159 2.4jtdm 200cv - SMALL UPGRADE - OPINION - Alfa Romeo Forum
You are currently unregistered, register for more features.    
Tuning & Upgrades Discuss performance enhancements for your Alfa Romeo

 
Thread Tools
(Post Link) post #1 of 14 Old 21-01-14 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Italy
County: Potenza
Posts: 88
159 2.4jtdm 200cv - SMALL UPGRADE - OPINION

Hello,
I have a 159 2.4 200cv.
Original turbocharger is KKK Bv50 and original boot around 2400mbar absolute.

I want to upgrade a bit, my goal is around 240cv.
In your opinion how much I have to inject? How much pressure?

I want to start from 90mm3 and 2600mbar, in your opinion how much cv in this configuration?

Do you know clutch limits of this car?

Hardware change projected are : DPF removal, EGR removal, Cotton Air filter, I prefer to leave ori I wouldn't upgrade turbocharger if possible...
carisiogolf is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Portugal
County: Porto
Posts: 157

Member car:

Brera 2.4 JTD

You may be able to do 90mm3 at low revs with 2.6bar without smoke, but you won't have enough air on higher revs.
You should start by removing the DPF.
exar1711 is offline  
(Post Link) post #3 of 14 Old 21-01-14 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Italy
County: Potenza
Posts: 88
Yes for sure i remove dpf, I have to clean intake manifolds also, I have opened EGR valve and there is a lor of smoke in intake manifolds.

Do you have a car with the same engine? Do you have upgrade turbo at gtb or better?
carisiogolf is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Portugal
County: Porto
Posts: 157

Member car:

Brera 2.4 JTD

I have the same engine, still with stock turbo. I would not upgrade to gtb2056, it is better, but if you are going to make an investment, go for a gtb2260 at least, ball bearing would be best. There are also new gen bigger vnt turbos from garrett to consider.

Clean the manifold and close the EGR. Cleaning the manifold is a big job, so it's a good time to remove the swirls. I didn't remove them when I cleaned it and I'm sorry for that, they started malfunctioning and had to be disabled later.
exar1711 is offline  
(Post Link) post #5 of 14 Old 21-01-14 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Italy
County: Potenza
Posts: 88
Yes, I have to remove swirl, also mine started malfunctioning and still I clean intake manifold I have blocked them opened because I have problem in coold starting.

How much boost you are running with kkk? and How much fuel do you inject?
carisiogolf is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Portugal
County: Porto
Posts: 157

Member car:

Brera 2.4 JTD

So far I did 88mm3 at 2200rpm, going down to 80 at 4000rpm. I don't have boost values in my head except max value is 2650mb. This is not optimized, I need to spend more time with the timing.
exar1711 is offline  
(Post Link) post #7 of 14 Old 21-01-14 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Italy
County: Potenza
Posts: 88
Why timing?in 210cv file that has the same injector of 200cv there is timing map scaled up to 100mm3 and also new soi, do you have see that?
Do you think that bv50 is capable of 2650mbar without broken it self after few kmeters?
carisiogolf is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Portugal
County: Porto
Posts: 157

Member car:

Brera 2.4 JTD

I don't know if they have the same injectors, but I don't think so. Even so, stock timing is not necessarily ideal timing for power.

2650mb should be easy (absolute pressure of course), it can probably go a lot more, but log manifold intake temperature and vnt% to get a better a idea.
exar1711 is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Spain
County: Barcelona
Posts: 117
In my grande punto 1.9mjtd 8v KKK BV50 it's running 3000mb ( 3000-5000rpm) making 250 hp 480Nm. But I don't know is the equivalence on 2.4 mjtd engine. Anybody knows it?
Vic_O_O is offline  
Status: no pain, no gain
AO Silver Member
 
yan.ko's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Czech Republic
County: Moravskoslezský
Posts: 1,951
Garage
sure, calculate the airflow
yan.ko is offline  
Status: [URL
AO Silver Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Wrexham
Posts: 1,758
Its got 1 extra cylinder to fill id expect it to need to flow min of 20% more air , may be more depending on how the 5 cylinders overlap during cylinder filling.
So you cant relate 3bar on a 4 cylinder to ok for a 5 cylinder.
sussexa is offline  
(Post Link) post #12 of 14 Old 22-01-14 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Italy
County: Potenza
Posts: 88
Do you have flow chart of bv50alfa? I have see vnt vane and it seems a Little toy cimpared to gtb that i have fitted on My 1.9jtd!
carisiogolf is offline  
(Post Link) post #13 of 14 Old 24-01-14 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Italy
County: Potenza
Posts: 88
Someone of you have tested clutch limit of this car?
carisiogolf is offline  
(Post Link) post #14 of 14 Old 25-01-14 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Italy
County: Potenza
Posts: 88
Today I Have cleaned intake manifold and removed swirl cutting them.

The collectors were very dirty, especially the first 3 cylinders. the swirl were very dirty I cut leaving free passage, I hope I have not done damage.
The turbo pressure sensor was full of smoke.

The car is now much more lively at low speeds, and has a higher acceleration despite still has the DPF.

In addition, the starting of the engine is now perfect!
carisiogolf is offline  
Reply

Go Back   Alfa Romeo Forum > Supported Alfa Romeo Models > Technical & Vehicle Assistance > Tuning & Upgrades

Tags
159 , 200cv , 24jtdm , opinion , small , upgrade

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome