156 V6 induction replacement... A full detail tutorial - Alfa Romeo Forum
You are currently unregistered, register for more features.    
Tuning & Upgrades Discuss performance enhancements for your Alfa Romeo

 1Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
156 V6 induction replacement... A full detail tutorial

Ok, many V6 owners have common issues with the original convoluted rubber tube that connects to the throttle body.. Over time this starts to split and deteriorate. your Maf ends up out of whack trying to balance the airflow with what it thinks is correct but does not correlate with what the lambda sensor indicates, thus running lean.

This in turn can cause idlle problems, throttle body getting dirtier and lack of performance

A lot of V6 owners turn to quick fixes like duct tape but that is like patching the Titanic really.
You can also replace it with OE but costs a fortune from the main dealers as they sell it with the entire plastic helmholtz tube all the way down to the maf

So what's the cure?
Simple... Make it stronger than OE and while you are at it, give the engine bay a pep up with bling and a couple of extra horses to boot.

Something like this kit!

There are many ways to do this but usually involves Silicone bends, alloy pipe work and either silicone T-pieces or small breather filters..

The breather filter effectively eliminates the need to have a breather pipe attached but has its pit falls:
1. its illegal. you are pumping unmetered fumes into the atmosphere that should be recirculated, YOU WILL FAIL YOUR MOT, trust me on this... I'm a Vosa MOT inspector

2. Tiny little oil droplets from the breather pipes lubricate your throttle body to work properly and prevent it from sticking... cutting that lubrication off that is supposed to be there is never a good thing.


Now we get to T-pieces be it alloy or silicon, that's better.... at least you can connect the breather pipe straight to the induction system.... Right?

Well.... there is a slight problem with that too (yes I have checked this out thoroughly)

1, The original convoluted rubber pipe may have a larger bore going to it but if we actually take the time to look inside or disect it you will find that the exit hole into the convoluted pipe is only 3mm! I think the suppliers who sell these will contest it but there is a very good reason for the original 3mm hole
The T-pieces you buy are 25mm!
Is that a bad thing?
Well yeah it can be
Those oil droplets nowhave a nice big smooth uninterupted bore to start running down your pipe work all the way to your vunerable MAF sensor when on idle, they drop on it and it ends up getting coated with dirt over time and then we end up seeing threads complaining about Maf issues and everyone jumps on the bandwaggon and blames the aftermarket filter they installed.... A maf can get dirty from either side up or down... remember that!

That tiny lip provided by having a 3mm hole is enough to build up a pool of droplets when idling and then has the suction from normal throttle situations to dissapate it safely as it gets sucked through the throttle body when you pull away


Now we have got that little lot out the way, we can start to plan a replacement that follows the design points of the original pipes.
Do we need to follow the exact route?
No, but certain rules needs to be met.
The MAF should be a minimum of 30 cm (12") from the throttle body to create the correct vortex speed of air flow, too close and you get buffeting.

Size of bore! 76mm
It would be ideal for petrol heads to fit the largest induction pipe they could right?
No.... The limitations of laminar flow and dictation of a 76mm throttle body and 76mm Maf body say its best to stick to the same size of 76mm all the way through, too big and you end up slowing the flow down, too small and you limit the flow

The bends of the entire run... Most owners of modified induction systems on the V6 will loosly follow the correct bends, Nothing wrong with that whatsoever!
However... Try buying a silicon tube that has a 95 degree (original is not 90 degrees btw) followed by a 35 degree kink (not 45 degrees) then down to the maf (you guessed it, not 90 degrees) but 85 degrees to take into account for the drop in height from throttle body to, filter box top!
I double checked, sad... I know

Besides that , if you want to release any horses, the longer you make it, the less you get in return... But... Bear in mind the minimum 30cm distance overall though.

You can get away with a 90 degree bend from the throttle body and followed by a 75 degree bend to allow for the height drop followed by a silicon connector to the maf, thus saving even more money

So now how the hell do we attach all this to the breather pipe?

Well you won't believe this but I found the easiest solution ever.... A 14mm drilled hole in the alloy pipe, filed all the swarf away of course and wait for it...... A standard tyre valve with the valve core removed
It has a sealing lip that moulds to the shape of the hole in the pipe.. You push it through from the inside and give it a tug until it the first shoulders of the lip come through, give it a slight twist and it's an air tight seal Guess what the internal diameter is? 3mm
Simple solutions!


Now connect with a rubber hose (12.7mm) As it slips over the original plastic breather connector (just with a push) and also fits the bore of the tyre valve nicely... Simply clamp up properly with the correct size jubilee clips


ONE THING I WILL IMPART THAT IS IMPORTANT!
Always clean the inside of your new pipe work before fitting
They are full of grime that won't help and if you cut or drill, swarf will make short work of valves and throttle butterfly!

PICS to prove it:
I did this all in the back yard instead of the workshop, just to show that with basic tools, you can end up with a professional install!

It fits perfectly







http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/...407-1608-1.jpg

Here's one last tip... Use the opportunity to clean your throttle body? Maf and do a throttle/ECU reset to gain the benefits
So what improvements:
With the Helmholtz resonators removed and the shorter, smoother run it has a deeper sound that compliments the v6, the throttle feels slightly more responsive and less of a need to put your foot further down when on inclines or pulling away... Maybe just me but seems to have more lower down usable torque and more rapid proggression towards the top end of the rev range...

My next project is:
I currently run an Apiro Torque dual cone filter inside the original air filter box (lid removed of course)... This keeps it away from the elements, prevents heat soak as and reduces the induction roar as standard... The kit I bought has loads of spare tubes and connectors so I am going to remove the standard v6 outer airbox pipe and make my own cold air channel to the airbox
Enjoy
Desame likes this.

Last edited by Grahameo; 08-04-12 at 12:26.
 
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Status: Sniffing badgers
AO Member
 
GLPoomobile's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: United Kingdom
County: Edinburgh
Posts: 761
That's a really excellent write up

I was going to do this on my 166, but only using silicone tubes instead of alloy, and I looked in to various T pieces and adaptors for the breather pipes. It never even occurred to me about the smaller 3mm hole in the T piece! And the use of the tyre valve is pure genius, one of those KISS solutions

My only criticism is the use of eBay links, as these will expire eventually and could cause some frustration for future viewers. I'd suggest saving the required images and just linking directly to them rather than the eBay listings.
GLPoomobile is offline  
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by GLPoomobile View Post
That's a really excellent write up

I was going to do this on my 166, but only using silicone tubes instead of alloy, and I looked in to various T pieces and adaptors for the breather pipes. It never even occurred to me about the smaller 3mm hole in the T piece! And the use of the tyre valve is pure genius, one of those KISS solutions

My only criticism is the use of eBay links, as these will expire eventually and could cause some frustration for future viewers. I'd suggest saving the required images and just linking directly to them rather than the eBay listings.
Thanks mate, and taken on board... Will change the ebay links accordingly

The tyre valve idea, it was a moment of "damn it what can I use?"
The best thing was... I went into national tyres alng the road and just asked... they gave me four of them for nothing
 
Status: missing Inverurie
AO Gold Member
 
Pascs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Qatar
County: Aberdeenshire
Posts: 8,063

Member car:

Zender 156 V6

That looks really neat and tidy

and nice write up for those wanting to copy it
Pascs is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
scociu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Romania
County: Bucuresti
Posts: 306
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grahameo View Post
Tiny little oil droplets from the breather pipes lubricate your throttle body to work properly and prevent it from sticking... cutting that lubrication off that is supposed to be there is never a good thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grahameo View Post
Size of bore! 76mm
It would be ideal for petrol heads to fit the largest induction pipe they could right?
No.... The limitations of laminar flow and dictation of a 76mm throttle body and 76mm Maf body say its best to stick to the same size of 76mm all the way through, too big and you end up slowing the flow down, too small and you limit the flow

Can you please provide some documentation regarding these 2 statements? I am not saying that they are wrong, i am just curios about more info on this.
scociu is offline  
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Cold Air Intake Systems
Refer to Ram air induction/ cold air induction priciples and flow rates

The 2.5 V6 standard Helmholtz induction system (throttle body connector)

Bottom end that connects to the MAF body

And the main body connection


All 76mm or 3 inch (sorry about the photo's but my camera isn't that good at close ups.. you can just say see the measurements though)

As regards to the breather lubricating, well that is logical really when you look at the ICVS principles and crank engine breather locations ... Why else whould they have a pipe connected before the throttle body? Why not both connections after?... Yes of course it will coat the throttle butterfly with oil molecules and thats why even with the cleanest of induction systems and filters, we still have to clean the throttle body now and then but ever notice that after using a specialist cleaner fluid the the throttle body seems to be a bit stiffer?
Thats because the lubrication of the spindle's inner fulcrum has been removed temporarily. Most owners will spray some sort of penetrating oil top and bottom of the spindle spine to get rid of this stiffness, yet simply running the engine while varying the revs does the same job.
Engine - Breather System - Tuning Guides
HTH
 
Status: my back is much better
AO Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 236
nice write up , my pipe going into the throttle body is taped up as well where did you get the pipe and hose from ? as I see you have the same vehicle I'm going to do the same thing
thanks
simonp is offline  
Alexandrus
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Throttle body lubrication is the most ridiculous thing I've heard this year, probably.
It's stepper motor driven, with the motor encased, not exposed, everything is made out of aluminium alloy, so not rust, and the TB can never be flully closed so no chance of it even locking.
 
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexandrus View Post
Throttle body lubrication is the most ridiculous thing I've heard this year, probably.
It's stepper motor driven, with the motor encased, not exposed, everything is made out of aluminium alloy, so not rust, and the TB can never be flully closed so no chance of it even locking.
should I even bother with a response?
 
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by simonp View Post
nice write up , my pipe going into the throttle body is taped up as well where did you get the pipe and hose from ? as I see you have the same vehicle I'm going to do the same thing
thanks
PIPING KIT
Contact them for the 3" kit mate you can make 2 to 3 full induction tubes out of them, sell them to your friends with similar engines and make your money back... I did
 
Status: my back is much better
AO Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 236
thanks Graemo
simonp is offline  
Alexandrus
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grahameo View Post
should I even bother with a response?
Actually, yes, if fair play were a factor you could admit it to be just a wild asumption based on nothing much.
I actually did not intend to offend you, but simply point out the flaw in your "guess" so others do not feel tempted to believe such wild notions.
 
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
First of all lets look at some of your queries...
"Throttle body lubrication is the most ridiculous thing I've heard this year, probably."
So what you are actually saying is that :
It requires no lubrication and doesn't get any from an oil breather pipe in any possible way?
Answer this... Where does the air for your engine come from, we all know it comes via the air filter, or at least you should know... Ever heard of humidity, moisture? Or does that not get through an air filter IYO?

"It's stepper motor driven, with the motor encased, not exposed,"
Are you getting a little confused here?... Are you trying to refer to the seperate unit known as the throttle control unit? Which is part of the throttle body component but not the physical part of the throttle body itself.
"everything is made out of aluminium alloy, so not rust, and the TB can never be flully closed so no chance of it even locking"
Wrong...
If you ever took the time to strip completely a throttle body you will see that it isn't all alloy...
You cant make resistance springs out of alloy (they sit either side of the butterfly valve on the fulcrum movement and offer physical resistance to the TCU) ... Mad of spring steel BTW..
The spindle.... Made of stainless steel... The butterfly retaining screws... Brass... Good luck removing them if the were "all alloy"
And.. of course we ALL know that alloy doesn't corrode right?... Take a look at you wheels
You can go and be rude to these guys who too the time to make an excellent tutorial "A picture paints a thousand words" http://alfa156.net/tech/cleaningthrottlebody.pdf
Refer to the photo and low and behold... it's closed... and always is when ignition is off!

Finally... You could have asked nicely any questions you had and I would have answered them... Being rude is no way to try and understand something you obviously dont.
If you actually took the time to see what my time served experience is and the field that I work in "In my profile",you may have chose your original comments with a bit more integrity.


The "teach a granny to suck eggs" section is down the hall on the left.
Thanks
 
Status: Mabe just mabe this time.
AO Silver Member
 
Mito_No3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Stirling
Posts: 3,255

Member car:

VW Passat RLine

Well done Grahameo couldn't have said it any better. I work for Mercedes Benz and the number of throttle bodies we have change due to being siezed is a plenty. Steel and alloy dont mix well and are very prone to siezing as they react with each other. Try getting a steel bolt out of an alloy housing and you will usually find it a problem.
Mito_No3 is offline  
Alexandrus
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grahameo View Post
First of all lets look at some of your queries...
"Throttle body lubrication is the most ridiculous thing I've heard this year, probably."
So what you are actually saying is that :
It requires no lubrication and doesn't get any from an oil breather pipe in any possible way?
Answer this... Where does the air for your engine come from, we all know it comes via the air filter, or at least you should know... Ever heard of humidity, moisture? Or does that not get through an air filter IYO?

"It's stepper motor driven, with the motor encased, not exposed,"
Are you getting a little confused here?... Are you trying to refer to the seperate unit known as the throttle control unit? Which is part of the throttle body component but not the physical part of the throttle body itself.
"everything is made out of aluminium alloy, so not rust, and the TB can never be flully closed so no chance of it even locking"
Wrong...
If you ever took the time to strip completely a throttle body you will see that it isn't all alloy...
You cant make resistance springs out of alloy (they sit either side of the butterfly valve on the fulcrum movement and offer physical resistance to the TCU) ... Mad of spring steel BTW..
The spindle.... Made of stainless steel... The butterfly retaining screws... Brass... Good luck removing them if the were "all alloy"
And.. of course we ALL know that alloy doesn't corrode right?... Take a look at you wheels
You can go and be rude to these guys who too the time to make an excellent tutorial "A picture paints a thousand words" http://alfa156.net/tech/cleaningthrottlebody.pdf
Refer to the photo and low and behold... it's closed... and always is when ignition is off!

Finally... You could have asked nicely any questions you had and I would have answered them... Being rude is no way to try and understand something you obviously dont.
If you actually took the time to see what my time served experience is and the field that I work in "In my profile",you may have chose your original comments with a bit more integrity.


The "teach a granny to suck eggs" section is down the hall on the left.
Thanks
OK, whaever you say, but somehow I did not need an ilustrated guide to remove my TB or to clean it
And if you wish to believe the the TB needs lubrication, then fine, but try not to spread it around.
Oh yes, and no, the TB is NOT ever closed, it's almost closed but like I said, the "gate" is oval, not round, and can not be closed, there is always a slight opening between the gate and the case. You can check it yourself, if you want.

PS. My wheels are not at all corroded, strangely And even if they were, due to chemicals on the street, I think if you happen to have the same chemical entering the induction up to the TB, you'd have some problems no lubrication in the world can cure
 
Status: i like cake?
AO Member
 
seasonsv6's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: United Kingdom
County: Durham
Posts: 102
Garage

Member car:

156 v6 x2

awesome post, hopefully similar results to follow if my amazing diy skills dont fail me
seasonsv6 is offline  
Status: Not Stock
AO Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Singapore
County: -
Posts: 853
What happens if we do the same thing but use the Ferrari F430 Throttle Body instead? Its got 84mm or 86mm openings. I suppose we would need to get 84mm dia piping?
Saabretooth is offline  
Status: -
AO Silver Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Derbyshire
Posts: 1,613

Member car:

159 Ti

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grahameo View Post
Besides that , if you want to release any horses, the longer you make it, the less you get in return... But... Bear in mind the minimum 30cm distance overall though.
Very informative thread.
I am having to sort out the intake on my track car - which is not an alfa, and have a few questions if you wouldn't mind?

Is there an ideal length of intake before the plenum?
would a gradual increase in bore help at all?
are any gains in a perfect length offset by hot air being drawn in (if its a short ideal length) as opposed to cold air being drawn in (if filter is located in inner wing)

track car is a V6 and i'm experimenting with seperate intakes for each bank of the v6, so in effect it runs as two 3-cylinders.
The manifold has valves before and at end of plenum which can open and close to balance and join the two 3-cylinder configuration to conbine as one.
Just not to sure on best config before the dual throttle body.
jasons is offline  
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasons View Post
Very informative thread.
I am having to sort out the intake on my track car - which is not an alfa, and have a few questions if you wouldn't mind?

Is there an ideal length of intake before the plenum?
would a gradual increase in bore help at all?
are any gains in a perfect length offset by hot air being drawn in (if its a short ideal length) as opposed to cold air being drawn in (if filter is located in inner wing)

track car is a V6 and i'm experimenting with seperate intakes for each bank of the v6, so in effect it runs as two 3-cylinders.
The manifold has valves before and at end of plenum which can open and close to balance and join the two 3-cylinder configuration to conbine as one.
Just not to sure on best config before the dual throttle body.
Spoke to Pat at "turboPacs" in Durham about the the ideal length of induction tubes a while back... He has noticed over the years that the minimum ideal length is indeed 30 cm to prevent buffeting and the maximum being around 100cm as far as bang per buck is concerned but obviously it depends on the engine, cylinders used and if it is N/A or a Forced fed unit. He noticed a 15hp drop on a Subaru WRX by increasing the length by a mere 10 cm once as an experiment, he was searching for an ideal ambient temperature area of 5 c degrees less at the time... So goes to show how important length can be .
Pat has very extensive expertise in finding the ideal scanario of induction bore, route and length, but he laso has the added benefit of a rolling road to physically see the results of his tinkering.... One thing that he does say, is: "Start long and start straightening the run out... avoid anything more than 75 degrees apart from throttlebody and air filter pods... It's easy to start shortening the pipes after quick runs out a bit at a time but a lot more difficult to increase the length's... You will know when it feels better to you"

As for gradual bore increase... Well, you are dictated to by the size of mainly the MAF body and throttle body diameters on many cars. I know it may sound wierd to make such an analogy but laminar flow has a similar property to water pipes and plumber's knowledge and can be best explained as thus:
A plumber will fit the exact same bore size pipe as what is already there unless he wants to increase the flow pressure which he does by fitting a smaller bore pipe (like putting your finger over the end of a hose, it increases the pressure)... Unfortunately, in real world terms that doesn't increase the air flow volume or rate, it just moves quicker up the induction pipe and can cause starvation or lean air mixture at higher revs and rich air at lower revs... So in effect you tend to make the MAF sensor and ECU work harder to balance it all out.

With regards to a larger bore? Again, return to the plumber's dillema... Now he has fitted that larger bore pipe, the pressure has dropped, it's flowing slower. If we put that into induction terms now it does offer some benefits, You have less chance of the buffeting, you can indeed use a shorter length from the MAF to the throttle body, you have a larger volume of air in the pipe on demand at any given moment.... But it also does come with downsides.... The air pressure is lower so the throttle response is somewhat lazy in comparisoneven though you have that initial volume to use it's like a reservior of air, once it's gone in one big gulp of full throttle, the air coming in isn't keeping up with demand due to the slow flow rate, so again... You are going to end up disturbing the mixture balancing act... Also bear in mind that slower flow rate is also going to increase the chances of ambient temperature increasing slightly thus the warmer air becomes less dense... I hope this is making sense
Most manufacturer's do tend to keep to a similar MAF body and T/B size because of these reasons... Where performance increases are often gained is in the run length, the routing, i.e less bends = less resistance and also the ambient temperature avoidance... All a balancing act really.

Twin throttle bodies are notoriously difficult to set up correctly due to ECU & sensor irregularities and more often then not very little gains are reported as a result... Not impossible to do, but very sensitive to changes. Personally? I would say common sense would determine equal length and run route would be the first priority to avoid obvious imbalances to start off with.....IIRC some one was trying this on the forum but not sure how far they got with the project

Not just Alfa's but many V6's actually benefit from a larger/ longer plenum chamber and throttle body matching the increase, then of course taking into account our mate "the plumber" that also means that the MAF body has to be increased to match the T/B and follow suit with the increase in bore of induction pipes, keeping within length parameter's and reducing the bends and keeping it cool... i.e inner wing.... Just make sure that in the search for the least temperature increase, you don't forget about protecting the filtration from the elements such as standing water.
A handy tip I found was to use a lot of what the manufacturer has already... Many cars have the inner plastic wheel arch covers... Leaving an opening at the bottom and the way the inner arch is shaped can give a nice healthy flow of nice cold air coming from under the car and not through the engine bay... It also protects the filter from obvious direct impact from puddles and dirt off the road

I know it was a long answer, but I hope this helps

Last edited by Grahameo; 27-05-12 at 15:18.
 
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saabretooth View Post
What happens if we do the same thing but use the Ferrari F430 Throttle Body instead? Its got 84mm or 86mm openings. I suppose we would need to get 84mm dia piping?
That would be the route I would take... Try finding a MAF body housing of similar dimension too and you will be about perfect in keeping the flow rate, volume and length of induction similar... No great leaps in any one area, just a nice steady increase of air mass in all of them
When you start to tinker with one area only, the rest starts to suffer
 
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
One last bit of help to the DIY induction tweaker's... The next step......
Use the tools you have already... A laptop and FiatECUscan of even the torque app IIRC can be your friend when it comes to air flow measurements... Once you have your current measurements and tolerances as far as the MAF measurements is concerned you can then input into air flow calculators, your increases/ decreases in length, diameter and ambient temps to get the ideal scenario you want to achieve with the result being CFM increase and air density ect.
It makes the process far more accurate
Here are some examples: Not perfect but you will get the idea once you put in the calculations
Virtual Airflow Calculator
Airflow Unit Conversion
http://www.efunda.com/formulae/fluid..._flowmeter.cfm
Hope this helps
 
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Malaysia
County: Perak
Posts: 11

Member car:

156 SW 2.5 V6

Quote:
My next project is:
I currently run an Apiro Torque dual cone filter inside the original air filter box (lid removed of course)... This keeps it away from the elements, prevents heat soak as and reduces the induction roar as standard... The kit I bought has loads of spare tubes and connectors so I am going to remove the standard v6 outer airbox pipe and make my own cold air channel to the airbox
hi grahameo (like the terry thomas avatar),
would appreciate further elaboration and advice on the modification to the airbox. I fitted a ferrari 360 TB and am still struggling with alternate days of bliss and grief from that modification (methinks the MAF is acting up). Anyway, recently took out the old K&N replacement filter and fitted a K&N cone filter and dropped into the open airfilter box, so air gets in through the bottom inlet pipe and from the open top. Whilst awaiting some idea of closing off the open top, discovered that the induction roar sounds kinda nice and overall torque seems marginally better. Your ideas please? Shouldnt have any issue of heat soak bcos its way down in the engine compartment I suppose, only issue would be water entry?
atsmoke is offline  
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Here is what I have done...
I removed the outer induction tube that goes to the air filter box (v6 outer trumpet that is secured to the inner bumper and travels towrds the upper inner wing. Again, the hole that is left is 76mm (3") diameter.
I placed a 90 degree bend 76mm alloy pipe into the hole and secured inside and ouside the filter box with jubilee clips I have also angled it towards the front bumper upwards.

If you notice once you remove the the original V6 trumpet, it becomes apparent that although the outlet is 76mm to the airbox, the internal diameter of the squashed looking trumpet is only around 58mm half way up... So in turn, causing yet another bottle neck... This affects the natural flow rate and thus causes the air filter to suck warmed air from the top of the filter box when on full throttle.
http://www.saclam.com/short_topics/1...irbox_2_01.jpg

Replacing the trumpet and re-routing towards the front of the car with the same diameter pipe has all but eliminated the need for any air sucked in when on demand from the engine bay, its getting enough , nice cold air from behind the bumper now and no chance of water ingression via deep puddles.
Try cleaning your MAF and do a soft ecu and throttle reset proceedure afterwards and see the difference then... with that 360 TB you should have a good difference.

I am toying with the idea of making a new airbox lid from alloy that fits the original bolt holes but enough of a bore to let my new pipe work to fit through. So far, I don't need it though.... Hope this helps mate....
I am waiting for the weather to improve so I can take pics of my recent mod

One last tip is to get hold of a standard thermometer and tape it in the bottom of the airbox. Let the car tick over for a good ten minutes and then remove the thermometer quickly and check the temp... make a note and then leave the thermometer under the car in the shadow for another ten minutes engine off to get a mean ambient temp.

Now place it back in the air box and go for a drive... quickly stop and open the bonnet with the engine off and get hold of the thermometer.... It should be lower than ambient temp by now....

Now you check the difference between all three figures... You should be aiming for at most 2-3 degrees celsius above ambient temp when the engine is ticking over... Any more than that, then you are getting heat soak on tick over.... Now on a run out, it should be 2-3 degrees or even lower than ambient temp, this means a healthy, lower temp and more condensed air is getting to where it needs to be... The secret is avoiding the temperature build up when stuck in traffic etc.

The beauty of all this is:
A: you are keeping the airbox pretty standard yet improving the airflow so you acn always put it back as standard if you want it to
B: keeping it as cheap as possible
C:Avoiding the common Alfa pitfalls of contaminated air getting to the MAF via the dodgy airbox lid thus destroying a perfectly good MAF
D: You can make some money back by selling your V6 outer trumpet on ebay to a TS owner
Everyone wins!
Hope this helps

Last edited by Grahameo; 27-06-12 at 14:20.
 
Status: -
AO Member
 
Francois89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Midrand
County: South Africa
Posts: 45
Hi, is it worth doing that even tho I installed a GTA snorkle?
It is alot better but still has a small bottle neck?
Francois89 is offline  
Grahameo
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francois89 View Post
Hi, is it worth doing that even tho I installed a GTA snorkle?
It is alot better but still has a small bottle neck?
The GTA bore is pretty much up to the target size IIRC.... However it points in the wrong direction to get cooler air
The important thing is to keep it cheap and use as much of the original bits as possible
I would say it wouldn't make much of a difference in this case but try the thermometer trick to make sure
 
Reply

Go Back   Alfa Romeo Forum > Supported Alfa Romeo Models > Technical & Vehicle Assistance > Tuning & Upgrades

Tags
156 , detail , full , induction , replacement , tutorial

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
So how many and where are the GTA's ??? 156GTASW Alfa GTA 608 27-10-11 09:11

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome