the 159 as it is obviously a fair bit bigger and definitely heavier! Mind you, I'm certain that I read somewhere that the later 159s were revised to make them lighter?? Whether or not this true I'm not sure, but when I drove the 2.0 it did feel a little lighter on its toes, may have just been me....

In regards to the exhaust it would appear according to that website, the 1.9 and the 2.0 twin Ragazzon system have the same part number....I know that the standard 2.4 dual exit system is a direct fit to the 1.9 so in theory based on that, perhaps mine would fit? But either way I don't have my original system to put back on :boxedin:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
131 Posts
I have a 2.0 lusso remapped by Gus... it is frankly amazing. Very frugal, 220hp(ish) and a lighter engine (and missing various exhaust parts) it is definitely better than a stock 2.4 or indeed 1750, which both feel rather 'dead' compared to my car. In fact I lost the deposit on a 1750 TBI because I was convinced that I wanted to trade the 2.0 but when I drove the TBI it was gutless by comparison (probably a different story if that was tuned too, but it wouldn't return north of 50mpg on long motorway runs at full gas.) So, get it remapped, but don't lose the DPF, as they are worth 1600 quid new. You won't regret it!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
752 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I have a 2.0 lusso remapped by Gus... it is frankly amazing. Very frugal, 220hp(ish) and a lighter engine (and missing various exhaust parts) it is definitely better than a stock 2.4 or indeed 1750, which both feel rather 'dead' compared to my car. In fact I lost the deposit on a 1750 TBI because I was convinced that I wanted to trade the 2.0 but when I drove the TBI it was gutless by comparison (probably a different story if that was tuned too, but it wouldn't return north of 50mpg on long motorway runs at full gas.) So, get it remapped, but don't lose the DPF, as they are worth 1600 quid new. You won't regret it!
Sounds promising! Have you had the DPF removed then or just a map? As I told myself (as I ALWAYS have when I get a new car) that I will leave it as is and NOT mod it! lol:biglaugh:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
131 Posts
Sounds promising! Have you had the DPF removed then or just a map? As I told myself (as I ALWAYS have when I get a new car) that I will leave it as is and NOT mod it! lol:biglaugh:


My car has the full Gus 'DPF remap' and that means that Gus takes out the DPF and replaces it with a straight pipe and also tunes the engine. This cost 840 quid when he did it for the previous owner. Even with the stock exhaust it sounds like nothing else. Perfectly acceptable for driving around town but when you put your foot down it does not sound like a four pot diesel. Not as good a soundtrack as the 2.4 or v6 but people who didn't know the car have said 'what sort of engine is that'?.


Given the troubles I had getting it thru MOT and the general unpleasantness of diesel exhaust I found that putting additives in the diesel seems (subjectively) to improve matters greatly. Without the DPF, the car is like Stevenson's Rocket, unless you drive it like you stole it 100% of the time. Which is fine for many of the posters on this forum but if your foot isn't planted firmly in the carpet for 50% of your driving, and you're average dive is over 40 minutes, you will eventually get a thick coating of particulates all down the exhaust which will blow out come MOT time.


If I had bought the car unmapped I would not have used Gus, but instead left the DPF in and gone the Celtic eMotion route. Its a lot cheaper, a lot easier to do as you can do it on your drive yourself, and you can map or unmap the car to your taste in about 5 minutes. You have a choice of states of tune - Original, Eco and Fast road. So, if you're worried about having a gearbox made of cheese, it is no problem to run the Eco map which will still give you more horses (204) but not as much as the full fast road mode (215). I ran my last car like that for 7 years with no issues at all (it was a Leon), with an occasional switch to fast road for fun! Celtic also don't lock down the ECU like Gus, so when you sell the car, take the map off (as normal, in 5 mins), and then you can use the e-Motion device on your next car or sell it...nobody will be any the wiser.

Okay, so it likely not quite as fast or sounding as good as the full DPF treatment, but you're not also likely to have to write off your car because of some government edict. In my dealings with Celtic over the years they really do seem to know what they are doing. :biglaugh: (and I don't work for them!!). Once you have the eMotion device they charge 100 quid for each new map for a new car, so that's not exactly extortionate in my view. Likely you won't be driving a 159 for ever.. although with Alfa's current speed of saloon production that may indeed be the case :wobble:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
I've heard astounding things bout Gus and his skills. I'm thinking I'm gonna keep my DPF intact and head to NJS in pershore mostly due to travel distance! Rumour has it it's the same map from them anyway? and I'll get them to delete the EGR whilst they're at it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
656 Posts
Yes NJS uses same maps. And he knows if stuff in my experience, not the cheapest but as with all things you get what you pay for. Results are awesome!
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
Top