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Old 29-08-11 Thread Starter
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Idea EGT temperature

I'm testing my EGT gauge in 5 gear at 4500 rpm 190km/h make 870c. It's normal? My car is a grande punto 1.9mjtd 8v upgraded with KKKBV50, actually runing at 1'4 bar boost and 80mm3 ( tuning map for old gt1749MV) Egt sensor is fitted on exhaust manifold like the photo. What do you think? what is the maximum EGT temperature for KKKBV50 ? The new tuning map going to do 1'9bar boost and 100mm3 of fuel, rail presure 1750 bar and lamdba 1'05.
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Old 30-08-11
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In ECU software, EGT is controllable by AFR, injection timing and injection timeframe length. Each of these has it's own pros, cons and limits. Often EGT lowering methods go against power requirement. So the goal is to find good compromise.

I've heard the limit temperature of Garrett GT1749V turbos is 850C. Don't know what's the BV50 one, but I suppose it's higher as the BV50 VGT turbos are also used by petrol Porsche's.

There are some videos/stories around on the internet of higly tuned diesels, where EGT went upto almost 1000C.

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Old 30-08-11 Thread Starter
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In ECU software, EGT is controllable by AFR, injection timing and injection timeframe length. Each of these has it's own pros, cons and limits. Often EGT lowering methods go against power requirement. So the goal is to find good compromise.

I've heard the limit temperature of Garrett GT1749V turbos is 850C. Don't know what's the BV50 one, but I suppose it's higher as the BV50 VGT turbos are also used by petrol Porsche's.

There are some videos/stories around on the internet of higly tuned diesels, where EGT went upto almost 1000C.
Thanks, What is the correct AFR? Actually runs with 1'05 lambda and 1'5bar full boost to 5000rpm but at hig rpm the boost cut I supose with lambda factor. My first data log:
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Old 31-08-11
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There is no simple answer for "correct AFR". You need to read some textbooks about liquid hydrocarbon fuel combustion. Stoichiometric ratio (λ = 1) is 14,8 (kg of air to 1kg of fuel). For clean (sootless) diesel combustion you have to keep on at least λ = ~1,18.
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Old 31-08-11
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Yep, around 17:1 is OK on most cars (if car smokes with AFR above 17:1 there is most probably something wrong with it, like boost leak, or bad injector).

But keep in mind that in Alfas ECUs fuel is measured in mm3 and air in mg, so first you need to "recalculate" fuel from "volume" to weight when calculating AFR.
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Old 02-09-11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic_O_O View Post
I'm testing my EGT gauge in 5 gear at 4500 rpm 190km/h make 870c. It's normal? My car is a grande punto 1.9mjtd 8v upgraded with KKKBV50, actually runing at 1'4 bar boost and 80mm3 ( tuning map for old gt1749MV) Egt sensor is fitted on exhaust manifold like the photo. What do you think? what is the maximum EGT temperature for KKKBV50 ? The new tuning map going to do 1'9bar boost and 100mm3 of fuel, rail presure 1750 bar and lamdba 1'05.
870c seems high for these figures. In most cases this is caused by too much injection retard.
What you can do to lower it is increase rail pressure (make duration shorter) and advance the injection timing. But be aware, too much advance raises your peak cylinder pressure and can lift your head.
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Advancing injection also causes increase of engine temperature (as more heat is being dissipated into cylinder head)
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Old 02-09-11 Thread Starter
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870c seems high for these figures. In most cases this is caused by too much injection retard.
What you can do to lower it is increase rail pressure (make duration shorter) and advance the injection timing. But be aware, too much advance raises your peak cylinder pressure and can lift your head.
Hi
Actually runs with 1'7 bar to 4300rpm with 1.9bar of a peak, 1'45 to 5000 , lambda 1 , 1720bar rail presure, 1 advance, and 65mg of fuel. EGT 730 .
Next step 1'9 bar to 5000rpm, 85mm3, fuel rail 1750bar, te escalation of my injectors 80mm3 how to do to make 100mm3? mi ecu is edc16c39. I think actually inject 80mm3+avance = 72-74mg Enough for 220 hp?
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Old 02-09-11
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17:1 is way too lean, your just going to burn your mates engine out. And miss fire yourself a new a s s
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Old 02-09-11
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It is a diesel...
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Old 02-09-11
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With 80mm3 you will get some 190BHP @ 4000 or even less since it is a 8V... far away from 220bhp...
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ok
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With 80mm3 you will get some 190BHP @ 4000 or even less since it is a 8V... far away from 220bhp...
Mmmm 85mm3+1750bar rail presure not enough? 85mm3=72mg Mi brother runs 72mg of fuel on his 2.0tdi 16 v and make [email protected] with gt2256.
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Old 02-09-11
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Originally Posted by TribesMan View Post
With 80mm3 you will get some 190BHP @ 4000 or even less since it is a 8V... far away from 220bhp...
190 ?

I had 160 hp (+/- 170 uk bhp) with 78mm^3 from my JTD 8v...

To get close to 200 HP you will need something in the range of 100 mm^3.
80 mm^3 is more a stock turbo figure.
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Old 02-09-11
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JS I agree with you... My estimation was based on 16v engine, which can (optimistically) produce close to 190 with 80mm3, (but not on "dutch" dyno ).

His engine is a bit newer with higher fuel pressure, also his turbo is less restrictive than the one you used, also he must be running with some very high AFR at the moment, since his injection is limited to 80mm3... All this helps for a bit more power, but it is definetely still less than 190 (and that is very opyimistic to begin with)...

Vic that TDI does not produce 240bhp with that injection quantity, or maybe it does if duration maps were properly massacred with tuning... But in that case you cant compare anything, since you dont know his realistic injection quantity...

As JS said you will have to raise injection up to at least 100mm to achieve 220bhp.
As you probably know user yan.ko injects well over 100mm3 and he says that his car should produce around 220... Now compare that to your figures
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Old 04-09-11 Thread Starter
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JS I agree with you... My estimation was based on 16v engine, which can (optimistically) produce close to 190 with 80mm3, (but not on "dutch" dyno ).

His engine is a bit newer with higher fuel pressure, also his turbo is less restrictive than the one you used, also he must be running with some very high AFR at the moment, since his injection is limited to 80mm3... All this helps for a bit more power, but it is definetely still less than 190 (and that is very opyimistic to begin with)...

Vic that TDI does not produce 240bhp with that injection quantity, or maybe it does if duration maps were properly massacred with tuning... But in that case you cant compare anything, since you dont know his realistic injection quantity...

As JS said you will have to raise injection up to at least 100mm to achieve 220bhp.
As you probably know user yan.ko injects well over 100mm3 and he says that his car should produce around 220... Now compare that to your figures
My brother's car in a 60-200 km vs mazdaspeed 2010 version running the same. In my car the Italian tuners make 230hp with OEM injection sistem. When my car it's fine I'll post results at the dyno
My brother dyno pull and acceleration in 3th gear (2 person on board):

2.0 TDI BKD+Gt2256 2XX Cv Pruebas circuito - YouTube
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Old 05-09-11
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Well, from the video I can see that it takes him almost 9s from 100-160...

My car has about 190BHP and 400Nm (injection is [email protected] and [email protected]) and it does 100-160 in just under 10s.

I'd say what we see here is some 10% too optimistic dyno.
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For orientation... Megane RS 225HP accelerates from 100-160 in ~8s.
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Old 06-09-11
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Gino's 147 16v with 192 dutch HP's has almost the same acceleration as that 240 hp car in the video.
Gino does 100-160 in 9+ secs.

So it is clear there's a BIG difference in dyno results across the globe !
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Old 06-09-11
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Yes pretty puss, check this video. This is in fourth gear(not third), and does it in around 6-7 seconds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pm9m1MlhrvE
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Old 06-09-11 Thread Starter
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Gino's 147 16v with 192 dutch HP's has almost the same acceleration as that 240 hp car in the video.
Gino does 100-160 in 9+ secs.

So it is clear there's a BIG difference in dyno results across the globe !
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Originally Posted by TribesMan View Post
Well, from the video I can see that it takes him almost 9s from 100-160...

My car has about 190BHP and 400Nm (injection is [email protected] and [email protected]) and it does 100-160 in just under 10s.

I'd say what we see here is some 10% too optimistic dyno.
Acceleration starts on a hill, 2 persons onboard (I weight 90kg). The video is with a different map, now has some changes. If my brothers car does not make 240hp, mazdaspeed 2010 and A3 3.2 v6 neither too....
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Old 07-09-11
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My car has about 17XBHP and 380Nm (injection is [email protected] and [email protected]) and it does 100-150 in just under 8s.

Its a JTD 8v unijet with only remap and hibrid turbo (VB compressor), with 225/45R17 tires

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Old 07-09-11
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I would really like to see video of that.
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Old 22-09-11 Thread Starter
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190 ?

I had 160 hp (+/- 170 uk bhp) with 78mm^3 from my JTD 8v...

To get close to 200 HP you will need something in the range of 100 mm^3.
80 mm^3 is more a stock turbo figure.
With stock turbo runs 1.38bar (+0.05bar respect stock for 130hp) and 60mm3, stock rail presure (1600 bar) makes 160cv.
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Old 22-09-11
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160HP @60mg/i is something i would believe in.

Btw. would you post stock torque limiter map please?
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