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Discussion Starter #1
Hi all.

Can anyone advise on the following?

Just been out in the car, left it parked in a carpark for a few hours. Didn't notice anything unusual getting there.

Got in my car to drive home, and noticed right away that the clutch pedal bite point had changed drematically... I was having to push it nearly to the floor to get the bite point, and the pedal seemed very light nearly all the way to the floor.

I pumped the pedal a few times which seemed to stiffen it up slightly. on the way home it seemed to get worse, by the time i got home it was very difficult to change gear without crunching. (only a 15 minute drive home)

It's cold, dark and wet outside and havn't been able to check the hydrolic fluid level yet, I don't think Im going to be able to check for leaks near the slave/master cilinder either due to the weather condintions...


Any ideas what might be at fault other than the slave/master clinders?
 

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Slave cylinder failure - its usually the problem when this happens. If the clutch is quite old, stiff & heavy, then you would be as well changing it, the seals in the slave cylinders are not robust enough to cope with a heavy clutch for too long before giving up again.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Ok, I had a quick look a couple of hours ago, seems some sort of fluid has leaked over the top of the engine bay, coming from the middle at the rear on the engine bay. I think its come from the master cilinder, but to be honest I'm not sure it is...


from what happened on my way home to how it looks, I'd say it's a catastprophic failure at best. Can anyone confirm the location of the slave and master cilinders? and also the location of the resevroir to fill up the clutch hydrolic fluid, as I've not been able to find it in the dark.

Thanks.
 

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First thing, like you say is to check the fluid level. What happened to mine recently was the clutch getting stiff the warmer it got. Then it got to the point where it was barely clearing. The fluid level looked fine, but I took the cap off anyway- when I did this, it hissed, so had obviously built up a vacuum. The breather in the cap was bloked, and wasn't allowing enough fluid into the system. Several kicks of the pedal and the clutch came back! had it bled by the garage the next day & has been fine so far... although now, a few months on, its losing fluid somwhere. Hoping its not the slave cylinder thats gone! £££
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Slave cylinder failure - its usually the problem when this happens. If the clutch is quite old, stiff & heavy, then you would be as well changing it, the seals in the slave cylinders are not robust enough to cope with a heavy clutch for too long before giving up again.
I didn't see your post before replying myself... The clutch before the problems was indeed very heavy, so ties in with what your suggesting.

Any idea how much a clutch replacement and slave cilinder would be to get fixed at a trusted alfa garage??

Cheers.
 

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Just seen your post- What colour is the fluid covering the engine? Presuming the engine bay is the same as the 147 & 156, the reservoir for the hyd. fluid is on the passenger side on the bulkhead, next to the power steering reservoir. Its a shared reservoir for the brakes and the clutch. The master cylinder is inside the footwell behind the pedal, the slave cylinder iside the gearbox bellhousing I'm afraid- gearbox off to change it :-(
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Just seen your post- What colour is the fluid covering the engine? Presuming the engine bay is the same as the 147 & 156, the reservoir for the hyd. fluid is on the passenger side on the bulkhead, next to the power steering reservoir. Its a shared reservoir for the brakes and the clutch. The master cylinder is inside the footwell behind the pedal, the slave cylinder iside the gearbox bellhousing I'm afraid- gearbox off to change it :-(
interesting (worrying)...

unsure on colour of fluid as its dark outside, but smells like brake fluid - makes sence if its a shared resevroir(I didn't know it was!). But I checked the break fluid which seems full! Makes me wonder whats causing the problem then...

the fluid on the engine bay, seems to be coming from the back middle, where theres about four pipes going into a cast 'Box' mounted to the bulkhead(just to the left of power steering fluid and brake fluid). Doesn't sound like from the clutch then...

I take it the slave cilinders location is the reason you check belhousing for leaks then? Not sure how I can check this with the weather how it is and no garage to use :s

Any idea on cost to fix by trusted alfa garage if it's:

A: Master cilinder
B: Slave Silinder (Including and not inculding clutch itself)
C: Any other suspected faults....


Thanks again
 

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mr flibble, that is so weird ...exactly the same thing has happened to my GT too!

in fact, it did exactly the same symptoms as you described around xmas eve. i checked the fluid and that was ok, and it just went back to normal. its done it again today ...although i haven't driven it in a week. bite point right near the floor and pedal really soft, same as you.

The only link I could figure was that it did it last time when the weather got really cold! it went ok when the temperatures increased. I will check the fluid again tommorrow and will be interesting to see what happens. never had any probs before with clutch either.
 

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interesting (worrying)...

unsure on colour of fluid as its dark outside, but smells like brake fluid - makes sence if its a shared resevroir(I didn't know it was!). But I checked the break fluid which seems full! Makes me wonder whats causing the problem then...

the fluid on the engine bay, seems to be coming from the back middle, where theres about four pipes going into a cast 'Box' mounted to the bulkhead(just to the left of power steering fluid and brake fluid). Doesn't sound like from the clutch then...
...thats not the fuel filter you're smelling is it???
 

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i had the same problem on my 147 it suddenly came back had it in with garage just to be sure and got it bled putting it down to the bad weather
 

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Discussion Starter #11
First thing, like you say is to check the fluid level. What happened to mine recently was the clutch getting stiff the warmer it got. Then it got to the point where it was barely clearing. The fluid level looked fine, but I took the cap off anyway- when I did this, it hissed, so had obviously built up a vacuum. The breather in the cap was bloked, and wasn't allowing enough fluid into the system. Several kicks of the pedal and the clutch came back! had it bled by the garage the next day & has been fine so far... although now, a few months on, its losing fluid somwhere. Hoping its not the slave cylinder thats gone! £££

Lol.... Not sure how this is happening (maybe I've had a few too many beers to wash away my worries) I missed your post alltogether.

The above makes the most sence to me, but doesn't explain why it came on so suddenly, or where the fluid on the engine bay has come from.

Am having a look tomorrow when it's light outside (hopefully it wont snow... :s ) with a friend, so will hopefully have more of an idea then.

Thanks for the replies so far :eek:)
 

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Discussion Starter #12
i had the same problem on my 147 it suddenly came back had it in with garage just to be sure and got it bled putting it down to the bad weather

I HOPE it comes back! will save me a lot of hard work in the freezing wether... How long ago did you have this issue?
 

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the slave cylinder iside the gearbox bellhousing I'm afraid- gearbox off to change it :-(
True for a twinspark. I Think Mr flibble has a JTD though(?) which makes changing the slave much simpler. Its on top off the bell housing and takes about half an hour to change. It's do-able yourself with minimal tools if you dont mind bleeding it yourself.

It looks like this:
Shop4Parts

If it is the master:Shop4Parts
Its behind the pedal and could be tricky for access (not sure)?

My money is on the slave. It may have sprayed brake fluid up from the top of the gearbox all over the rear bulkhead if the seals have gone. It may have blown due to the cold or due to having to work quite hard if you have an old and heavy clutch.

Good luck getting it sorted and let us know how you get on:thumbs:
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Thanks for the responces so far!

Yeah I have the JTD.
Thats good news with the slave cilinder then, makes it a little cheaper for a garage to fix if it is at fault, as I think its a bit too cold to be doing it myself at the minute.


I have just been to have a look at the car again in the daylight.

The break fluid resevroir is full...

The fluid on the engine bay looks like it IS DIESEL!! coming from the "cast 'Box' mounted to the bulkhead" Which I can now see in the daylight is the top of the fuel filter. Looks to be leaking from the front nearside hose/joint. Not good! (I can't see any visible leak with engine running, but must be leaking - pictures attached)

Could the clutch issue be down to air or water in the system? I got a quote from kwik-fit to change the brake and clutch fluid (£30). Is it worth having this done to see if it fixes it? I suspect not as it may help short term but won't fix the reason it's happened...

strangest thing as I can see is that when I pump the pedal a few times the clutch returns almost to normal. a minute or so later it seems the presure I built up by pumping it has gone again and clutch it right down at the carpet.


Does anyone have any experience with Alfa Beechdale? As this is my local Alfa dealer/garage.
 

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...thats not the fuel filter you're smelling is it???
...good guess from me!
don't think thats a big deal as a new fuel filter is about £12 and really easy to change. or it could be the hose that attaches to it. Pull it apart and have a look. it might just not be secured in properly. i have 'how-to' photo instructions if you need them.

had a play with my clutch too. fluid is fine. unscrewed the cap off and pumped the clutch. pedal went stiffer so i'm not planning to do anything until the weather gets better and i'm convinced it will go back to normal.
 

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True for a twinspark. I Think Mr flibble has a JTD though(?) which makes changing the slave much simpler. Its on top off the bell housing and takes about half an hour to change. It's do-able yourself with minimal tools if you dont mind bleeding it yourself.

It looks like this:
Shop4Parts

If it is the master:Shop4Parts
Its behind the pedal and could be tricky for access (not sure)?

My money is on the slave. It may have sprayed brake fluid up from the top of the gearbox all over the rear bulkhead if the seals have gone. It may have blown due to the cold or due to having to work quite hard if you have an old and heavy clutch.

Good luck getting it sorted and let us know how you get on:thumbs:
That is good news if thats the case! I'm sure when I looked slave cylinders up for jtd's before, they showed a picture of the concentric type... Theres so much stuff covering the gearbox I've not actually bothered to try and look which type it is. Anyway, I need to find out where this fluid is going, so itl be back into the garage next week.
 

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I HOPE it comes back! will save me a lot of hard work in the freezing wether... How long ago did you have this issue?
It lasted for about a day and a half, although i didnt use it alot during this time, for obious reasons, was on the way to garage and it began to come back, (always the way):lol:

Hope you get it sorted:thumbs:
 

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Discussion Starter #18
...good guess from me!
don't think thats a big deal as a new fuel filter is about £12 and really easy to change. or it could be the hose that attaches to it. Pull it apart and have a look. it might just not be secured in properly. i have 'how-to' photo instructions if you need them.

had a play with my clutch too. fluid is fine. unscrewed the cap off and pumped the clutch. pedal went stiffer so i'm not planning to do anything until the weather gets better and i'm convinced it will go back to normal.
If you have a guide that would be great! Thanks, and yes a good guess by you.

Will there not be an issue with the fuel presure if I replace the fuel filter?

Cheers.



I'll be taking the car to alfa beachdale tomorrow hopefully, unless someone advises otherwise. See what they have to say...
 

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Following advice is for clutch/brake fluid issue, not diesel leak


I didn't see your post before replying myself... The clutch before the problems was indeed very heavy, so ties in with what your suggesting.

Any idea how much a clutch replacement and slave cilinder would be to get fixed at a trusted alfa garage??

Cheers.
£495 inc VAT for the clutch, plus the price of a slave cylinder which would be £30-£50?

Clutches

Just seen your post- What colour is the fluid covering the engine? Presuming the engine bay is the same as the 147 & 156, the reservoir for the hyd. fluid is on the passenger side on the bulkhead, next to the power steering reservoir. Its a shared reservoir for the brakes and the clutch. The master cylinder is inside the footwell behind the pedal, the slave cylinder iside the gearbox bellhousing I'm afraid- gearbox off to change it :-(
Slave cylinder is on top of the gearbox on the JTD, its just the 156/147/GT Twinspark & 2.0 JTS that have the slave inside the bell housing..

unsure on colour of fluid as its dark outside, but smells like brake fluid - makes sence if its a shared resevroir(I didn't know it was!). But I checked the break fluid which seems full! Makes me wonder whats causing the problem then...

the fluid on the engine bay, seems to be coming from the back middle, where theres about four pipes going into a cast 'Box' mounted to the bulkhead(just to the left of power steering fluid and brake fluid). Doesn't sound like from the clutch then...

I take it the slave cilinders location is the reason you check belhousing for leaks then? Not sure how I can check this with the weather how it is and no garage to use :s

Any idea on cost to fix by trusted alfa garage if it's:

A: Master cilinder
B: Slave Silinder (Including and not inculding clutch itself)
C: Any other suspected faults....
The cast box is the ABS module. If you have had a leak somewhere in the brake system, you would eventually lose enough brake fluid so that you lose the clutch mechanism, this would happen before you lost the brakes as well. I think you really need to get it to a garage to let someone have a proper look, it could just be a leak in from the slave cylinder or maybe one of the brake/clutch fluid lines that has squirted fluid everywhere..

True for a twinspark. I Think Mr flibble has a JTD though(?) which makes changing the slave much simpler. Its on top off the bell housing and takes about half an hour to change. It's do-able yourself with minimal tools if you dont mind bleeding it yourself.

It looks like this:
Shop4Parts

If it is the master:Shop4Parts
Its behind the pedal and could be tricky for access (not sure)?

My money is on the slave. It may have sprayed brake fluid up from the top of the gearbox all over the rear bulkhead if the seals have gone. It may have blown due to the cold or due to having to work quite hard if you have an old and heavy clutch.

Good luck getting it sorted and let us know how you get on:thumbs:
And leak in the engine bay pretty much rules out the master cylinder. Slave cylinder is not a difficult job, I did one on my V6 (same gearbox) in 4 hours, I reckon I could do it in 2 hours second time round and the mechanics at work take little over an hour. But if the clutch is heavy, it really should be replaced before it does another slave cylinder in, or the flywheel..
 

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Looks like two separate faults then:eek:

Might be worth bleeding the clutch to see if any gunk comes out of it. Should be a 10 min job for a garage:thumbs:

As for the fuel hose, it may just need a clean up and re-seated. Has it been serviced recently and had the fuel filter done? Might have not been properly clicked in afterwards?
 
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