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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all,

After my 1.6 GT Junior engine gave up on me 10 miles from destination on a 300 mile trip last summer, I bought what turned out to be a 2.0 Alfetta engine from eBay as a temporary replacement (listing advertised it as a 105 engine).

I understand that the Alfetta crankshaft may, or may not, have a pilot bushing hole already machined in place that would make it compatible with a 105 gearbox.

Can anyone describe how I would go about identifying this on the Alfetta engine? Does anyone have a photo they are able to post?

Presumably, if the crankshaft doesn't have the pilot bushing hole, I could use a 2000 GTV crankshaft instead?

Thanks in advance,

Michael
 

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You just have to look at the back of the engine with the flywheel removed and you will see if the crank has a spigot bearing or not.

But really with a very very small exeption of some early 116 cars that used left over 105 bits the huge majority did not have drilled cranks as they didn't need to.

If it is an Alfetta engine you will have to strip it, remove the crank, get it machined (it will have to be a good shop as the nitriding went 20-30 thou deep)and fit spigot bearing(we may still have a couple in stock if you get stuck).
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thank you both very much for your help with this.

I'm currently in the process of sourcing the necessary parts for the engine swap and am looking forward to getting the car back on the road again!

Mike
 

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Also make sure that they do not damage any of the oil galleys by using the wrong bit or drilling too deep. This happened to me, which resulted in two engine-outs to diagnose and fix.
 

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There is a company in Coventry that has succesfully drilled the crank on an Alfetta engine whilst still in the engine. I have a customer in Belgium who uses them.
Also, should you have an issue, I have a 1600 105 series engine for sale !
Cheers
Richard
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Thanks El 4 Romeo and Richard for your advice and help. Have a week off now, so will be making a start tomorrow.

Threebox, not sure yet what the problem is with the 1600 engine. The roadside recovery chap from the summer reckoned is was either piston slap or big end trouble. The car had been behaving beautifully for the first 290 or so miles when I noticed I was gradually losing more and more power going up inclines. I pulled off onto a slip road and the engine started making an awful metallic sound for a second or two before I turned it off and pushed it into a layby. The engine wouldn't then start after that, but we did jump start it off the recovery vehicle and it managed a very gentle limp about 500m to a pub car park where it spent the night before being recovered back.

Planing to start work on taking the 1600 engine out tomorrow and looking forward / dreading what I'll find!

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Slow progress

Hi all,

So, I finally got the Alfetta engine stripped down.

The crank didn't have the pilot bearing, as I was hoping (see photo, versus internet (US eBay listing) photo of 105 crankshaft with pilot bearing insitu).

In the meantime, I've bought a 1.6 Alfetta engine also and was wondering how much interchangeability there is between internal components between Alfetta and 105 engines. A few questions to the wise:

1) Could an entire cylinder head with all components be switched across? From browsing the forums, I realise that Alfa marked the Alfetta heads with 16, 18, 20 and the 105 heads with symbols, but are there any differences besides?

2) Could a 2.0 Alfetta cylinder head (with 2.0 crankshafts, valves etc) be fitted onto a 1.6 105 crankcase without modification? Would this improve / worsen performance in any way?

3) Are Alfetta and 105 pistons and conrods interchangeable? Assuming 1.6 is matched to 1.6 etc.

4) Are there components from one engine that are superior to the other in performance? I read one Alfa BB thread that suggested 105 camshafts were superior to Alfetta camshafts and that some Alfetta camshafts were factory fitted with 105 camshafts.

Thanks and best,

Michael
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Jim, many thanks for your help on this.

I wonder if anyone can help me identify this cylinder head on a 2.0L 105 GTV block. I'm told by the previous owner that the engine was rebuilt at some point. The previous owner first sold it to someone else who brought it back saying it was a 1.8L Alfetta head.

Whilst I realise there's an 18 stamped on the cylinder head, there's also the symbol for the 2.0L head, based on this link:

ID Cylinder heads - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums

Can anyone provide me with some much appreciated clarification on this on?

Thanks,

Mike
 

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There is a company in Coventry that has succesfully drilled the crank on an Alfetta engine whilst still in the engine. I have a customer in Belgium who uses them. Also, should you have an issue, I have a 1600 105 series engine for sale !
Cheers Richard
would love to know who can do that!
 

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Whilst I realise there's an 18 stamped on the cylinder head, there's also the symbol for the 2.0L head
the symbol is the one to go by, if you ask me........the 'circled 18' is some internal factory marking, casting batch or the like I would say...I have seen a 'circled 11' on a 1750 head with the triangle symbol, for instance.

I'd say you have a 2,0 litre head there.
 

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I have exactly the same thing, a 2.0 motor with the 2.0 symbol and an 18 in a circle. It's definitely a 2.0 as I have replaced the pistons. I have an Alfetta 1750 motor spare, there is no circle around the 18 and it clearly has a . I.e. 1.8.

Make sure you use the GT Junior water pump as the Alfetta pump has no drive gear for the speedo. Also if you want the mechanical fan there are no mounting holes on the Alfetta pump.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Thank you both very much for your help with this; I'm delighted that it's a 2.0L head.

In terms of replacing the 1.6L engine with this 2.0L engine, can I use the 1.6L GT Junior flywheel and gearbox with the 2.0L engine, or would they be incompatible?

Thanks again,

Mike
 

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Gearbox is compatible, flywheel depends on how late the 1600 junior is, if its after 73 should be ok. Rest of drivetrain is all fine, except you won't have the LSD that was factory fitted to the 2000 GTV. In most people's opinion it's better without it.
 

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In terms of replacing the 1.6L engine with this 2.0L engine, can I use the 1.6L GT Junior flywheel and gearbox with the 2.0L engine, or would they be incompatible?
Mike
As Jim S pointed out in an earlier response, the 2-litre flywheel has 6 bolt holes, GT Junior usually has 8. If you need to get a compatible 2.0-type 6-bolt flywheel, it would be worth getting it and the clutch cover plate dynamically balanced with the crank so that the whole assembly spins up more smoothly. I've just had a 2.0 105 motor balanced and it's a straightforward operation that many engineering/engine-building companies do. You could even get the flywheel lightened at the same time for better throttle response, although you don't want to go too radical on a road engine.

The 1.6 gearbox will be fine.

Good luck with getting it back together.

3B
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Great news, many thanks Greg and Threebox,

I haven't had the 1.6 Junior engine out yet to check the number of bolt holes on the crankshaft. I do have a flywheel from the 2.0 Alfetta engine though. Presumably, this would be compatible with the 2.0 105 engine and 1.6 gearbox? Photo attached.

It's a bit rusty, as you can see in the photo. I presume it would be ok to shot blast the flywheel with aluminium oxide blasting media. Does anyone know of any reason why shot blasting a flywheel would be a bad idea?

Finally, any recommendations for good engineering firms in the South East for engine rebuilding and rebalancing etc?

Thanks as ever,

Mike
 

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The Alfetta flywheel is no good for the 105 conversion, you can't bolt a clutch to it because the Alfetta clutch lives at the other end of the car. The flywheel on the Alfetta engine basically just holds the starter ring gear in place! You need a 105 2 litre flywheel.
 
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