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My thrice-daily routine (OK, maybe double or triple that:rolleyes:) of watching gumtree and other sites for Alfa's has shown me how dealers in the second hand car market add massive premiums, for example this 164 which was first advertised at R25 000 (ALFA ROMEO 164 3.0 24 VALVE V6 ----FOR SALE - Cape Town / Western Cape used car for sale - Gumtree Cape Town / Western Cape Free Classifieds) and is now selling at R39 995 (1996 Alfa Romeo 164 V6 Pinna Farina For Sale R39995.00 - Cape Town / Western Cape used car for sale - Gumtree Cape Town / Western Cape Free Classifieds).
The sad thing is that quite often these cars do not move at all from the dealer's floor. There was a green GTV6 which was advertised for R40k a while back and is now selling at R55k. I really hope that Rian's 75 (really great price now) doesn't end up on a dealer's lot with some exorbitant price stuck on it, keeping it out of Alfisti hands.
 

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Noticed the same thing. There was a red 3.0 GTV6 in Wilderness for sale not so long ago. Drove past a vintage car place in Sedgefield on Sunday and the price was up by almost 20K
 

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Remember classic takes much longer to sell than normal newish cars and the dealer has overheads to cover.
I do agree that in some cases the prices are a little far fetched.

Thats basically the same reason our out of the ordinary brand (newer) cars also goes for way below their book values when trading them in.
The dealer has to pay interest on the money and the car would take a few months to sell in most cases instead of a week or two as with normal cars.
On normal cars you can take that same amount of money and probably rotate it (the cars you buy with it) around every week or two,
on slower sellers it might take say 4 months.
Now on normal car you would most probably have done around 8 transactions in the time it would take you to do one with a slow seller.
Say you make an average of only R2 500 per unit on fast sellers, that means you would have made R20 000 already.
(and trust me on this, most would make way more than that per car).
Plus the chances of something going wrong on a older / stramge car is much higher.
Even the smallest thing that goes wrong on a car such as these are way more expensive than on your run of the mill cars.
Also keep in mind that with the new CPA the dealer is responsible to for if something major goes wrong. That might very well mean the end of classic car dealers on affordable classics.
Does having a R20 000 premium on a classic now sounds so far fetched???

Trust me, the okes dealing in such cars does it because they want to, not because they are just after the money.
My dad used to deal with classic Jaguars, Porsches and Alfas, so I know the game well.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Wouldn't lower prices make the car move faster? I can't understand this - buy a car for R35k, advertise the car for R55k and the car doesn't move anywhere. One of the opportunity costs is the space that car is taking up (often for very long periods) because the price is too high. So then the car stands exposed to most of the elements for a very long time which reduces its value as well. I've watched two 116 gtv's advertised on gumtree for more than 6 months go absolutely nowhere because of the ridiculous prices. I dunno - some old car dealers are genuine, but most of the ones I've chatted to know very little and have little love for Alfa's.
The nice thing about the internet is that one can readvertise at incrementally lower prices rather quickly in response to negative feedback from the market. Unfortunately the opposite quite often seems to happen. It seems that the dealer responds to negative feedback by spending more money on the car (maybe a coat of paint) and raises the price by more than the repair cost in the hope of making even more profit instead of dropping the expected profit.
 

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True, there are dealers out there that takes the mickey out of it.
Some just see a certain older Alfa and think "oh surely those are worth a lot more" and buy it thinking they will make a big profit.
Clearly they have no real idea about these cars, older Alfas are worth a fair amount of money,
but only if they are well maintained and looked after.
You can't buy a scruffy older Alfa and just do a quick paint job and expect it to be a show stopper,
with your more common brands you can in most cases do that.
 
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Just looking at that ad on the gtv 3.0 . It says it has three twin choke dellortos - well it really has six single dellortos if you want to split hairs( or carbs) . These cars are worth their most when the have original rims and bumpers have not been colour coded. Having said that he Is asking a 100k . At the moment they are trading for 16000 pounds sterling in uk - which I have seen three sold in the last year .
Funny thing is absolute original genuine ones are selling for stupid prices . There is a chap in oz who has offered 180k for my mates gtv3.0 and he won't part with.
 

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These cars are worth their most when the have original rims and bumpers have not been colour coded. Having said that he Is asking a 100k . At the moment they are trading for 16000 pounds sterling in uk - which I have seen three sold in the last year .
Funny thing is absolute original genuine ones are selling for stupid prices . There is a chap in oz who has offered 180k for my mates gtv3.0 and he won't part with.
That's exactly what I meant Krasch. For R100K you'd expect it to be more original. Cutting a hole for a sunfroof is not something that's easy to set right. And if you don't get the original wheels, it won't be an original 3.0. Imagine buying a Superboss without it's black Allouette rims or a Shadowline without it's BBS or a GTA without it's 17" teledials.

To me a car is worth more than the sum of it's parts if it's one that I like. For example, I'd consider buying a GT Junior for R90K in pristine condition, and if it were stolen or lost, I'd consider buying another one for twice that, to satisfy my craving! :eek::taati smiley::rolleyes:

What else can you get for R180K these days? A new Yaris?...:confused:
 

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My thrice-daily routine (OK, maybe double or triple that:rolleyes:) of watching gumtree and other sites for Alfa's has shown me how dealers in the second hand car market add massive premiums, for example this 164 which was first advertised at R25 000 (ALFA ROMEO 164 3.0 24 VALVE V6 ----FOR SALE - Cape Town / Western Cape used car for sale - Gumtree Cape Town / Western Cape Free Classifieds) and is now selling at R39 995 (1996 Alfa Romeo 164 V6 Pinna Farina For Sale R39995.00 - Cape Town / Western Cape used car for sale - Gumtree Cape Town / Western Cape Free Classifieds).
Hi El 4

Funny you should use this example. I am quite familiar with this specific dealer. :tut: :mad: I would not touch anything from his lot with a stick wrapped in a latex glove, nor do any business with him in any way ever again (nor would any of my friends/family). Bought a car from them a few years ago and had ENDLESS trouble with the car, questionable conduct and bad attitudes from there. But hey, that is just my opinion... :rant: :rolleyes:
 
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I personally would not buy an old car from a dealer. You end up paying way more than what the car is worth. On a classic, I would want to know that I can get my money back when I sell. Saw a 1983 Giulietta at a dealer the other day for R35000 in average condition (cheap retrim, little bit of rust, etc), in my opinion a R15000 car. A concourse Giulietta may be worth that money or slightly more.
I think we need yet to see the effect of the Consumer Protection Act, wrt old cars. (Verdict of court cases.)
When you have problems with your dealer bought classic, I am sure the dealer involved will be taking his chances.
 
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