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(Post Link) post #1 of 33 Old 16-09-08 Thread Starter
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Not Happy Average speed cameras

According to the Daily Express (voice of reason and font of all knowledge) the Govt or those who make decisions about what sort of cameras should be on our highways to rob the motorist are evidently considering installing average speed cameras along great lengths of other ''A'' roads and motorways. It is considered by those in the ''know'' that Gatso's etc only stop people from speeding for a short time whereas average speed cameras will be more effective in reducing speeding vehicles (well I never did ).

I am getting thoroughly fed up with all of these cameras, particularly average speed and hidden laser speed traps.

The 70 mph limit was intorduced in 1967 when many cars struggled to get anywhere near 70mph and their stupid drum brakes stopped a car eventually, if you were lucky and in a shunt cars just fell to bits. Cars are so much safer than they were, admittedly some of the driving leaves a little to be desired but it is time speed limits were reviewed particulalry for motorways and dual carriageways the 70mph limit is ridiculous on motorways these days 80mph would be more realistic (then I could drive on them at 90mph ) .

Where is this all going to end, i can see the motorist being monitored by satelite and our speed will be constantly monitored. What a deressing thought

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Re: Average speed cameras

You are confusing speeding cameras -SPECS or Gatso or otherwise - with safety and the need to reduce excessive speeds and what they are really for.

It's like smoking. The government spends a bit on advertising and wags its finger at the naughty smokers (not me but hey,each to their own if you don't blow it in my face), but in reality, they want people to keep smoking for the revenues it generates.

Hence, they want average speed cameras not to reduce speeds but to generate more cash.
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Re: Average speed cameras

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Originally Posted by 73GTVJim View Post
You are confusing speeding cameras -SPECS or Gatso or otherwise - with safety and the need to reduce excessive speeds and what they are really for.

It's like smoking. The government spends a bit on advertising and wags its finger at the naughty smokers (not me but hey,each to their own if you don't blow it in my face), but in reality, they want people to keep smoking for the revenues it generates.

Hence, they want average speed cameras not to reduce speeds but to generate more cash.
Your SOOOOOOO right....'money money money' but it's sooooo wrong

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Re: Average speed cameras

Another step on the way to the UK being a big open prison.
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Re: Average speed cameras

Come the revolution brothers!


We should be more French and deal with it in their peculiarly French but effectively democratic manner.
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Re: Average speed cameras

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Originally Posted by 73GTVJim View Post
You are confusing speeding cameras -SPECS or Gatso or otherwise - with safety and the need to reduce excessive speeds and what they are really for.

It's like smoking. The government spends a bit on advertising and wags its finger at the naughty smokers (not me but hey,each to their own if you don't blow it in my face), but in reality, they want people to keep smoking for the revenues it generates.

Hence, they want average speed cameras not to reduce speeds but to generate more cash.

Crickey I thought I had some cynical moments but you are sooooooo cycnical. So what you are saying is that the legilsators don't want to stop people speeding and safety is not their main concern.....it's all about money. i am not quite so sure or cynical as that .
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Re: Average speed cameras

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Come the revolution brothers!


We should be more French and deal with it in their peculiarly French but effectively democratic manner.
nuke 'em
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Re: Average speed cameras

I would certainly agree that speed cameras have little or nothing to do with safety, but everything to do with raising funds for the government.
Oh, I nearly forgot, as long as we all agree to it!!!!
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Re: Average speed cameras

what he said....nuke em!
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Re: Average speed cameras

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Crickey I thought I had some cynical moments but you are sooooooo cycnical. So what you are saying is that the legilsators don't want to stop people speeding and safety is not their main concern.....it's all about money. i am not quite so sure or cynical as that .
Think it through. Tobacco sales tax is one of the biggest revenue streams the gov't has. Speeding and the naughty motorists' various taxes is another captive audinence already heavily soaked but open to maximising profits like any ruthless business organisation would do. They NEED us doing all these "wrong" things and they want to bleed us as far as possible without actually stopping it much.

If the whole country was to suddenly ALL stop driving, buying fuel, fags and alcohol overnight (as if) and if sustained even for only a month it this gov't would absolutely shat itself. The gravy train would be de-railed pronto.


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Re: Average speed cameras

Another scamera partnership scheme in order to pay for the useless, bloated, non-productive job creation scheme that is HMP Great Britain.

When the revolution comes....
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Re: Average speed cameras

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Originally Posted by 73GTVJim View Post
Think it through. Tobacco sales tax is one of the biggest revenue streams the gov't has. Speeding and the naughty motorists' various taxes is another captive audinence already heavily soaked but open to maximising profits like any ruthless business organisation would do.

If the whole country was to suddenly ALL stop driving, buying fuel, fags and alcohol overnight (as if) and if sustained even for only a month it this gov't would absolutely shat itself. The gravy train would be de-railed pronto.
I could easily stop two out of those three particulalry as I dont indulge in one of those vices...if we did half the nation would be suicidal.... but just think of the space on the road after that
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Re: Average speed cameras

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Where is this all going to end, i can see the motorist being monitored by satelite and our speed will be constantly monitored. What a deressing thought
That's already a reality in some respects. The technology exists to have every car on the road monitored and tracked night and day with everything recorded onto a black box. Big Brother monitors the monitoring and reports the reportings to the police who do the policing. And then you get arrested and raped in the shower.

It's only a matter of time before its implemented.
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Re: Average speed cameras

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The 70 mph limit was intorduced in 1967 when many cars struggled to get anywhere near 70mph and their stupid drum brakes stopped a car eventually, if you were lucky and in a shunt cars just fell to bits. Cars are so much safer than they were, admittedly some of the driving leaves a little to be desired but it is time speed limits were reviewed particulalry for motorways and dual carriageways the 70mph limit is ridiculous on motorways these days 80mph would be more realistic
You're forgetting density of traffic. I'm up and down the M6 every day and often it isn't even possible to reach 70 because of the amount of traffic on the road, so increasing the limit to 80, 90 or more wouldn't necessarily reduce journey times.

However, the speed limit on motorways is no longer about safety it is in effect another 'green' tax (or to be more precise a Brown tax). As has already been suggested an increase in the limit would mean a reduction in fines and therefore a reduction in revenues. Also the Green lobby is putting significant pressure on the government in Germany to put speed limits on the unrestricted parts of the Autobahn in order to reduce emissions. Fortunately for our German friends the car-lobby there is far stronger thanks to having a strong car industry (incidentally, a car industry that us Brits helped set up before going on to destroy our own). Unfortunately for us though this means absolutely no chance of increasing the speed limit and in fact what we'll see is more and more speed limit reductions.

If the government was genuinely interested in road safety it would make the test far more difficult and implement regular re-testing to weed out those that have no clue of how to drive (chavs, old people, women, BMW drivers etc). This would reduce the amount of traffic on the roads and increase the average level of competence, thus making the roads a safer place to be. However it would also reduce revenues from fuel, VED, fines, etc etc and therefore it will never happen.

The world would be a far better place if I were in charge. [/rant]

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Re: Average speed cameras

Question? Which are the safest roads in the UK
Answer ... Motorways ...

There will have to a be massive investment to get this to work, not only adding the cameras themselves, but also the "back end" work of processing the data, it's not just a case of bolting on more computers to do the job (which is how politicians think), the database used to store this data would have to be MASSIVE and as such would need managing in a different fashion to how the current speed camera system works ...


... IMO the money would be better spent elsewhere
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Re: Average speed cameras

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If the government was genuinely interested in road safety it would make the test far more difficult and implement regular re-testing to weed out those that have no clue of how to drive (chavs, old people, women, BMW drivers etc). This would reduce the amount of traffic on the roads and increase the average level of competence, thus making the roads a safer place to be.
I've long been an advocate of this sort of thing. Regular re-tests, medical - including eyesight tests - every 5 years (more often for those over 60 - perhaps annually) Also 2 yearly theory test including highway code, and motorway questions.

Also put an end to this system of a foreign passport being ok to drive anywhere. you should have to prove your ability to drive in a foreign country. (and I of course include Brits moving abroad and driving in their new country)

Finally - random drug and alcohol testing, as done in some countries on the continent.

The standard of driving in this country is largely appalling, and only stringent plans like this will do anything to reverse it.
 
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Re: Average speed cameras

i think the standard of driving in general in the uk is actually ok. but multi-lane roundabouts should be an integral part of the driving test - why oh why can't people master how to use a bloody roundabout properly

as for foreign drivers i couldn't agree more. i drive through a couple of areas of manchester on the way to work which are predominantly immigrant populated and the driving is absolutely f*cking APPALLING. i drive through there about 20mph because you never know who the hell's going to pull out in front of you or drive straight at you, and in what direction, it's a bloody free-for-all

as for the specs cameras well you know it's only a matter of time until the entire road network is policed by them so it will be impossible to speed anywhere without getting caught.

i'm with jim on this one - we need to be more french about this kind of stuff - DIRECT ACTION, mes freres

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Re: Average speed cameras

Lets all go live in Swindon - have they actually takenteh cameras down yet.

Alfaspeed is right thetechnology is outthere to monitor every car 24/7 - noirwich union did an insurance scheme whereby they fitted your car with the technology and your monthly premium was based on where and when you drove.

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Re: Average speed cameras

Al, I am from North Manchester and it's with great trepidation I drive on Cheetham Hill road at all. I tend to hoon around in a smart car, it's easier to avoid people doing 7 point turns at traffic lights that way. Some of the driving defies belief.
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Re: Average speed cameras

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Lets all go live in Swindon - have they actually takenteh cameras down yet.

Alfaspeed is right thetechnology is outthere to monitor every car 24/7 - noirwich union did an insurance scheme whereby they fitted your car with the technology and your monthly premium was based on where and when you drove.

Ah yes private companies can manage it (look at the data processing the Vodafone does on a daily basis) ... but getting the government to organise such a scheme .. forget it!!! because you know what would happen with the requirements, it would be a case of "wouldn't it be nice if it it "this" and "that" as well ... oh and also "the other" ... oh and how easy would it be to squeeze in "something else" ... and all of a sudden you have a complete mess that cannot be effectively engineered ...
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Re: Average speed cameras

I'm not sure I understand the fuss about average speed cameras. Have you ever worked out your average speed? Is it not a lot lower than your highest speed on the journey. Doesn't that mean that as long as you drive below the speed limit at some point you can also drive above it so that your average will be within the limit.

I really don't see the problem. Better than a fixed point limit in my view.



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Re: Average speed cameras

Following on from Gibbo's post, does an average speed camera clock you highest speed

I see loads of cars blasting into the road works near Luton only to slow down & swap lanes etc. to avoid detection

If these do get introduced, all that'll happen is drivers who wish to drive fast (safely or not - that's another argument not for here), will bolster the detection & ECM devices they fit to their cars to compensate for this increased threat.....
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Re: Average speed cameras

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Following on from Gibbo's post, does an average speed camera clock you highest speed

I see loads of cars blasting into the road works near Luton only to slow down & swap lanes etc. to avoid detection

If these do get introduced, all that'll happen is drivers who wish to drive fast (safely or not - that's another argument not for here), will bolster the detection & ECM devices they fit to their cars to compensate for this increased threat.....
ECM??? Electronic Counter Measures????
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Re: Average speed cameras

We have average speed cameras on the A2 for a ten mile stretch. There are still three lanes available, but this has been going on for a couple of years, with little evidence of work being done. If you go along there late at night or early morning, it would be very easy to let the speed drift above 50 MPH - how far above the limit do you have to go? So, here we have a three lane main road with a 50 limit, whilst the single carriageway B roads (pedestrians, horses, cyclists) are national speed limit. Where is the sense in all of this? There is none, it is just a method of getting more money out of us!!
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Re: Average speed cameras

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I really don't see the problem. Better than a fixed point limit in my view.
I agree that they're much, much better than fixed camera points, but I'd still rather be trusted to drive safely as a qualified driver, as opposed to being forced to comply.

In my opinion the carrot is far better than the stick, but that's never been the way of dealing with motorists.
 
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