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Discussion Starter #1
Except it wasn't.

A veto prevents something from happening.

Cameron just refused to join in with the others. So now the UK has absolutely no influence over the Euro crisis (as opposed to nearly no influence, which we had last week). If the Eurozone collapses it will wreck what little export industry we still have, and Camero. Thought leaving them to it was a good idea.

What a momentous error.
 

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Except it wasn't.

A veto prevents something from happening.

Cameron just refused to join in with the others. So now the UK has absolutely no influence over the Euro crisis (as opposed to nearly no influence, which we had last week). If the Eurozone collapses it will wreck what little export industry we still have, and Camero. Thought leaving them to it was a good idea.

What a momentous error.
Yep. :(
 

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totally disagree. joining in would mean sucking tax revenue out of london and pasting it all over europe to plug gaps left by greece, spain, italy & portugal. i doubt we'll lose much trade - trade is governed by supply & demand which is immune from the vagaries of the EU unless they decide to levy duty on UK goods & services being sold within the 17 EU signees, which they won't
 

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I'm fairly pro-Europe, so when I first heard about it, I thought uh oh. Looking into it a bit more, it doesn't seem quite so bad. I haven't got my head round it fully yet though.
 
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On the plus side I believe he's still got his ball because he's taken it home with him.
 

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Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Mind you, I'm not sure washing your hands of the whole situation is a good idea?
 

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Al, if the other economies are ****ed, the trade levels are ****ed. Like it or not, we are intrinsically linked to the European Economic Area.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't was used above. Pretty much spot on, but I think doing an ostrich will help noone.
 

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i used to be very pro european but these days i'm not so sure. joining in any treaty which increases our exposure to a load of basket case economies outweighs any loss of trade i reckon
 

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I think Al is correct.

Nothing to be gained by signing up to a Euro treaty that hurts the City. Like it or not, it's a massive earner for UK Plc, plus a major provider of jobs. Shame some people can't understand that.

If other countries want to impose a Tobin tax on their own banks, good luck to them; more business for the UK and Switzerland at the end of the day.

The Euro is doomed; let the other countries stick their fingers in the dyke, we are better off outside the whole rotten edifice.
 

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Al, if the other economies are ****ed, the trade levels are ****ed. Like it or not, we are intrinsically linked to the European Economic Area.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't was used above. Pretty much spot on, but I think doing an ostrich will help noone.
The Independent today probably sums it up equally well.......he had a poor hand and played it badly.

Part of the problem here is that he wants the benefits of close relations with Europe while maintaining distance in some important areas, most notably economic regulation. Politically, for anyone, it's a difficult juggling act, if it is, indeed, possible at all. I'm not necessarily saying that Cameron, himself, is beyond it, but I truly believe that he will have had his legs whipped from underneath him by his party if he'd made concessions.

Have people noticed that, in some quarters, the economic malaise is now being blamed on us - largely because of the disproportionate amount of European financial business conducted in the City?

Strikes me that if we want to be involved in shaping policy then we need to be within. If we're not within then we're out.....and has Mr Cameron really assessed the true economic risk of that prospect at it's fuller development? I suspect not. Playing tough is all very well in micro, but the broader view needs to be accounted for when you roll your sleeves up for the domestic press.

Does, for example, Mr Cameron's approach take full account of the new world orders developing in the East? Are his policies cognizant of the risks developing from those quarters? What happens if our enshrined financial sector starts to become less influential and attractive?

It's pretty much inevitable now that the EU institutions will be completely focussed on matters pertaining to eurozone interests - and we won't have a damn thing to say about it. Some will argue that was ever the case.
 

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They're all nobs, the whole bloody lot of them :doh:
 

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True True

Some trenchant analysis from The Sun (below):

"WE asked David Cameron to act like Churchill and stand up for Britain. And he did.

The Prime Minister deserves credit for blocking an EU stitch-up over the euro that would have damaged Britain.

For once he had fire in his belly. Now he must show he has more.

Because, like Churchill, he faces a long war of attrition as 26 of the 27 EU nations go one way and we go another.

Mr Cameron has seen off the immediate threat to the City of London as Europe's financial capital.

But Brussels won't give up. From 2013 it will be able to slap extra regulations on the City whether we like it or not.

That's why euphoria from the Tory Right is misplaced. Mr Cameron won a battle on Thursday night, but he hasn't won the war.

We are now in the mother of all muddles. Despite hissy fits from strutting Sarko, the euro is no safer and Europe still on the brink of economic catastrophe.

Equally, gloom-laden warnings from the Left and their cheerleaders in the BBC about Britain being dangerously isolated are wide of the mark.

Yes, we have made a welcome stand against Brussels. But we remain a major EU player not least because we pay so many of the bills.

Like Churchill, Mr Cameron must now plot his strategy. In the short term, rescuing our own economy comes before everything.

Next, we must rebalance our relationship with Brussels so Westminster runs Britain again.

It will be a long and hard road, made harder for Mr Cameron by having to keep the Lib Dems on board while his eurosceptics demand EU withdrawal.

Britain's interest lies in being in Europe but not surrendering to Europe.

If so-called isolation means independence, is that a bad thing? We remain a powerful global trading nation, with a solid currency seen even in these dark days as a safe bet.

And that's the crucial point. All this tension in Europe is over the collapsing euro.

That's the eurozone's problem. Only they can sort it out."​

Astonishing guff.:rolleyes:
 
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The issue IMO is that Germany holds all the cards. Until Merkel finally lets the ECB do what it should do, this crisis will just drag on. Sarko is trying to look "big" but in reality he is hanging on to Merkel's (and Germany's) coat tails. The UK is pretty irrelevant to all of this. We still don't know if we want to be in Europe or out of it (and more like Switzerland). It doesn't matter who is in power, Europe is a minefield for any party in the UK (well not UKIP, but they are hardly a party).

Cheers,

Nigel
 

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The only way I see the eurozone getting out of this mess is to 'print' more money.

Ten year Italian bond yields are well over 6% whilst Spains are around 5.75%, if there's no action the markets will punish and yields will rise with the 7% mark seen as the general cut off point for disaster.

IMHO, the ECB has to fire up the printing press and enter the bond markets to keep yields at a sustainable level, I'm not sure attempting to revive bank lending by offering 'unlimited cash for three years' is the best option considering our chancellor is urging UK banks to 'hoard' cash?

With more Q/E comes a risk of higher inflation. Gold holding above $1700 and could benefit from all of this. Having said that, the US has had it's fair share of Q/E with round three around the corner, with so many nations printing money for fun the inflationary affects may be lessend to an extent?

Time will tell, but any extravogant purchases I've been contemplating have been veto'd :)lol:) and I'm currently trying to hoard my own cash supply. :thumbs:
 
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