1.9 jtdm 16v stage 2 remap opinions guys please. - Alfa Romeo Forum
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1.9 jtdm 16v stage 2 remap opinions guys please.

Hi brothers and sisters!
My GT recently was remapped to around 190 bhp and feels more live now,same time my tuner erase EGR valve from ECU and blank it!I have replaced second cat with free flow pipe,K&N air filte,have ordered swirl flaps blanks so its will be done next week! So what else i can modify to get around 210-220 bhp without spending crazy money? For a stage 2 remap I will need FMIC 100%.? Clutch stage2 ?Can stock turbo holds this power or i will need upgrade?
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having been through the exact same process I can tell you this...

swirl flap removal a great idea, I have had it don along with EGR delete and re-map. BUT if power is your aim, now the EGR is gone I would if I had the decision to make again replace with a brand new flapped mani...without exhaust crap going into the mani it should be fine to very high miles..that said failure does tend to be random. there is a direct correlation to mileage though.

I may consider going with a stock mani at the next cambelt as the flaps do give you a bit more low down power.

your stock clutch will absolutely give up as the torque produced at anything above around 190-195 BHP will take it out...options are a dimpled clutch that is fitted to the clover 170 or some kind of stage 2 dual friction clutch, larkspeed, CG motorpsorts or give Joel at JTD performance a shout...he is currently building a custom one for ALFADOIT check out his build thread here..https://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-...and-build.html

I have a stage one myself, the dimpled clover jobbie, it SHOULD be fine at the 210-215 I am planning but IS a weak point. TBH again if I had planned this a bit better I would have gone stage 2 initially. it having been done recently I have decided to limit the map to ''sensible'' to get my moneys worth out of the clutch. I may re-visit the map at a later date.

now to the FM intercooler, well I recently fitted one ...after about 30 mins of driving it developed boost leak which I tracked down to the cooler itself (it was a used one) but it WAS OK for a spell. enough time for me to work out that at the state of tune we are going for does not require an FMIC and in fact added lag to the turbo..I returned back to stock and all good again...we live in the UK even on the warmest days the stock cooler should be able to cope without getting heat soaked unless you are constantly blatting the car or tracking it.

I think an upgrade to the stock intercooler with a more efficient internal but same external sized SMIC may well be a better solution.. you are adding volume to your induction system with an FMIC due to the extra pipework and as I said at this state of tune the inlet temps are not the main issue. in my desire to eliminate Lag I will probably fit these.. Stainless steel turbo pipes and silicone couplers set for Alfa Romeo 1.9 and 2.4 JTD | Sport exhausts | Exhaust manifolds | Sport exhaust systems | Extreme-Tuning.bg these will reduce lag further by eliminating the ballooning of hoses when the turbo spools up.

now onto the turbo, well I have spoken to Aide at AHM and he says 210BHP is easily achievable on the stock turbo and cooler on a HEALTHY ENGINE AND TURBO!, he is a well respected tuner and develops maps on a dyno for many others, NJS in pershore use AHM maps among others...the thing to consider is the age of your turbo and car. if its an old one with 100k plus on it I would get it refurbed and maybe take the time to hybridize it.

I currently have Tom at Turbo Dynamics making me a hybrid as we speak, I picked up a Garrett 777250-1 from a clover with 40k on the clock and he is upgrading thrust bearing,compressor wheel and various other bits to give me a ''bigger turbo''

bear in mind if you plan to upgrade the turbo a custom map will be required as any generic map will be designed to work with the stock turbo...when I fit my new turbo I will be going to Red dot racing for a map tweak to get the best out of it as it will be laggy on the current map even though it is pushing somewhere around the 190BHP mark.


depends what your aims are really..if you are chasing figures and power then stage two clutch,FMIC,hybrid turbo and custom re-map, straight through exhaust system water meth injection , 290 BHP is achievable...I am not sure I want that as reliability and day to day use may be compromised.

you can easily mismatch things by going FMIC with the wrong map or turbo and it will hurt performance, just make sure that whatever you do that things are designed to compliment each other rather than work against each other.

FMIC on stock car and map ..pointless. FMIC with hybrid COULD create more lag, would need to be custom mapped on a dyno. Hybrid turbo on a stock cooler at around 210 BHP..for my needs perfect with a clever map. any more than that an FMIC and a stage 2 clutch upgrade would be required.

here is what is possible with your engine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psDn_ENCa5g



if like me reliability and driveability is more the aim then ,stock cooler, stage one clutch,and a hybrid turbo with a clever custom map avoiding torque spikes...I am aware that pushing much more will potentially push the transmission,injectors and MAF and MAP sensors to the limit of what they are designed...it can all be sorted but has a financial implication.

and finally there is no point in any of this without looking at the stock suspension and factory diff.

I have Bilstien B12 kit Eibach arb kit and a Quaife LSD, without these I would say a 190 BHP+GT would be un-drivable...or at least not much fun in anything but a straight line.

no point in all that power if you can't safely use it.

good luck with your project
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeymannero View Post
having been through the exact same process I can tell you this...

swirl flap removal a great idea, I have had it don along with EGR delete and re-map. BUT if power is your aim, now the EGR is gone I would if I had the decision to make again replace with a brand new flapped mani...without exhaust crap going into the mani it should be fine to very high miles..that said failure does tend to be random. there is a direct correlation to mileage though.

I may consider going with a stock mani at the next cambelt as the flaps do give you a bit more low down power.

your stock clutch will absolutely give up as the torque produced at anything above around 190-195 BHP will take it out...options are a dimpled clutch that is fitted to the clover 170 or some kind of stage 2 dual friction clutch, larkspeed, CG motorpsorts or give Joel at JTD performance a shout...he is currently building a custom one for ALFADOIT check out his build thread here..https://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-...and-build.html

I have a stage one myself, the dimpled clover jobbie, it SHOULD be fine at the 210-215 I am planning but IS a weak point. TBH again if I had planned this a bit better I would have gone stage 2 initially. it having been done recently I have decided to limit the map to ''sensible'' to get my moneys worth out of the clutch. I may re-visit the map at a later date.

now to the FM intercooler, well I recently fitted one ...after about 30 mins of driving it developed boost leak which I tracked down to the cooler itself (it was a used one) but it WAS OK for a spell. enough time for me to work out that at the state of tune we are going for does not require an FMIC and in fact added lag to the turbo..I returned back to stock and all good again...we live in the UK even on the warmest days the stock cooler should be able to cope without getting heat soaked unless you are constantly blatting the car or tracking it.

I think an upgrade to the stock intercooler with a more efficient internal but same external sized SMIC may well be a better solution.. you are adding volume to your induction system with an FMIC due to the extra pipework and as I said at this state of tune the inlet temps are not the main issue. in my desire to eliminate Lag I will probably fit these.. Stainless steel turbo pipes and silicone couplers set for Alfa Romeo 1.9 and 2.4 JTD | Sport exhausts | Exhaust manifolds | Sport exhaust systems | Extreme-Tuning.bg these will reduce lag further by eliminating the ballooning of hoses when the turbo spools up.

now onto the turbo, well I have spoken to Aide at AHM and he says 210BHP is easily achievable on the stock turbo and cooler on a HEALTHY ENGINE AND TURBO!, he is a well respected tuner and develops maps on a dyno for many others, NJS in pershore use AHM maps among others...the thing to consider is the age of your turbo and car. if its an old one with 100k plus on it I would get it refurbed and maybe take the time to hybridize it.

I currently have Tom at Turbo Dynamics making me a hybrid as we speak, I picked up a Garrett 777250-1 from a clover with 40k on the clock and he is upgrading thrust bearing,compressor wheel and various other bits to give me a ''bigger turbo''

bear in mind if you plan to upgrade the turbo a custom map will be required as any generic map will be designed to work with the stock turbo...when I fit my new turbo I will be going to Red dot racing for a map tweak to get the best out of it as it will be laggy on the current map even though it is pushing somewhere around the 190BHP mark.


depends what your aims are really..if you are chasing figures and power then stage two clutch,FMIC,hybrid turbo and custom re-map, straight through exhaust system water meth injection , 290 BHP is achievable...I am not sure I want that as reliability and day to day use may be compromised.

you can easily mismatch things by going FMIC with the wrong map or turbo and it will hurt performance, just make sure that whatever you do that things are designed to compliment each other rather than work against each other.

FMIC on stock car and map ..pointless. FMIC with hybrid COULD create more lag, would need to be custom mapped on a dyno. Hybrid turbo on a stock cooler at around 210 BHP..for my needs perfect with a clever map. any more than that an FMIC and a stage 2 clutch upgrade would be required.

here is what is possible with your engine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psDn_ENCa5g



if like me reliability and driveability is more the aim then ,stock cooler, stage one clutch,and a hybrid turbo with a clever custom map avoiding torque spikes...I am aware that pushing much more will potentially push the transmission,injectors and MAF and MAP sensors to the limit of what they are designed...it can all be sorted but has a financial implication.

and finally there is no point in any of this without looking at the stock suspension and factory diff.

I have Bilstien B12 kit Eibach arb kit and a Quaife LSD, without these I would say a 190 BHP+GT would be un-drivable...or at least not much fun in anything but a straight line.

no point in all that power if you can't safely use it.

good luck with your project
THANKS FOR SUCH A GREAT RESPONCE!
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my pleasure,

I wish someone had taken the time to do the same for me when undertaking this project, it would have saved me at least 2k as i would have done the stage two clutch straight away, not bothered with any FMIC tinkering and had the hybrid turbo done straight away and then ONE custom dyno map map. as it is i will have done two re-maps and two clutches by the end.


up too 210 BHP is fine on a stock car with lowish miles only the clutch will need an upgrade and turbo life ill be reduced.

any higher than that and thats when an FMIC and hybrid really come into their own.

ps gearbox is also a weak point with the factory Diff.

Quaife or be prepared to lose the box at some point.
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1.9CDTI 16v

Since the swirl valves only funcion in conjunction with the EGR valve, you would be wasting time, money and effort fitting another flapped manifold. A deflapped manifold will increase air flow and improve performance at all rpms.

The standard clutch in the Vauxhall range of 1.9cdtis holds upto about 340lbft at the road wheels but I can't speak for what you have.

There is no point doing anythignelse though on a standard turbo as it can not safely flow more air. Fit a hybrid and higher flow 229 or 327 injectors, then remap. If you have a big enough turbo you can see 270bhp and 400lbft from that.

I'm currently running the 327 injectors and a GT1858 hybrid that maxes the 80mm maf (800kg/hr) at 3500rpm. That sees 225whp (258bhp) and 355lbft at the road (537NM est flywheel).

Universal turbos or TDI Turbos are where I go for reliable work.

Oh and don't use a hydrid on a standard cooler, it could rupture as it is not designed to take the higher pressures and temperatures.

Last edited by nutron; 22-01-16 at 15:29.
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Originally Posted by nutron View Post
Since the swirl valves only funcion in conjunction with the EGR valve, you would be wasting time, money and effort fitting another flapped manifold. A deflapped manifold will increase air flow and improve performance at all rpms.

The standard clutch in the Vauxhall range of 1.9cdtis holds upto about 340lbft at the road wheels but I can't speak for what you have.

There is no point doing anythignelse though on a standard turbo as it can not safely flow more air. Fit a hybrid and higher flow 229 or 327 injectors, then remap. If you have a big enough turbo you can see 270bhp and 400lbft from that.

I'm currently running the 327 injectors and a GT1858 hybrid that maxes the 80mm maf (800kg/hr) at 3500rpm. That sees 225whp (258bhp) and 355lbft at the road (537NM est flywheel).

Universal turbos or TDI Turbos are where I go for reliable work.

Oh and don't use a hydrid on a standard cooler, it could rupture as it is not designed to take the higher pressures and temperatures.
Thanks!Anyone knows any good website to order correct swirl flaps blanks? and also LSD ?
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THANKS FOR SUCH A GREAT RESPONCE!
JTD-PERFORMANCE good for a tuning parts?
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JTD-PERFORMANCE good for a tuning parts?
Not good, but great
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my pleasure,

I wish someone had taken the time to do the same for me when undertaking this project, it would have saved me at least 2k as i would have done the stage two clutch straight away, not bothered with any FMIC tinkering and had the hybrid turbo done straight away and then ONE custom dyno map map. as it is i will have done two re-maps and two clutches by the end.


up too 210 BHP is fine on a stock car with lowish miles only the clutch will need an upgrade and turbo life ill be reduced.

any higher than that and thats when an FMIC and hybrid really come into their own.

ps gearbox is also a weak point with the factory Diff.

Quaife or be prepared to lose the box at some point.
my car 116k miles on the clock
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Not good, but great
Have compared prices with other tuning web-stores and jtd-performance i say have a lower prices on all items.
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