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..i've never had the TB on track before, but i always reckon if you have on old Alfa and you get half a chance you should definitely take it out :)

My local specialist here, TI Autos, run a great trackday every year for customers, and it's a great chance to get out with similar cars in a relaxed atmosphere.

Anyhow, i only got one session in the 164 because the expansion tank cap split, but she was great fun while i was out. .

I wasn't too optimistic about the brakes and that proved to be well-founded.. they went soft quite quickly, but even before that there's a spongyness to them in my particular car that makes heel-and-toeing impossible, and generally blunts how you'd like to attack the corners. My old tsparks felt way better in this respect. I'd had the brakes bled properly beforehand too (ie not by me! ).. we're gonna need a thread about 164 brake upgrades..!

But the handling was great, really chuckable and adjustable. You can get a little bit of slip going at the back, and you can keep adjusting the car around yourself through a corner.. it's the big hot-hatch cliché but it's true. It feels like it's going to be a little sloppy at first, but once you grab it by the scruff of the neck you'll be grinning all day long :)

The turbo'd V6 was enjoyable too.. nice and strong, and i didn't miss the lovely top end of the NA bussos like i expected.

So i'm left with a couple of things to sort out, but i can't wait to get her out there again. They really are great old cars.. keep the faith..! :)
 

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I used to love chucking my V6 around on Knockhill Track evenings. The brakes would certainly go away quite quickly and visits to the pits to allow everything to cool down would get longer and longer as the session progressed.

As you say, the ride was certainly soft but once you got used to the large roll angles it was great fun. The car's Achilles heel was getting out of the hairpin and up the long hill towards the start line - FWD really wasn't the best for that. I would regularly destroy an O/S front tyre trying to get out of that hairpin quickly! Having said that, the car's antics certainly entertained those watching the action and I always got a lot of grins back in the pits.

The pic shows the car going down through Duffus Dip - this is a really tricky section and the back end was always looking to get ahead of the front! Mind you the pic doesn't look that exciting (it was on the inside!) but maybe that's because it isn't me driving!
 

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Nice one! They are good fun on track indeed. The only car I have had more fun in on the track was a 147 GTA.

As far as brakes are concerned, if you already have poor feel from the go, I would look at changing all hoses for braided first and maybe go for a fluid with a higher boiling point. I have Goodridge hoses fitted and use ATE Super Blue and get a much more constant feel under heavy use. Also, get rid of (bypass) the clutch damper. Easy to do and improves gear change speed and allows for double de-clutching.

I'm taking track events more seriously and am working on uprating shocks with Koni sports. Could be a real track monster once I'm done.
 

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Excellent thread guys! I have to say I've never had mine on a track (although I'm lucky enough to live in a part of the world where there isn't much traffic and the roads are fantastic driving roads)! I agree about grabbing it by the scruff of the neck. It doesn't seem to be a car that rewards delicacy and indecision. (Mrs Avocet hates driving it)!

Alfanano, was that hairpin a right or a left hander? If it was a left hander, (and assuming your car is a right hand drive?) I could see it being terrible for puting the power down. As a right hand drive, the 164 is really heavy on the right hand front wheel with just the driver in it. As a left hand drive, it is pretty well balanced with the driver on the left. If mine is going to break traction, it's always the left hand front wheel that will spin first - especially putting the power down too early while coming out of a left hand bend. (If it was a right hander, forget everything I said)!

All four of my 164 V6 Series 1 cars have always had spongy brakes and long pedal travel. I'm damned if I can do anything about it. They stop the car OK, but the feel isn't terribly reassuring. I've often wondered about doing away with the rubber flexible hoses but don't especially like braided hoses on road cars.

What I've NEVER been able to do though, is get any oversteer. It could be that on a public road, I'm just not being "brave" enough, of course, but the only time I've ever had the back end step out was on a roundabout once, and that was on a car with visible play in the rubber bushes at the bottom of the rear damper. It never did it again after I replaced them.
 

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Alfanano, was that hairpin a right or a left hander? If it was a left hander, (and assuming your car is a right hand drive?) I could see it being terrible for puting the power down. As a right hand drive, the 164 is really heavy on the right hand front wheel with just the driver in it. As a left hand drive, it is pretty well balanced with the driver on the left. If mine is going to break traction, it's always the left hand front wheel that will spin first - especially putting the power down too early while coming out of a left hand bend. (If it was a right hander, forget everything I said)!

All four of my 164 V6 Series 1 cars have always had spongy brakes and long pedal travel. I'm damned if I can do anything about it. They stop the car OK, but the feel isn't terribly reassuring. I've often wondered about doing away with the rubber flexible hoses but don't especially like braided hoses on road cars.

What I've NEVER been able to do though, is get any oversteer. It could be that on a public road, I'm just not being "brave" enough, of course, but the only time I've ever had the back end step out was on a roundabout once, and that was on a car with visible play in the rubber bushes at the bottom of the rear damper. It never did it again after I replaced them.
I'm afraid it's a right hand hairpin.... :depressed:
It's an uphill corner so the apex has got a lot of gradient. When this is combined with the lightly loaded inside wheel, a pretty nasty serrated curb and premature application of too much throttle (desperately wanting to get going up the hill!), you get lots of wheel spin (incl smoke from the O/S front!).

In general road use my V6 brakes were fine - it's just amazing how quickly "normal" brakes overheat and fade when you go out on a track. The 75 is far worse - the inboard rear brakes overheat very quickly (they get very little air cooling) and the fluid boils. The reservoir is cleverly placed over the N/S exhaust manifold so when the fluid starts dripping you get lots of spectacular black smoke coming out from under the bonnet! Interestingly I had both Series 1 and Series 2 TS 164s and the biggest improvement between them was the brakes in the Series 2.

I've certainly had the understeer on the roundabout situation (once on the Dundee ring road with the car in overloaded holiday mode. Of course it was corrected in a trice! - I got cheers from my sons in the back and screams from my wife together with a cry of "What was that?" :biglaugh:) but very few instance in normal driving. You certainly get the beginnings of it on a track but I've never gone fast enough to experience great wallops of lurid opposite lock slides!
 

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Ah well, fair enough! I'm still going to stick my neck out and say it would have been much worse if it had been a left-hander! You're probably lighter than me too :embarrassed:
 
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