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(Post Link) post #1 of 24 Old 29-05-16 Thread Starter
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Lancia Delta TwinTurbo - blew the R2S - now need some better Turbo.

Hey Guys,

last week the big turbo of the BorgWarner R2S from my Delta snapped the wheel and blew to bits on the autobahn.... (epic F1 Style oil burn...)
Now i could buy a remanufactured one ... but as the car is remapped.... i am thinking about getting some upgrade for the R2S system, like a cast turbine / compressor wheel, maybe slightly bigger to allow more airflow with less heat.....

in other words more bang for the diesel.

now to the question,
can you guys suggest someone who can rebuild / upgrade those Turbos?
The Car is mapped to about 2.8 Bar (1.8 Boost) and it would be nice if the "new" Turbine could maintain 2 Bar Boost till 4800 RPM while still spooling at around 2500 RPM
Oh and it would of cause be nice if intertia would not be worsend compared to OEM - as a side not those R2S Systems use "Classic" non VNT Turbos.


best regards.

Selling a Brembo Upgrade for 156's, Project Mu Pads (New) and fitting brake lines (new).

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(Post Link) post #2 of 24 Old 31-05-16 Thread Starter
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just bought a new Turbo (Complete Register Setup, 560Ä incl. Shipping - new!) cheapest and meanest OEM turbo setup you can buy for a 4 Cylinder
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Wow that does sound like a good deal. In regards to go beyond 1.8 BAR boost - most Manifold Pressure Sensors only go to 1.8 BAR - you'll have to get another sensor that has a different "slope" and then map accordingly - It will be quite a bit of work, but doable. Personally 1.8 BAR sounds plenty, rather see if you can widen the RPM at which the peak boost can be held
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The MAP of the Delta can and will measure up to 3 Bar, as it does ATM - i just checked the logs, during hard acceleration in 3rd we had a little overboost and measured 2940mbar....
If the new one can hold that up to 4800 - 5000 RPM it'll generate more power without needing to actually rise absolute boost or torgue (wich would kill the DMF as it vibrates like crazy with only slightly more fuelling below 2000 rpm...)

The engine will rev that high (in fact it revs past 5000 even on OEM Mapping), but with dpf it was not realy usefull... as the DPF got smoked with a lot of 5W-40 it's dead i suppose so most likely it's going to be removed from the car.
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Ah cool - even if it "saturates" a bit, I'm sure it will not be all that bad
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Sounds like the same setup as the Saab 1.9 bi turbos. That being the case, you probably have no charge cooler between the small and large turbo and the "large" turbo is actually very small and I'm not surprised you are blowing them up at that level of boost. You would been needing something of around 42mm inducer to sustain the levels of boost you want and it would be a simple job for a company to do such an upgrade. I was in Germany this week and managed 246.6 kmph on the gps before backing off.
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Hey nutron,

you are correct it is the same setup as on the saab ttid cars. However as it's a blow trough compound fitting a second intercooler is probably pretty hard...

I spoke to turbozentrum berlin but they need to see it first

Thanks for the input on the inducer.
Actually i am pretty surprised that it lasted around 220k kilometers....
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Don't be tempted by a larger turbine if anybody offers it, with the waste gates it will not benefit you.

The engine is uprated from the version I have and I believe has an 80mm maf and R80 fuel pump as standard. You will have to check the TMAP sensor as you'd need a 3.5 or 4.0 bar sensor to safely run 2 bar of boost.

With 2 bar of boost and the dpf still in place you should be able to achieve around 240bhp and if the clutch is upto it 350+lbft.
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Just a short update,

the guys from TurboZentrum called me back - the new turbo arrived.

It will be upgraded to Stage I - new Billet Compressor on the small compressor, the Big one will get a Stage II - Wheel, they quote 15% more flow for the small and around 30% with the big wheel (i'll be happy with 20 ). I alsow opted for ceramic coated housing and exhaust header.

the bad news however: they need 3 (fuc*ing) weeks (three!!!) to get the small compressor wheel.

So another month with the Nissan.... damn the 200sx is not exactly a nice daylie commuter .... (as it needs Ultimate it's pretty damn expensive...)
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Easy, it's pretty common delivery time from China

Last edited by yan.ko; 14-06-16 at 10:02.
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(Post Link) post #11 of 24 Old 14-06-16 Thread Starter
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Yeah.... i know... still.... driving a close to track car day2day is not that much fun actually... besides it does need some care tooo....(wich it can't get as long as...well sometime the delta is back)
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Hey Guys I am back,

something went wrong with my old account so i had to create a new one.....


anyway - it turned out the Problem has not been the Turbo at first hand but a faulty injector causing piston number 3 to melt and debris hitting the turbine wheel caused the bearing of the small turbine to fail....

i now need a new Engine and at least one new Injector.

The question is:
Can i mount the 2.0 Liter Diesel (found in Bravo, Delta and Giulietta) in place of the 1.9 or are certain thins different (like intake position), mounting for the auxillerys, exhaust gasket? Like take a 2.0 Block+Head - just plug and play all the wires, auxillerys - mount the twinturbo and drive the car?

I'd like to get a 1.9 Liter Engine but those come in at around 3500Ä... while the 2.0 come in at about half the money.

best regards
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I think the 2.0 has the intake on the other side of the 1.9 and 2.4 engines (below the right headlight).

the 2.0 injectors are useable in the 1.9, that gives me a lot of hope you can use a 2.0 in a 1.9 engined car.

the 2.0 from a giulietta doesn't have swirl valves, the 2.0 from a 159 does IIRC. I'm unsure if you can use the 1.9 manifold so get an engine that's as close as possible to you 1.9 for compatibility.
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Engine head on 2.0 is quite a bit different, I doubt you will be able to fit exhaust and intake manifolds from 1.9 to it...
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thanks for the input - now trying to figure out if any Z19DTR would fit or if some are somewhat strange and wont go into the Bravo II / Delta engine bay
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Hey BlackSheep what did you do in the end ?
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Saab 93 ttid Z19DTR was fitted, i reused my old CR-Pump (as the saab one uses different connectros) and the Oilpan of the delta was reused.

Car is running and pulls strong - but will need to be remapped again...
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Good going man!!
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Cool ! What did your old engine remap to ?

What pressure does the twin turbo pump run at BTW ?

Last edited by typos1; 09-03-17 at 15:21.
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Oh dear - long has it been.

The Turbo runs at about 2.6-2.8 Bar of Boost now - the "old" Turbine used to crack the 3.0 Mark (intake Pressure).

However i had some time examine it and came to the conclusion that further upgrades to the turbo can be made by optimizing the internal wastegate (wich redirects exhaust gas to the larger turbine). In contrary to the Press Images the Single turbo can not be fully switched off, it will always run - so it's best to enlarge the valve as much as possible to take strain from the small turbine and reduce the heat of the compressed air....

To my Car,
well i timed it a couple of months ago its about 21 Seconds from 100-200kph conservatively driven (only starting in 5th Gear).
If going crazy i think maybe 19-20seconds would be possible (starting off in 3rd...) However as the Gearbox suckxs hard it's more likely to misshift and putt strain to the box without gaining anything....


More power is not possible as the injectors can not flow enough fuel in the short injection window above 4000RPM.... so sadly it's a dead end.
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Originally Posted by BlackSheepTM View Post
Oh dear - long has it been.

The Turbo runs at about 2.6-2.8 Bar of Boost now - the "old" Turbine used to crack the 3.0 Mark (intake Pressure).

However i had some time examine it and came to the conclusion that further upgrades to the turbo can be made by optimizing the internal wastegate (wich redirects exhaust gas to the larger turbine). In contrary to the Press Images the Single turbo can not be fully switched off, it will always run - so it's best to enlarge the valve as much as possible to take strain from the small turbine and reduce the heat of the compressed air....

To my Car,
well i timed it a couple of months ago its about 21 Seconds from 100-200kph conservatively driven (only starting in 5th Gear).
If going crazy i think maybe 19-20seconds would be possible (starting off in 3rd...) However as the Gearbox suckxs hard it's more likely to misshift and putt strain to the box without gaining anything....


More power is not possible as the injectors can not flow enough fuel in the short injection window above 4000RPM.... so sadly it's a dead end.
I was reading up about the twin turbo, although its a 1.9 it has the same EGR system as the 2 litre and 1.6 JTDm and it has, for some reason smaller valves than the other 1.9s. But I ve seen 2 or 3 tuned Delta Twin Turbos (remap, exhaust, intercooler) with 285bhp, which aint bad, almost the same as a single turbo 1.9 with a GTB2056v/Ducati Corsa injectors/larger intercooler, despite the smaller valves and smaller injectors, I bet with different injectors more is possible, even more if you went to the expense of changing the head and adding bigger valves.

Are you considering upgrading your brakes ??
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gertie View Post
Wow that does sound like a good deal. In regards to go beyond 1.8 BAR boost - most Manifold Pressure Sensors only go to 1.8 BAR - you'll have to get another sensor that has a different "slope" and then map accordingly - It will be quite a bit of work, but doable. Personally 1.8 BAR sounds plenty, rather see if you can widen the RPM at which the peak boost can be held
From what I ve found out the 1.9 twin turbo uses the same MAP as the 1.9, so that must be able to measure at least 3bar also.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by typos1 View Post
From what I ve found out the 1.9 twin turbo uses the same MAP as the 1.9, so that must be able to measure at least 3bar also.
Yes I am not sure what I was on about when I wrote that... 3 bar MAP sounds right.
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Lol
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