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(Post Link) post #1 of 26 Old 26-04-11 Thread Starter
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Trip to DTUK

I have been looking at getting a 159 diesel but already know that I would want more power. I have been doing lots of research along with my cousin who already has one so last week we took a trip up to DTUK, this site seems split over DTUK but other sites cant seem to praise them enough so as they are local we decided to give them a go.

Andrew, the owner of DTUK, met us at the unit on Good Friday, even though they were technically shut. The guy himself could not have helped more! He fitted a 'CRD-2' module (Diesel Tuning UK | Select the right tuning system for your car) and it absolutely blew my mind! I cannot believe that such a simple mod can make such a difference to a car!

The driveability of the car is completely transformed beyond all recognition and feels so much more powerful, I will get my cousin to give me some feedback on economy after he puts some miles on it, but needless to say at the minute he is enjoying the power a little bit too much

Whilst I was there Andrew let me have a play in their Navara that also has their new toy on it, the 'Pedal Box' which essentially acts like a sports button, no extra power, just much improved throttle response. Very interesting little product, though I have no idea how it feels on the Alfa as my cousin was too tight to spend the money to buy one and we didnt want to waste any more of Andrews time

Needless to say that it has pushed me even further towards buying a 159 and now the search is on
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HI Tom, I too am on the look out for a tuning box for my 159, hows the research going? do you have any other dead certs for the authenticity of the boxes it would be good to get some advice form someone that is impartial
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Originally Posted by supertomo View Post
HI Tom, I too am on the look out for a tuning box for my 159, hows the research going? do you have any other dead certs for the authenticity of the boxes it would be good to get some advice form someone that is impartial
Hi, there do seem to be a hell of a lot of positive reviews on the net (like most products I suppose) for the DTUK stuff. When we went to visit them they were very transparent and showed us that they import from a German firm called DTE - who are TUV approved which says a lot to me as a former VAG man - but they programme the modules to suit the British market. I had a good route around last night and DTE seem to have a fantastic reputation over the water. I am still looking but other brands I have found seem to either fall into the categories of 'cheap ebay resistor in a fancy box' or are vastly expensive with no obvious improvement in quality, power, economy, etc.

What companies have you been looking at? Would be good to have the thoughts of a fellow tuning box newbie
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The price does not seem to be much different than a decent re-map.
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(Post Link) post #5 of 26 Old 27-04-11 Thread Starter
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The price does not seem to be much different than a decent re-map.
Well it was cheaper than any remapper I would consider using and of course it has the added bonus that when you are finished with it you can transfer it to another vehicle or sell it on, a huge selling point to me and one of the reasons that my cousin first started looking at them. I have also heard too many horror stories of dealer software upgrades wiping maps off
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Hi Tom, looked at Chip my Deisel, Pro Bitz Speedhawlk ,BHP plus.

i have only been looking around for the last day or two so still early dasy and im not in a rush to commit
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(Post Link) post #7 of 26 Old 28-04-11 Thread Starter
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Thanks Supertomo, I'll have a look at those too
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(Post Link) post #8 of 26 Old 06-05-11 Thread Starter
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Just to update this - My cousin has put almost 1200 miles on (not bad considering it has only been little over a week!) and is more than happy with the power. He reports a claculated extra 6mpg so far with a fair bit of lunaitc driving included
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Originally Posted by TomAlfa View Post
Just to update this - My cousin has put almost 1200 miles on (not bad considering it has only been little over a week!) and is more than happy with the power. He reports a claculated extra 6mpg so far with a fair bit of lunaitc driving included
Was that on the ECU readout or brim to brim fills?... If on the ECU then it will be wrong as the ECU "thinks" that there is less fuel being used as the "Tuning box" tricks it, thus making the ECU put more fuel through... hence the power hike - tuning boxes just trick the fuelling part of the ECU into thinking that there is less fuel... making it send more...

Remaps, actually alter how the engines ECU works... giving more boost, for longer and more fuelling etc... rather than letting the various sensors around the engine react to one altered circuit... the fuel pressure!

i have thought about boxes, but when fund allow, will get a remap... Red-dot do them on Alfa days for about 180 I believe?... may be wrong!
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Reedy, is that true of all tuning boxes or just the cheep ones? im airing agianst a remap as my alfa is on lease hire and i want something i can remove and transfer later
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(Post Link) post #11 of 26 Old 11-05-11 Thread Starter
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Was that on the ECU readout or brim to brim fills?... If on the ECU then it will be wrong as the ECU "thinks" that there is less fuel being used as the "Tuning box" tricks it, thus making the ECU put more fuel through... hence the power hike - tuning boxes just trick the fuelling part of the ECU into thinking that there is less fuel... making it send more...

Remaps, actually alter how the engines ECU works... giving more boost, for longer and more fuelling etc... rather than letting the various sensors around the engine react to one altered circuit... the fuel pressure!

i have thought about boxes, but when fund allow, will get a remap... Red-dot do them on Alfa days for about 180 I believe?... may be wrong!
Brim-to-brim calculated fills, I have never paid attention to an OBC fuel monitor in my life

Old school ebay boxes just up the fuel pressure newer boxes use a combination of connections to alter the boost and fuelling.

A remap receives the signal at the ECU then changes it to up fuelling and boost. A tuning box intercepts the signal then changes it before sending it on to the ECU to achieve exactly the same result.
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Brim-to-brim calculated fills, I have never paid attention to an OBC fuel monitor in my life

Old school ebay boxes just up the fuel pressure newer boxes use a combination of connections to alter the boost and fuelling.

A remap receives the signal at the ECU then changes it to up fuelling and boost. A tuning box intercepts the signal then changes it before sending it on to the ECU to achieve exactly the same result.
Except you get "peaky" power delivery as the engine sensors alter the fuelling, boost etc... not smooth and linear like a remap.... as it only intercepts one paramter, fuelling... it does not take anything else into account like the ECU does, such as throttle position, actual boost, EGR etc! any one on here who has used a tuning box AND remapped later will tell you this....
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Originally Posted by supertomo View Post
Reedy, is that true of all tuning boxes or just the cheep ones? im airing agianst a remap as my alfa is on lease hire and i want something i can remove and transfer later
They all do pretty much the same - most just connect to the fuel rail, where as other do plug in elsewhere... but all trick the ECU, rather then the ECU being re programmed to do things differently... Up to you which way you want to go.. I have not done either yet, but have looked into on here a lot!
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Originally Posted by Reedy156 View Post
They all do pretty much the same - most just connect to the fuel rail, where as other do plug in elsewhere... but all trick the ECU, rather then the ECU being re programmed to do things differently... Up to you which way you want to go.. I have not done either yet, but have looked into on here a lot!
Over the years I have gone down most tuning routes and have had my share of remapped cars. Whilst researching this particular engine both my cousin and I have spent as much time as possible researching the map v box debate and have spoken to people who have had both on the Fiat 1.9 engine, everyone I have spoken to personally that has had both preferred the box option, that is why my cousin elected to go that route.
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Originally Posted by TomAlfa View Post
Over the years I have gone down most tuning routes and have had my share of remapped cars. Whilst researching this particular engine both my cousin and I have spent as much time as possible researching the map v box debate and have spoken to people who have had both on the Fiat 1.9 engine, everyone I have spoken to personally that has had both preferred the box option, that is why my cousin elected to go that route.
Your car - Your choice (cousins anyway!) - each to their own.... many people are happy with them, that is why there is a market for them!...
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I was having a read of the reviews from these guys....anyone have any opinions?

language_en | Digital Chiptuning DrakeBox2 - Draketuning - centralina aggiuntiva,

They seem to get good reviews on the net and the prices are very reasonable. But how do you tell the difference between a good tuning box and one thats just packaged up well??
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(Post Link) post #17 of 26 Old 12-05-11 Thread Starter
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Personally I have never heard of them, they arent one of the companies that I looked at. But, I would be dubious of any company that can claim to supply 10 maps, all tried, tested and optimised for your vehicle, plus all that hardware for just €89. Also some of their website claims appear a little dubious shall we say...
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I was having a read of the reviews from these guys....anyone have any opinions?

language_en | Digital Chiptuning DrakeBox2 - Draketuning - centralina aggiuntiva,

They seem to get good reviews on the net and the prices are very reasonable. But how do you tell the difference between a good tuning box and one thats just packaged up well??
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Originally Posted by TomAlfa View Post
Personally I have never heard of them, they arent one of the companies that I looked at. But, I would be dubious of any company that can claim to supply 10 maps, all tried, tested and optimised for your vehicle, plus all that hardware for just 89. Also some of their website claims appear a little dubious shall we say...
The Italian Box on e-bay is about 60.... it claims the same and seems to have a Microprocessor, rather than just resistors... that said they all do the same - they are not "MAPS".... they are predefined levels of resistance, just managed be a chip, rather than a basic resistor.... there is now way any of these companoies can have ecery box set up for every car as they claim... they will be generic programmes, based on input...

This has been done may times on many forums, read this>>>>> Tuning box advice!?
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Originally Posted by Reedy156 View Post
The Italian Box on e-bay is about 60.... it claims the same and seems to have a Microprocessor, rather than just resistors... that said they all do the same - they are not "MAPS".... they are predefined levels of resistance, just managed be a chip, rather than a basic resistor.... there is now way any of these companoies can have ecery box set up for every car as they claim... they will be generic programmes, based on input...

This has been done may times on many forums, read this>>>>> Tuning box advice!?
A quality tuning box, such as the DTUK (I use them as an example as I have been to their unit and have been shown the software - something they are willing to do for anyone) doesnt just add a 'predefined level of resistance' , it in fact alters the signal at differing amounts throughout the range and is most defintely a map. They are infinitely more involved than you appear to give them credit for.
Also, I find your comment 'there is now way any of these companoies can have ecery box set up for every car as they claim' both sweeping and spurious. The larger companies have the equivalent access to test vehicles that any large remapper does. There is simply no way in which you can confidently say that there is no way that they can set up the boxes in that way.
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A quality tuning box, such as the DTUK (I use them as an example as I have been to their unit and have been shown the software - something they are willing to do for anyone) doesnt just add a 'predefined level of resistance' , it in fact alters the signal at differing amounts throughout the range and is most defintely a map. They are infinitely more involved than you appear to give them credit for.
Also, I find your comment 'there is now way any of these companoies can have ecery box set up for every car as they claim' both sweeping and spurious. The larger companies have the equivalent access to test vehicles that any large remapper does. There is simply no way in which you can confidently say that there is no way that they can set up the boxes in that way.
Easy tiger! Ha! You work for DTUK don't you!?...

It is an open forum for discussion, I am giving my personal opinion!

You can buy "maps" on e-bay for any car cheaply (not that I would), just as you can buy cheap tuning boxes... but I fail to see how a plug and play box that connects to one sensor, that alters ONE parameter (thus having a domino affect and making other things alter the way there work) can be classed as a map... it simply is not! The majority of tuning boxes only increase the fuel pressure and injection periods. You will not get an even spread of power due to the delay in the tuning box circuits. This results in spikes in the power. With re-mapping, these problems are eliminated as the ECU processes everything - along with adjusting the torque limiters and turbo limiters, which a tuning box cannot do.

We shall beg to differ!

Last edited by Reedy147; 12-05-11 at 14:51.
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Easy tiger! Ha! You work for DTUK don't you!?...

It is an open forum for discussion, I am giving my personal opinion!

You can buy "maps" on e-bay for any car cheaply (not that I would), just as you can buy cheap tuning boxes... but I fail to see how a plug and play box that connects to one sensor, that alters ONE parameter (thus having a domino affect and making other things alter the way there work) can be classed as a map... it simply is not! The majority of tuning boxes only increase the fuel pressure and injection periods. You will not get an even spread of power due to the delay in the tuning box circuits. This results in spikes in the power. With re-mapping, these problems are eliminated as the ECU processes everything - along with adjusting the torque limiters and turbo limiters, which a tuning box cannot do.

We shall beg to differ!
If I worked for DTUK I would happily come out and say so, am afraid you are way off the mark.

The DTKU box is multichannel, therefore plugs to more than one sensor so am afraid the above isnt valid
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If I worked for DTUK I would happily come out and say so, am afraid you are way off the mark.

The DTKU box is multichannel, therefore plugs to more than one sensor so am afraid the above isnt valid
The working for DTUK was a joke! Hence the Winky Symbol!

Only the CRD-T box is "multichannel" for Diesels (should really read "twin" channel as alters only boost pressure and fuelling) - DTUK CRD-T MultiChannel Common Rail+Boost | chip tuning boxes from Diesel Tuning UK and this is not available on an Alfa?... They are nearly 400! a good remap and manual boost controller is less than that! You can see on there own RR graph at the bottom of the page that the delivery is very peaky as I have said before about boxes... not that bad but no where as smooth as a good remap..

I am not having a go mate, it is just that you cannot say that a tuning box is a remap - it is not, it just fools/tricks the OEM map on the ECU.... nothing more - some do it well and some don't.... just like there are some good remappers out ther and some that are not so good!

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The working for DTUK was a joke! Hence the Winky Symbol!

Only the CRD-T box is "multichannel" for Diesels (should really read "twin" channel as alters only boost pressure and fuelling) - DTUK CRD-T MultiChannel Common Rail+Boost | chip tuning boxes from Diesel Tuning UK and this is not available on an Alfa?... They are nearly 400! a good remap and manual boost controller is less than that! You can see on there own RR graph at the bottom of the page that the delivery is very peaky as I have said before about boxes... not that bad but no where as smooth as a good remap..

I am not having a go mate, it is just that you cannot say that a tuning box is a remap - it is not, it just fools/tricks the OEM map on the ECU.... nothing more - some do it well and some don't.... just like there are some good remappers out ther and some that are not so good!

We appear to be at cross purposes, I haven't said that the box is a remap, it most certainly isnt. What I said was that the box does use a map rather than merely a set value voltage increase/decrease that some boxes employ
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Hmmm

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Originally Posted by TomAlfa View Post
Brim-to-brim calculated fills, I have never paid attention to an OBC fuel monitor in my life

Old school ebay boxes just up the fuel pressure newer boxes use a combination of connections to alter the boost and fuelling.

A remap receives the signal at the ECU then changes it to up fuelling and boost. A tuning box intercepts the signal then changes it before sending it on to the ECU to achieve exactly the same result.
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We appear to be at cross purposes, I haven't said that the box is a remap, it most certainly isnt. What I said was that the box does use a map rather than merely a set value voltage increase/decrease that some boxes employ
Sorry!! You said they achieve exactly the same results!.... they don't though... that is all I am saying....

Anyway - I'm sick of banging my head on this particular brick wall!

As I have already said, as long as everyone is happy!
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Sorry!! You said they achieve exactly the same results!.... they don't though... that is all I am saying....

Anyway - I'm sick of banging my head on this particular brick wall!

As I have already said, as long as everyone is happy!
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