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Discussion Starter #1
I've got a 2003 2.0 JTS spider with a central locking problem!! the car will lock then automatically unlock. I tried locking the car with the key in the drivers door, and the same thing happens. But if I lock the car in the passenger door the car will remain locked!! I'm getting really frustrated as I can't seem to find the problem?? any ideas?? anyone with experience of the same on a spider or GTV??
thank you in advance
shawn
 

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Do a forum search for Bouncing Locks
 
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Well, in a nutshell, the problem is in the passenger door, probably the motor attached to the lock or the wiring to the passenger door.

Each lock actuator has five wires - two for the motor, and a switch with three wires - the common, the lock wire, and the unlock wire. Either lock or unlock is connected to the common, depending on the position of the actuator.

If either the lock or unlock wire is broken or the switch is faulty, the system will lock but not unlock or vice versa. I don't think this is your problem.

If the motor moves the lock (the lock pin inside the car can be seen to go down), but the switch doesn't go to the 'lock' position, then again the system will unlock. I don't think this is your problem either - your lock pin probably doesn't go down.

If the system tries to lock the passenger door and the actuator/door pin doesn't move, the switch will remain in the 'unlock' position - so, the system immediately unlocks the doors. I think this is what you have.

The fact that the system will lock when you use the key in the passenger door suggests that the passenger door actuator is not running or not moving the lock. The problem could be the motor (stripped gear inside, perhaps), its connection to the lock, or the wiring that runs into the door.

The GTV/Spider seems to use Alfa 164 door latches (designed in the 80's :)). This is good news if you do need a new lock actuator, as it is a common design (plastic housing about 15cm long, mounted by two screws) and a new generic unit can be substituted easily. An auto electrician is the place to find this, or http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-Wire-Car-Door-Lock-Motor-Solenoid-Central-locking-motor-alarm-/290340307730?nav=SEARCH

The one I have linked to should fit straight in, but some other recent designs of generic lock actuator have a swivelling head. This is longer, but in the worst case, you can attach a new rod (provided with the actuator) to the existing door lock rod for the pin inside the door. i.e. 'piggyback' the actuator onto this rather than onto the original linkage.

This last approach, by the way, is the economic option to repair newer cars that have their own custom designs of motorised latch (Alfa 166 for example) for which parts are £££/$$$.

-Alex
 
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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks guys,
I still have the problem!!! I've changed the passenger lock and solenoid still the same problem!! today I have changed the driver side!! still the same problem!! The only thing that isn't right is the spring in the driver side pull handle is broken. But I have tried to simulate this with the door card off and the window down whilst locking the doors.... still the same problem!! locks bouncing!!! :depressed:
 

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Did you lubricate the new locks & solenoids prior to installing them?
 

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Thanks guys,
I still have the problem!!! I've changed the passenger lock and solenoid still the same problem!! today I have changed the driver side!! still the same problem!! The only thing that isn't right is the spring in the driver side pull handle is broken. But I have tried to simulate this with the door card off and the window down whilst locking the doors.... still the same problem!! locks bouncing!!! :depressed:
To fix something like this, you have to work out what is and what isn't working. It's no good to try replacing bits and have no idea of what symptoms have changed.

So let's start again... When you close both doors and lock the passenger door with the key, both doors lock and stay locked, correct?

Then, when you unlock the passenger door with the key, both doors unlock and stay unlocked, correct?

Then, when you lock the driver's door with the key, the driver's door immediately unlocks - correct?

Does the passenger door lock pin move down and then back up - or does it not move at all?


-Alex
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Hi Alex,
Thank you for the reply.
If lock the car from the fob the locks bounce!. If I lock the car from the driver side (with the key) the locks bounce. If I lock the car from the passenger side with the key the car remains locked.
Yesterday I stripped the passenger side lock out of the car and checked the mechanism which appeared a little still so I cleaned and lubricated the mech and reinstalled it (in the dark, cold and windy!!!) same problem!!!! I think (after looking at the mechanism that there is a little micro switch in the mech, does this tell the electronics that the door is closed???
 

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Have a read with this extract. The system does need to know what position the locks are in, if it can not sense the position, the lock will repel (bounce). So I would say that there may be a problem either with the microswitches or wiring. Please have a read.
 

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Yesterday I stripped the passenger side lock out of the car and checked the mechanism which appeared a little still so I cleaned and lubricated the mech and reinstalled it (in the dark, cold and windy!!!) same problem!!!! I think (after looking at the mechanism that there is a little micro switch in the mech, does this tell the electronics that the door is closed???
Thanks for the description of what's happening.

Yes, I think that microswitch you found (on the door latch) tells the electronics for the instrument panel that the door is closed (note, closed not locked) - it doesn't have anything to with the central locking.

The central locking relies on the five-wire actuator that's attached to the door latch. Either it isn't moving to lock the door, or the switch signal is not reaching the electronics to tell when the door is locked. There is a microswitch in there too, but if faulty you will probably want to replace the whole actuator using one of the type I linked to before. See the picture there to see the actuator I mean.

You may need to check for broken wires going into the door (particularly the wiring inside the bendy rubber concertina).

At least we know for certain that the problem is in the passenger door lock actuator or wiring.

-Alex
 
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Try disconnecting the loom on the A pillar of the offending door see what happens .Not looked on mine but most modern cars are easy to disconnect at A pillar.Also sounds stupid but are u sure the both doors are actually shut ? .If the slam plate needs adjustment on one side the lock may only be latching onto the First click .Try leaving both doors open but operate the catches manually with a screwdriver
 

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Hi, I know a number of folk (Alex in particular) have provided a good deal of suggestions and advice on how to fix your problem, but.....

Have you tried the "key in non working door lock, then lock, unlock, repeat 6-10 times and then repeat in the other door' trick

In my experience, on at least 4 spiders experiencing problems such as yours, this cures the bouncing lock problem, for at least a good while

Hope you solve the issues

Rich ;)
 

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Hi, I know a number of folk (Alex in particular) have provided a good deal of suggestions and advice on how to fix your problem, but.....

Have you tried the "key in non working door lock, then lock, unlock, repeat 6-10 times and then repeat in the other door' trick

In my experience, on at least 4 spiders experiencing problems such as yours, this cures the bouncing lock problem, for at least a good while

Hope you solve the issues

Rich ;)
I had a similar problem and after removing the cards, checking everything and replacing the lock mechanism on passenger side I discovered that the fault was that the wiring loom connector in passenger side wasn't tightened down. This is a screw in plug located in the front of the door below the hinge. I squirted a little wd40 into connection and screwed it on properly and that sorted the problem. Maybe a bit simple but you never know.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
its fixed

Hi Guys,
Thank you for all your help but I have managed to fix the problem!!
It was the microswitch in the passenger door lock!! thinking that the door was still open.
Shawn
 

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Does anyone have any tips on getting to the locking motor once the door card is off?
 

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OK, I'm past that stage now. I unbolted the door latch and locking motor support (4x bolts on the edge of the door) which gave me enough wiggle room to disconnect the bowden cable from the lock. I then disengaged the motor from the linkage and undid the motor mounting screws by reaching in from the large apperture in the centre of the door (under the soundproofing).

I have not figured out how to remove the external (key) lock.

If anyone has an easier way, I'd love to know!

Meanwhile, I have read through a lot of "bouncing lock" threads and tried to get the two sides in sync. However, I am now pretty sure that the passenger door motor is u/s, hence the need to remove it. I disconnected the 5 wire block and the drivers door lock operated correctly. The passenger door motor bounces even when it is not connected to any linkage and sounds a bit rough. I suspect the lock position microswitch is the root cause. Can anyone give a second opinion?
 
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