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Discussion Starter #1
I know this subject has been done to death - but I'm not the sharpest tool in the box, and can't afford to throw money away on kit I can't use. Please bear with me!

I've trawled existing threads, and I'd really appreciate someone checking this to see if I've got my facts straight...

I've a Phase 1 '98 V6 GTV.

To get to the ECU and cable plug, I need to remove two small nuts by the footwell and lift up the back seat.

If I have a Becker ECU, I can reset it with "a switch and a bit of wire" (can anyone elaborate?).

If I have a TRW ECU, I need to check whether I have a TRW1 or TRW2 by serial number (anyone know where?).

TRW Version 1 can be gone by most garages (right? How much would it cost for a non-rip-off garage to do this? Can I do it myself using any FREE software, or do I need to fork out for full versions? Is this the right cable for Ph1 GTV?)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FiatECUScan-3-Pin-plug-KKL-vag-ODB-Engine-Airbag-Alfa-Fiat-Punto-145-146-155-/280800847183?pt=UK_Diagnostic_Tools_Equipment&hash=item416108e54f#ht_557wt_1187

TRW Version 2 - I'm stuffed, and will have to go to a main dealership, or a garage that has FIAT EXAMINER, possibly getting them to put in "Alfa 145" to get it to talk to the ECU.

Another option would be to replace the ECU (if I'm sure that the ECU is the problem, and there isn't actually a pretensioner problem...).

Can anyone recommend a good garage in the Cheltenham area (pref Indy)? Google is rubbish at finding Alfa Indys. Failing that, I'd be willing to travel to Worcester, Bristol, Oxford areas...

Finally, is there anything really stupid I can do that would make the airbag go bang?

I know I'm asking lots of questions. I'd really appreciate the help, and I'm sure other P1 GTV owners would benefit...

Many thanks in advance!
 

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You should always disconnect the battery before unplugging air bag connectors.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks AlexGS. I plan to have an initial poke this weekend.

If all goes well, it's probably worth me trying to write a "How To", and put the issue to bed once and for all (for Ph1 at least - poss someone else can step up and do Ph2 and Spiders?).

If anyone can fill in the gaps (especially on the DIY reset bits), I'd appreciate it.
 

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I'll fill in some info as far as I know it.


The Ph1 GTV/Spider can have either of two different airbag ECUs (at least the 2.0TS which I have):

1) 60625181 TRW
2) 60610206 Becker

If you look in EPER at least the 60625181 has been superseeded by another p/n, so I guess you can find some other p/n as well.


Concerning 1) TRW:
If the unit works as it should with no errors present, the airbag waring light should light up when you turn on the ignition and stay on for 4 seconds before it goes off. If it stays on there is an error stored in the ECU.

There's currently no DIY software to read and clear error codes from this unit. You need the the official FIAT/Alfa diagnostic tools to do this.


Concerning 2) Becker:
When turning on the ignition the behavior is the same as for the TRW unit. Warning light on for 4s.

The Becker unit can display error codes by blinking the warning light. You activate the blinking by connecting pin 3 to ground for 1 to 5 seconds. If more than one error is present they are shown sequencially. Errors are decoded according to the following:

01 blinks - no fault
02 blinks - sensor fault
03 blinks - airbag ignition circuit short circuit to VBatt
04 blinks - airbag ignition circuit short circuit to GND
05 blinks - driver airbag charge resistanstance out of tolerance
06 blinks - passenger airbag charge resistanstance out of tolerance
07 blinks - battery low voltage
08 blinks - faulty warning lamp or wiring
09 blinks - crash data present
10 blinks - pretensioner ignition circuit short circuit to VBatt
11 blinks - pretensioner ignition circuit short circuit to GND
12 blinks - primary circuit of the driver pretensioner interrupted
13 blinks - primary circuit of the passenger pretensioner interrupted

Note that "driver" and "passenger" probably refers to a car for the Italian market, i.e. left hand drive. It might be the other way around for a RHD car.

Fault codes can be deleted (exception fault code 09) by connecting pin 3 to ground for 5 to 10 seconds. One fault at the time is deleted.

If you experience error 05, 06, 12 or 13 try cleaning the corresponding connector in the yellow cable harness.
 

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I'll fill in some info as far as I know it.


The Ph1 GTV/Spider can have either of two different airbag ECUs (at least the 2.0TS which I have):

1) 60625181 TRW
2) 60610206 Becker

If you look in EPER at least the 60625181 has been superseeded by another p/n, so I guess you can find some other p/n as well.


Concerning 1) TRW:
If the unit works as it should with no errors present, the airbag waring light should light up when you turn on the ignition and stay on for 4 seconds before it goes off. If it stays on there is an error stored in the ECU.

There's currently no DIY software to read and clear error codes from this unit. You need the the official FIAT/Alfa diagnostic tools to do this.


Concerning 2) Becker:
When turning on the ignition the behavior is the same as for the TRW unit. Warning light on for 4s.

The Becker unit can display error codes by blinking the warning light. You activate the blinking by connecting pin 3 to ground for 1 to 5 seconds. If more than one error is present they are shown sequencially. Errors are decoded according to the following:

01 blinks - no fault
02 blinks - sensor fault
03 blinks - airbag ignition circuit short circuit to VBatt
04 blinks - airbag ignition circuit short circuit to GND
05 blinks - driver airbag charge resistanstance out of tolerance
06 blinks - passenger airbag charge resistanstance out of tolerance
07 blinks - battery low voltage
08 blinks - faulty warning lamp or wiring
09 blinks - crash data present
10 blinks - pretensioner ignition circuit short circuit to VBatt
11 blinks - pretensioner ignition circuit short circuit to GND
12 blinks - primary circuit of the driver pretensioner interrupted
13 blinks - primary circuit of the passenger pretensioner interrupted

Note that "driver" and "passenger" probably refers to a car for the Italian market, i.e. left hand drive. It might be the other way around for a RHD car.

Fault codes can be deleted (exception fault code 09) by connecting pin 3 to ground for 5 to 10 seconds. One fault at the time is deleted.

If you experience error 05, 06, 12 or 13 try cleaning the corresponding connector in the yellow cable harness.
Great post redtop_68, am i understanding you correctly in that i believe that you demonstrate that diagnostic software is not needed to reset fault codes with exception of 09 and a bit of wire is all that we need?:)
 

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Great post redtop_68, am i understanding you correctly in that i believe that you demonstrate that diagnostic software is not needed to reset fault codes with exception of 09 and a bit of wire is all that we need?:)
Yes and no! :)

For the Becker (60610206) unit no software is needed, just a piece of wire. The wire trick won't work on the TRW (60625181) unit.

If you have crash data present (09) then this error can't be cleared with a diagnostic tool either. The idea from Alfa Romeo is that you change the whole unit for a new one in case of a crash. Anyway, crash data can be cleared, but in order to do so you need to access the memory chip in the ECU directly, wich involves dismantling of the ECU, soldering, electronic skills etc. etc. You can have a look at Ebay for airbag repair. You can get crash data cleared for like £35, on the other hand I just bought a used 60625181 ECU for £20 on Ebay.
 

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Many thanks! I believe that you in 2 posts have cleared up the headache and previously unanswered question for many/most P1 owners.:):thumbs:

This thread should be a "Sticky" in the "How To" section.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Just popped the rear seat. Saw the dreaded letters... "TRW" :cry: Serial number 60664500

Anyone got a second hand airbag ECU they want rid of?
Are there any other ECUs that will fit an old P1 3.0 V6 GTV? Could I nick one from another model Alfa? Pff... Rubbish.
 

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Is yours a P1 alfaoptimist? If so i can help you out with a straight forward bolt in cleared airbag ecu from a twinspark? This car had no airbag light on when before i started to dismantle. Can't remember if its Becker or TRW but it is clear. If it's a becker? £1m please!:lol:
 

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Let me check the part no, it should'nt matter as its the loom which i believe is fundamentally the same for both TS & V6? wait until someone confirms or destroy? which will give me enough time ( until tomorrow) to get at the car & quote P/N and we'll take it from there.:)
 

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Just popped the rear seat. Saw the dreaded letters... "TRW" :cry: Serial number 60664500

Anyone got a second hand airbag ECU they want rid of?
Are there any other ECUs that will fit an old P1 3.0 V6 GTV? Could I nick one from another model Alfa? Pff... Rubbish.
Have you tried connecting to it with Alfadiag, FIATECUScan, and AlfaOBD? It's not the dreaded version that won't, so you should be able to...

-Alex
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Have you tried connecting to it with Alfadiag, FIATECUScan, and AlfaOBD? It's not the dreaded version that won't, so you should be able to...

-Alex
So - just to be clear... TRW Serial number 60664500 is fine for AlfaDiag and the like? I was under the impression that it wasn't... :confused:
 

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Hi mate, if this does sort your problem then happy days! I still have not got near the car to remove ECU and the new server deleted all my PM's so i was attempting to remember who i was grabbing parts for and then i saw this thread and remembered i was to get back to you. I'll keep an eye now.:)
 

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It occured to me that a dishonest person could possibly rewire the the warning lights so that the airbag light came on and went off with the seatbelt light which is just on a five second ish timer.... my seatbelt light stays on for five seconds ish.. any thoughts??

I may delete this post in the near future..
 
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