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Madness Foglight Fuds!

OK I like having foglights on the car as much as the next man - from an aesthetic point of view in that they give the car a 'sporty' appearance.

But why oh why must these fuds think they are doing the forest stage of the UK Rally on city streets with not a wisp of fog,mist or even rain present. Oh....and why do they have to drive Renault Clio's and Meganes generally?
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by H14 GTV View Post
.and why do they have to drive Renault Clio's and Meganes generally?
And BMW's

This has been discussed many times on here and although research demonstrates that when its not foggy having bright lights shinning a very short distance from the front of your car actually decreases the ability to see longer range; you'll still get the 'chav' element thinking its 'cool'
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

Two things these people might like to note:

http://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q400.htm

..and:

http://www.danielsternlighting.com/t...fog_lamps.html

My favourite parts of the above essay are:

"Almost all factory-installed or dealer-optional fog lamps, and a great many aftermarket units, are essentially useless for any purpose, especially for extremely demanding poor-weather driving"

and also:

"If you increase the foreground light, your pupils react to the bright, wide pool of light by constricting, which in turn substantially reduces your distance vision—especially since there's no increase in down-the-road distance light to go along with the increased foreground light. It's insidious, because high levels of foreground light give the illusion, the subjective impression, of comfort and security and "good lighting".
 
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

I used to put my on from time to time.. Thinking it was cool....

Then I started a thread on here and had the ***** kicked out of me..

I didn't even know it was illegal though, and my fogs point down low so not to glare at other drivers.

So yeah, I don't use them unless necessary or on single track country lanes where they light up the road edges better.

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Re: Foglight Fuds!

As Kevin notes, its been discussed many times on here, but the simple fact of the matter is using them when its not foggy not only blinds oncoming drivers, but also reduces ones own ability to see.
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

I call them 10 % ers , as they make the car look as it is going 10% faster than it realy is.
They do wind me up when you have a muppet in a Saxo etc up your chuff in broad daylight in a 30 / 40 mph zone.
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

I would actually challenge anyone to notice the difference with/without fog lights on, except for the very small pool of light on the corners of the car. Which are totally useless for you as a driver, as if you haven't seen something you are about to hit by then, then you are going to hit it anyway.
I have been looking at a fog lamp design today and it has an intensity of 8 lux. Compared to a dip beam with somewhere around 30-40 lux, and the fact that their mounting heights are so low, they provide very little benefit on top of a dip beam.
We actually persuaded Bentley not to fit fog lamps to the Conti GT because they provided no benefit to the HID dip beams, even in foggy conditions. This solved a problem they were having with packaging fog lamps and having sufficient cooling ducts.
However, the Italians freely admitted that fog lamps are used as jewellery more than for functionallity when the regulations were being amended recently to require fog lamps to actually perform to a level that would make them useful.
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

i just really dont see the point of front fog lights, they are useless in fog and you look like a *** with them on when its not foggy.

i hate rear ones as well, well just the idiots who put them on at the first signs of a bit of wispy mist read the highway code.
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by jabberwocky View Post
i hate rear ones as well, well just the idiots who put them on at the first signs of a bit of wispy mist read the highway code.
Yep, I quite agree. When my boss used to sit on the SMMT lighting commitee, he tried to get them banned under the premise that in conditions that would technically require the need for fog lamps, you really shouldn't be travelling at a speed any faster than the distance you can see in. In which case you would be able to see the car infront anyway. Who was going to equip all the pedestrians & cyclists and other road users with fog lamps, because if you are travelling at an elevated speed only because you can see the faint glow of a bright fog lamp, there is no way you will avoid a cyclist or dog that runs into the road infront of you.
Total madness...all they do is lull people into a false sense of security, and encourage them to drive too fast for the conditions.
Also they are buggers to design when the stylists give you a matchbox size area as an after thought because they forgot they were needed
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

Most of the cars I see around have them on with just the sidelights on. Saw a Megane Scenic today like it but mostly BMW 3 series I see that do it.
 
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by Mark 147 View Post
Most of the cars I see around have them on with just the sidelights on. Saw a Megane Scenic today like it but mostly BMW 3 series I see that do it.
Mark, technically that is the correct way to use them. The fog lamp was originally intended as a substitute for the dip beams in conditions where high levels of light, especially rising light being reflected back into the drivers eyes was undesirable. Hence the fog lamp specs were written with a lower maximum intensity level and a flat top beam. Strictly speaking you should switch off your dip beams and only use the front fogs......that is of course on the rare occasions where front fogs are actually required
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

I use mine at night sometimes or if it's raining.

I'll get me coat.

*ducks*
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

Has anyone else noticed how switching on the rear fog lights disables the rear view mirror?

That can be the only explanation I can think of because every dim witted plank I am stuck behind in traffic with their rear fogs on does not seem to able to see me flashing them or pointing at their fogs!
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

The foglights on my series 1 147 came in handy when the headlight bulb stopped working. Because the fogs and headlights were housed in the same place, I could appear legal until I fixed the headlamp by putting the fogs on.

Now, on my series two 147 Turismo, Alfa apparently omitted headlamps so they could include a CD player at the same price. The CD player is after all much more useful in Fog!
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

i had to use my rear foglights this morning coming back from avonmouth in the early hours, very thick fog, i very nearly missed a roundabout and drove straight over it fortunately i was only going 45mph and i was empty so i managed to stop my truck in about 50 yrds and go round the roundabout, gave me a nice hit of adrenaline thats for sure. in parts the visability was down to about 50 yrds and i was down to 40 mph in parts but you have to be aware of **** who dont slow down running into the back of you, hence the rear fogs.

of all weather conditions id say thick fog is the worst for truckers, you have to concentrate so hard and it can get very disorientating even on a road you know well.. if you miss a bend or roundabout you dont have much room to stop 40 tonnes and it isnt fun when the back of your trailer tries to overtake the cab
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

it was very foggy here this morning.

As ever, the prime offender for not using any lights at all, were white vans and grey cars. And these are just the colours that do not stand out one bit in fog until you've pulled right into their unlit path.

Another thing that amused me. Yesterday while driving home, i saw several Mercedes with those new intelligent lights that flick on the respective fog lights as an additional light when you turn left or right. As they weaved in between traffic, one fog light would come on, then the next, then they'd both be on, then one would go off, then one come back on etc. It looked liked like lights were having a hissy fit, lol, and as Mercs are two a penny these days, I saw quite a few of them doing this.

But today, in thick fog, I saw not one new Mercedes with any lights on! How can you spend God know whatever Mercedes charges for intelligent cornering lights, and yet not put any lights on when it is foggy? Why spend all that money on expensive lights, and not use them?

Baffling.

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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by Scudetto View Post
it was very foggy here this morning.

As ever, the prime offender for not using any lights at all, were white vans and grey cars. And these are just the colours that do not stand out one bit in fog until you've pulled right into their unlit path.

Another thing that amused me. Yesterday while driving home, i saw several Mercedes with those new intelligent lights that flick on the respective fog lights as an additional light when you turn left or right. As they weaved in between traffic, one fog light would come on, then the next, then they'd both be on, then one would go off, then one come back on etc. It looked liked like lights were having a hissy fit, lol, and as Mercs are two a penny these days, I saw quite a few of them doing this.

But today, in thick fog, I saw not one new Mercedes with any lights on! How can you spend God know whatever Mercedes charges for intelligent cornering lights, and yet not put any lights on when it is foggy? Why spend all that money on expensive lights, and not use them?

Baffling.

g
The answer lies in your question. The lamps that come on when cornering are actually officially designated 'Cornering Lamps'. They are not fog lamps that are turned on when you turn a corner, and as such are not allowed to be used as fog lamps.
These cornering lamps are the first phase of a system called AFS (Adaptive Front lighting System) that is being ratified through the regulations at the moment. Basically it is a system of lights that adapt to the varying road and weather conditions to provide 'optimum' lighting. When it is fully ratified in the regulations then there will be a whole series of 'modes' of lighting that will be switched between depending on the type of road, speed and weather conditions. For example, there will be Town mode (wide beam close to car), Motorway mode (narrower beam, lifted slightly), Bending lamps (the beam follows the road by use of steering inputs), Cornering lamps (already on cars) and of course Fog mode (much the same as it already is).
Hope this clears up some of the confusion of what you have been seeing.
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by Mkii Spit View Post
The answer lies in your question. The lamps that come on when cornering are actually officially designated 'Cornering Lamps'. They are not fog lamps that are turned on when you turn a corner, and as such are not allowed to be used as fog lamps.
These cornering lamps are the first phase of a system called AFS (Adaptive Front lighting System) that is being ratified through the regulations at the moment. Basically it is a system of lights that adapt to the varying road and weather conditions to provide 'optimum' lighting. When it is fully ratified in the regulations then there will be a whole series of 'modes' of lighting that will be switched between depending on the type of road, speed and weather conditions. For example, there will be Town mode (wide beam close to car), Motorway mode (narrower beam, lifted slightly), Bending lamps (the beam follows the road by use of steering inputs), Cornering lamps (already on cars) and of course Fog mode (much the same as it already is).
Hope this clears up some of the confusion of what you have been seeing.
Hello Mkii Spit,

I am aware of the advances in lighting, and the intelligence being built into next generation lights. My question was, I guess, more of an ironic reflection of the sophistication of the lights not being matched by the brains of the car's owner who's failed to recognise that conditions warrant turning on the damn things on.

g

Last edited by Scudetto; 13-10-07 at 18:38.
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by Mkii Spit View Post
The answer lies in your question. The lamps that come on when cornering are actually officially designated 'Cornering Lamps'. They are not fog lamps that are turned on when you turn a corner, and as such are not allowed to be used as fog lamps.
These cornering lamps are the first phase of a system called AFS (Adaptive Front lighting System) that is being ratified through the regulations at the moment. Basically it is a system of lights that adapt to the varying road and weather conditions to provide 'optimum' lighting. When it is fully ratified in the regulations then there will be a whole series of 'modes' of lighting that will be switched between depending on the type of road, speed and weather conditions. For example, there will be Town mode (wide beam close to car), Motorway mode (narrower beam, lifted slightly), Bending lamps (the beam follows the road by use of steering inputs), Cornering lamps (already on cars) and of course Fog mode (much the same as it already is).
Hope this clears up some of the confusion of what you have been seeing.
F****** Nora! Why do we need all this s***?

What's wrong with a toggle switch on the (metal! ) dash.. marked "ON" and "OFF"?

Still.. it's Nature's way of getting crappy old Mercs off the road. When they go wrong (and they will) the cost of fixing them will be more than the C.O.M is worth.

Maybe I should sell "C.O.M Lighting conversion kits"... a bit of wiring to bypass all the doo-dahs, a relay for good measure and a toggle switch with "ON" and "OFF" marked on it.

Ralf S.

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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by Ralf S. View Post
F****** Nora! Why do we need all this s***?

What's wrong with a toggle switch on the (metal! ) dash.. marked "ON" and "OFF"?

Still.. it's Nature's way of getting crappy old Mercs off the road. When they go wrong (and they will) the cost of fixing them will be more than the C.O.M is worth.

Maybe I should sell "C.O.M Lighting conversion kits"... a bit of wiring to bypass all the doo-dahs, a relay for good measure and a toggle switch with "ON" and "OFF" marked on it.

Ralf S.
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

I agree, I'm all for drivers aids, but frankly if a driver is too dumb to be able to turn their lights on perhaps they shouldn't be behind the wheel
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

I agree with Gary.
A couple of days ago going to work on a main trunk road in the half light everyone had their lights on except one! Guess who that was? A BSM school car!!! It was still so dark I couldn't even see if there was one or two people in the car. That's just plain stupid!!!
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

We have them around here too. in the dark they use foglights but in the fog they don't uses them.

They must be a thick as the fog.
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by H14 GTV View Post
OK I like having foglights on the car as much as the next man - from an aesthetic point of view in that they give the car a 'sporty' appearance.

But why oh why must these fuds think they are doing the forest stage of the UK Rally on city streets with not a wisp of fog,mist or even rain present. Oh....and why do they have to drive Renault Clio's and Meganes generally?
HAHAHA. Exactly. If you have Xenons on your Alfa you realize that the foglights, high beams do ABSOLUTELY nothing to improve vision in any place with even a candlepower of outside lighting around.
 
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Re: Foglight Fuds!

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Originally Posted by Scudetto View Post
My question was, I guess, more of an ironic reflection of the sophistication of the lights not being matched by the brains of the car's owner who's failed to recognise that conditions warrant turning on the damn things on.
The more the car does on its own, the less people thing about what they need to do

Excuse me sir, are you the driver of this car?
Well it is an automatic officer, but I like to be there, just in case
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