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Tuning & Upgrades Discuss performance enhancements for your Alfa Romeo

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(Post Link) post #1 of 596 Old 15-03-15 Thread Starter
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JTD 8V with JTDm turbo / now JTDm 16v Stilo

Hi guys,

at the moment i fit a JTDm turbo (55214063) on a JTD 8V 115.

I don't find any picutres of such conversion, so i'll show all my pictures here, to help other people they want also do this conversion.

First: GT1749V vs. GTA1749V (or GT1749VB)
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_001.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_002.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_003.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_004.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_005.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_006.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_007.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_008.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_009.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_010.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_011.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_012.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_013.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_014.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_015.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_016.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_017.jpg

Then i've checked the outlet position
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_018.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_019.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_020.jpg

look at the different flanges
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_021.jpg

Drawing of the flanges
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...rboflansch.jpg

Drawing of the "long hole idea"
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...nsch_final.jpg

First fitment test with long holes on the manifold
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_022.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_023.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_024.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_025.jpg

Then i have modified the turbine housing
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_026.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_027.jpg

Finished
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_028.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_029.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_030.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_031.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_032.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_033.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_034.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_035.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_036.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_037.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_038.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_039.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_040.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...v_jtdm_041.jpg

It would be nice, that somebody can give us some informations, what is possible with this turbo (smokefree). We look to 170hp.

It's a Fiat Stilo with Downpipe. The oxygen catalytic converter is still in the car but i have removed the middle silencer and have mounted a free flow exhaust. Bigger MAP is already in there and an also a SMIC oil cooler. EGR is already completely removed.


greetings
Chris

Last edited by crossshot; 29-12-18 at 14:18.
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as far as I can remember that turbo number looks to be the last incarnation and the same as the turbo that comes on the jtdm 16v 170hp ducati models(but identicle size wise to the later jtdm 16v 150hp models)
im sure guys have done this mod before if you can search and find there thread it might help.
anyway heres the std boost map off the ducati, this will help for sure to guide you of what its capable of standard, it is ok for more but most recommend 2500-2600mbar limit for safety.
Attachment 471866

of course you will need more fuel than the ducati to reach the same 170hp and most definitely a touch more boost as your only 8v it wont flow as well top end .
you will most likely need to mod vnt maps also and might not be as easy as just copying maps off jtdm most likely lots of logging and mods to vnt maps

Last edited by sussexa; 02-12-15 at 20:08.
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Stock intercooler or FMIC?

With FMIC 180HP is possible.
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FMIC comes a little bit later. But SMIC get the best air flow at the moment

http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...er_jtd_015.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...er_jtd_019.jpg
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some figures in here
https://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/tunin...5cv-turbo.html
although looked to be a hybrid of jtd/jtdm turbos on an 8v
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Thank you, sussexa

ECU File of a 150HP Multijet Fiat Stilo with JTDm Turbo is avalible to copy some informations.
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yes I can put up here vnt maps from my oe map later
who is doing mapping ? if no one yet its worth pm tribesman
its worth doing the fmic now as youll need to alter stuff again after, might as well do all supporting mods first if possible that is
here was my fmic install with pics and a graph to show lower temps and gained mass air (even at lower boost,)
Technical: Fitting a bigger intercooler - Page 2 - The FIAT Forum
usefull to you as your smic looks as mine was also your grills look nicely opened up already over the standard bumper.

also a custom made smic in alloy and deeper would work well in stilo I think, swap likje for like but cost more to make over ebay fmic coolers
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First tests with the prototyp fmic looks great. The charged air temperature was always 19 degrees over outside temperature. I ask for post some pictures.

The mapping comes from a very nice guy. He know what he do and he knows my drive-style. Always full throttle (i love germany). At the moment i drive with stock turbo 142HP/335Nm smokefree. And now i want more.
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do the pics in the fiatforum link not show up for you ? I think I put all pics I had in that thread.
and just to clarify you have a stilo jtdm map file or you want one ?
heres a jtdm 170hp map
http://www.ecuconnections.com/forum/...p?f=44&t=20709
heres my stilo jtdm 150 map
http://www.ecuconnections.com/forum/...lit=stilo+jtdm

Last edited by sussexa; 15-03-15 at 14:00.
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I see the pics, thank you. But i dont like to long intake pipes. The prototyp fmic has booth connections on one side. So we have very short pipes.
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FMIC with inlet and outlet on the same side is not good because of high pressure drop.
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Do you have logs about this or is it theoretically?
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something like this with modded in out angles would be ideal straight swap very short runs, but better cooling over standard , at 170 hp with that turbo I wouldn't expect massive inlet temps.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mazda-RX-7...item4624c20ea1
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Haven't done any myself, but you can find some articles on internet.
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as above I remember maybe twinpass 2 to 2.5 psi drop vs single pass1 to 1.5 psi drop.
but you could see more or less any end of these figures depending on quality and design of the core, ie a quality twinpass could have lower psi drop than a poor design single pass but in general single pass are preferred unless routing just cant be done.
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Does anyone know the exhaust port diameter of the cylinder head (after valve)?
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Exhaust valve throat diameter is about 29 mm on 8v head
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Thanks
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Here are two pics of the intercooler.

http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...au/llk_001.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...au/llk_002.jpg

The dimensions are 480x250x72mm (without pipes)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crossshot View Post
small update here
After the adaptation i wanted to clean the turbo...
Good idea but no good news. The turbo was a used item from italy with little kilometer. But the turbine-side is completely damaged.

Now i have sent the turbo to a "repair-guy" from austria.
Ouch, that's too bad.
Are you sending the turbo to Alex (ZturboZwettl) maybe?
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Yes, i have send the turbo to Alex (Home - Z-TURBO) :-) Do you know him? He was recommended to me.

Last edited by crossshot; 08-04-15 at 19:30.
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Yes, i have send the turbo to Alex (Home - Z-TURBO) :-) Do you know him? He was recommended to me.
I don't know him personally, but I know he's a well respected member at TDIclub so your turbo should be in good hands.
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read a lot of good stuff off him too on there(if hes majesty78)
worth thinking of modifications while with him?
if the compressor side has been damaged at all id think about a slightly larger extended tip wheel, would require machine work to housing but open up a bit of higher boost reliability
like this
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MFS-49mm-6...item27fc2fc810
see what he rekons

Last edited by sussexa; 09-04-15 at 19:58.
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I do not like hybrid turbos. After the repair i have a good turbocharger for 170 to 180HP. In 60.000km i must change the timing belt and then i want do the next steps with bigger fuel pump & GTB :-)

I drive my car daily with full throttle over the german autbahn. I don't like to use the maximum limit of the turbocharger.

Here some pictures of my converted muffler.

Drawing:
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_000.jpg

Destroyed a brand new muffler
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_001.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_002.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_003.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_004.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_005.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_006.jpg

New end-plate for two outlet-ports
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_007.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_008.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_009.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_010.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_011.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_012.jpg

final angle
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_013.jpg

free flow structure
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_014.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_015.jpg
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_016.jpg

after first welding (bad welding...)
http://www.danverclan.de/media/pics/...td_esd_017.jpg

tomorrow i get it back from second welding
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