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NHS pay rise - Ambulance Staff

Basically, ambulance staff have been screwed over.

The new terms mean I will get 40(net), per month, extra in the 1st year, then a tenner a month extra for the following 2 years. I'm coming up to 9 years of service with only a 1% rise per year for the past 7.

Inflation is expected to rise by 9.6% over the next 3 years
Any transfer of position will result in being removed from the Agenda for Change policy (for ambulance staff), which means a mid-grade paramedic, wanting to better themselves to become a Senior Paramedic (managerial and clinical advice role), will result in a PAY CUT!
Why would people want to be promoted for less pay?


If I want to progress from an EMT to Paramedic (which I do), I will be worse off by 2000 for the first 2 years, and then it will take another 2 years to be better off from where I am now.

Great incentive, eh?

Well done, J Hunt, Well done indeed.

Last edited by stan laurel; 17-06-18 at 00:56.
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Eh? They just shook the Brexit Magic Money Tree™ no?


https://www.bbc.com/news/health-44495598
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Plain truth is that the present government will not honestly and sufficiently tax its supporters and cronies amongst the super rich, corporations, non doms., gangster state based entities and so on and so forth.... that means they will poorly resource all those state undertakings of no particular interest to anyone but the masses. The police, the NHS, prisons and probation services, the military, diplomatic service.

Don't get me on to the vast resources that will have to be diverted from elsewhere to control our borders, trade, and to generaly cover for the vacuums caused by leaving all the institutions of the EU.

'kin lunacy.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by stan laurel View Post
Basically, ambulance staff have been screwed over.

The new terms mean I will get 40(net), per month, extra in the 1st year, then a tenner a month extra for the following 2 years. I'm coming up to 9 years of service with only a 1% rise per year for the past 7.

Inflation is expected to rise by 9.6% over the next 3 years
Any transfer of position will result in being removed from the Agenda for Change policy (for ambulance staff), which means a mid-grade paramedic, wanting to better themselves to become a Senior Paramedic (managerial and clinical advice role), will result in a PAY CUT!
Why would people want to be promoted for less pay?


If I want to progress from an EMT to Paramedic (which I do), I will be worse off by 2000 for the first 2 years, and then it will take another 2 years to be better off from where I am now.

Great incentive, eh?

Well done, J Hunt, Well done indeed.
Stan...Govt don't give 2 f**ks about you or anyone else in the public service.....sure didn't we cause the financial crash...we should be thankful we have a job.
And they will spout out their usual "how you all do a wonderful job".....it's nauseating !!
They are a shower of s**te !!
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To get my final grades at work I had to come off double days shift and work days for a year. That was a 4k hit that year. That was nearly 10 years ago now and I'm so glad I did it because not only have I recouped the loss and more I'm also in a better position pension wise.
Don't think of it as a loss because in the long run you'll benefit.
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I may be unpopular with this but I have never understood why public employment, (teachers, NHS, local government etc) have always had annual pay increases merely for length of service. Yes I know that increased service equates to (or should equate to) increased experience and knowledge but in private industry and commece that increase in experience leads to promotion and higher pay and any annual increases are only compensation for inflation. Length of service in the same role and at the same level of responsibility should be irrelevant. If some one is competent at the job after their probationary period then no amount of increased service is going to make them more valuable unless they are capable of doing a higher grade in which case they get promoted or move to a different employer.

Annual length of service increases can be self defeating as after a time any promotion can mean either no more pay or even a pay cut and hence the incentive to improve ones skills/grade is removed.

Procrastination is the thief of time
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Given the sorry state of the NHS I'm surprised everyone
working in it doesn't get huge payrises and bonus payouts.

That's how it works in the private sector, right?
Drive your company into the dirt and pick up a
huuuuge cheque for a job well done!

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyGr View Post
I may be unpopular with this but I have never understood why public employment, (teachers, NHS, local government etc) have always had annual pay increases merely for length of service. Yes I know that increased service equates to (or should equate to) increased experience and knowledge but in private industry and commece that increase in experience leads to promotion and higher pay and any annual increases are only compensation for inflation. Length of service in the same role and at the same level of responsibility should be irrelevant. If some one is competent at the job after their probationary period then no amount of increased service is going to make them more valuable unless they are capable of doing a higher grade in which case they get promoted or move to a different employer.

Annual length of service increases can be self defeating as after a time any promotion can mean either no more pay or even a pay cut and hence the incentive to improve ones skills/grade is removed.
Where I work its the inverse of what you'd expect. If you've been in the same role for too long, you get fired.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyGr View Post
I may be unpopular with this but I have never understood why public employment, (teachers, NHS, local government etc) have always had annual pay increases merely for length of service. Yes I know that increased service equates to (or should equate to) increased experience and knowledge but in private industry and commece that increase in experience leads to promotion and higher pay and any annual increases are only compensation for inflation. Length of service in the same role and at the same level of responsibility should be irrelevant. If some one is competent at the job after their probationary period then no amount of increased service is going to make them more valuable unless they are capable of doing a higher grade in which case they get promoted or move to a different employer.

Annual length of service increases can be self defeating as after a time any promotion can mean either no more pay or even a pay cut and hence the incentive to improve ones skills/grade is removed.
They don't. For the most part old fashioned pay scales have disappeared these days. What we have instead are old farts like me earning more than the youngsters will ever earn for doing the same job. I changed roles completely about 5 years ago and there are people who have been doing the same job for longer who earn less.

If you are lazy and crap, and your manager can be arsed to grasp the nettle, you might miss out on a 1% payrise (or less). Flog your tripe out and you might (and I stress might) get a one-off bonus of a few hundred quid.

The new blood entering the civil service and either disappear into management development programmes or leave completely.

The senior civil servants, on the other hand, have arrangements more similar to MPs and get performance based bonuses running into thousands.

If your aim was to create an ageing and not especially motivated workforce, it's an excellent model.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keithyboy View Post
They don't. For the most part old fashioned pay scales have disappeared these days. What we have instead are old farts like me earning more than the youngsters will ever earn for doing the same job. I changed roles completely about 5 years ago and there are people who have been doing the same job for longer who earn less.

If you are lazy and crap, and your manager can be arsed to grasp the nettle, you might miss out on a 1% payrise (or less). Flog your tripe out and you might (and I stress might) get a one-off bonus of a few hundred quid.

The new blood entering the civil service and either disappear into management development programmes or leave completely.

The senior civil servants, on the other hand, have arrangements more similar to MPs and get performance based bonuses running into thousands.

If your aim was to create an ageing and not especially motivated workforce, it's an excellent model.
Well put KB.....the civil service is rotten from senior management down....the sooner the public realise how badly their taxes are being spent the better...and it all emanates from the top.
The lower grades are being crucified.
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In theory then, the new scales address both the time serving issue and the promotion one. Short bands (only 3 salary points) mean that whilst you may have some reflection of gained wisdom/experience there is no incentive to languish in your safe status quo. As a result seeking promotion should be the only way up.

There is also an attempt to stop people automatically getting their incremental increase if they are not up to date with mandatory training and personal review.

Is it the right approach?

Depends on the managers.
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Quote:
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In theory then, the new scales address both the time serving issue and the promotion one. Short bands (only 3 salary points) mean that whilst you may have some reflection of gained wisdom/experience there is no incentive to languish in your safe status quo. As a result seeking promotion should be the only way up.

There is also an attempt to stop people automatically getting their incremental increase if they are not up to date with mandatory training and personal review.

Is it the right approach?

Depends on the managers.
The bands aren't getting shorter though. With 1% to play with, you can't bring up the entry point in any meaningful way. It will take people at the entry point for the grade literally a decade or more to reach the maximum.

My salary has been eroded year on year for the best part of ten years. That's my reward for being good at what I do. A few of the aforementioned bonuses have come my way as a result so I am one of the lucky ones in that respect.

If you announce increases for the NHS, or the police, or the fire service people will nod in agreement. Announce it for teachers and you'll get all that crap about umpteen weeks holiday. Announce that you're giving civil servants 5% or whatever and there will be uproar because, although people have no clue about what we do, they know we do sod all.
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The proposed NHS award basically reduces all of bands to three points, entry, mid and top.

https://www.nhspay.org/what-does-the-deal-mean-for-me/

...although we understand you do sod all
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I didn't know there were gigolos in the public sector.
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I would happily bet 5 English pounds that such a scheme won't happen in the civil service. There are so many people rooted to the bottom of payscales that it would cost a fortune.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keithy View Post
The proposed NHS award basically reduces all of bands to three points, entry, mid and top.

https://www.nhspay.org/what-does-the-deal-mean-for-me/

...although we understand you do sod all
Throw me in that basket too !!
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