This Sharia law cobblers - Alfa Romeo Forum
You are currently unregistered, register for more features.    
Rant Room Clean ranting only - No Swearing!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
emgee
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
This Sharia law cobblers

This may prove a tactical error, but as we've been discussing the ol' racial harmony stuff a bit, can we get this Sharia law cobblers out of the way? It appears some old codger in a frock has been muttering into his Ovaltine about it and there's been hardly anything else on the radio all day.

It's a complete non-story. Nobody in any official, or indeed relevant, position has proposed this. If you actually look up the story he's only been banging on about civil stuff (divorce and financial arrangements) that only matters to those involved. Anyway, it isn't going to happen.

Half the country has probably leaped to the conclusion by now that severed hands will be clogging up the Old Bailey. Hasn't this old duffer got anything better to do?
 
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Rayq81
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Can, Worms, Open,.................
 
emgee
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Well somebody was going to.
 
Rayq81
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by emgee View Post
Well somebody was going to.
where was the story from emgee ?? so i can have a read
 
Status: -
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,679
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Check BBC news.....


Chris
chrisd_b is offline  
Status: happier today
AO Silver Member
 
merlin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Kent
Posts: 2,437
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Oh it's him
merlin is offline  
Rayq81
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Yes its cobblers
 
Status: -
AO Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,211

Member car:

1973 Spider 2000

Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by emgee View Post
It's a complete non-story. Nobody in any official, or indeed relevant, position has proposed this. If you actually look up the story he's only been banging on about civil stuff (divorce and financial arrangements) that only matters to those involved. Anyway, it isn't going to happen.

Whatever officially is or isn't happening isn't my place to say, since I'm not a resident of your country and since it has little direct influence on our daily lives in this country.

What I do feel I have a right to say is that it doesn't matter only to those involved. It matters to the an entire free nation that all people are treated equally and given equal rights under the law of the land (whatever that law may be).

Say for example a woman wants a divorce from her husband. If the general law of the land allows for that to happen, then she should be allowed to get one. There shouldn't be a separate laws saying, "oh, by the way, people of this religious group aren't entitled to the same legal procedures simply because their religion doesn't support it." I don't care if it is Sharia law, Talumdic law, Catholic law, Mormon law or Scientologist law. At any point in a person's life s/he should have the right to either renounce his/her religion or say, "even though my book of worship and my over-riding religious authority says xyz I don't believe I should be bound by those dictates, and I am free to chose the opposite path."

By running alternative systems of law (or faith-based arbitration) for matters of civil disputes, there is an unfair burden placed on the parties involved, especially if one of the parties is living under a system that doesn't recognize equality between the people involved due to race, gender, sexual orientation, etc. In those cases pressure from the societal group can become over-whelming and can prevent a person from acting in his/her own self-interest.

This province flirted with accepting limited use of Sharia law for family disputes, but the idea was eventually rejected by our government. The sad part it that it took the possible implementation of Muslim-based system to move the people to action, whereas the implementation of Catholic and Jewish-based systems a few years earlier didn't cause any uproar. Thankfully the Premier got this one call right and said that there would be no place for any religious-based parallel system in the future.

In case anybody is interested this link provides some background as to what happened in Ontario, as does the embedded link within the story.
--Toronto
Toronto Spider is offline  
Status: Gold Member
AO Gold Member
 
rarebear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 7,032

Member car:

911, 156, Merc C

Re: This Sharia law cobblers

I fully backup Toronto Spider ! in our country (Holland) there is a discussion in government whether women may wear a Bhurka in public life or not.... if you would have told this 10 years ago you would spent some time in a straight jacket in a padded room, but now it is reality.. this is all part of the salami tactics , slice by slice religious zealots try to get hold of our freedom.
All this religious stuff wheter it be Islamic, Mormon, Yehovah witness, scientology and what have you make me sick to the stomach.
Every person has a right to believe in whatever he or she wants, but please leave people who do not believe in the supernatural in peace !
And on the pratical side of things , I think that women in Bhurka make bad motorist ! they cannot see what's going on in traffic...
Oh boy what a load of crap do we have to cope with !!!

Rarebear 'fastest piston engine airplane in the world' 4000 hp twinspark (!) radial engine.
Thta's what we call an ENGINE>>>>
rarebear is offline  
Status: Busy busy busy!
Club Member
Membro Premio
 
Pud237's Avatar
 
Club Member Number: 71
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cumbria
Posts: 44,883
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by rarebear View Post
I fully backup Toronto Spider ! in our country (Holland) there is a discussion in government whether women may wear a Bhurka in public life or not.... if you would have told this 10 years ago you would spent some time in a straight jacket in a padded room, but now it is reality.. this is all part of the salami tactics , slice by slice religious zealots try to get hold of our freedom.
All this religious stuff wheter it be Islamic, Mormon, Yehovah witness, scientology and what have you make me sick to the stomach.
Every person has a right to believe in whatever he or she wants, but please leave people who do not believe in the supernatural in peace !
And on the pratical side of things , I think that women in Bhurka make bad motorist ! they cannot see what's going on in traffic...
Oh boy what a load of crap do we have to cope with !!!
I don't see why it should be against the law to wear a Burka in public, unless it is already against the law to have your face covered up (ie for security reasons), in which case the law should stand and Burka's banned. But in a country where there is no law forbidding the wearing masks, why should a certain culture be banned from dressing in a way they want?
Pud237 is offline  
Status: Broken again...
AO Platinum Member
 
GhostyDog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Right Side O The Pennines
County: West Yorkshire
Posts: 25,672
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Spider View Post
Whatever officially is or isn't happening isn't my place to say, since I'm not a resident of your country and since it has little direct influence on our daily lives in this country....
--Toronto
Good post
GhostyDog is offline  
Status: Gold Member
AO Gold Member
 
rarebear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 7,032

Member car:

911, 156, Merc C

Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Pud237... its plain dangerous in traffic that's why ! and in the countries where it is culture (sic) to hide women , women our not even allowed to drive cars !!
rarebear is offline  
Rayq81
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pud237 View Post
I don't see why it should be against the law to wear a Burka in public, unless it is already against the law to have your face covered up (ie for security reasons), in which case the law should stand and Burka's banned. But in a country where there is no law forbidding the wearing masks, why should a certain culture be banned from dressing in a way they want?
are motorcyclists asked to remove helmets in Garages, shops etc ?? shopping centres are banning hoodies ?? so why not ban the bhurkas in similar circumstances, personally i dont care if they want to wear them in the street and risk the abuse thats their choice, but its the old story i recently was in Tunisia and the western women were told to cover up in certain places or risk breaking religious laws no one argued everyone done it out of respect for their laws and religion....when in Rome
 
Status: -
AO Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 6,211

Member car:

1973 Spider 2000

Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Tangent Alert.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostyDog View Post
Good post
Sorry Ghosty, I'd like to request a bit of clarification.

Do you mean that just the part you quoted you consider good (i.e. the part about me not having the right to comment on what's going on in the U.K.) or did you meant that you liked the whole post?

I only ask as I'm a bit sensitive about popping into threads that are so strictly U.K.-based.

When the balance here was a bit more even between U.K.-residents and those outside of the U.K. there was a much more comfortable atmosphere with regards to commenting on threads (especially more serious threads) that discussed issues outside of our individual national borders. Since the influx of more members, the balance has shifted and what used to be three or four or five U.K AOers to one foreigner has become something that feels more like 20 or 30 (or more) to one. With that shift has come more of an inward-looking perspective and more of a feeling (intentional or not) that foreigners aren't as welcomed to contribute.

Now I'm not saying it's anything blatant. Instead it's more the little things. For example in this thread, the initial post almost seems to be written in code ("cobblers, old codger in a frock," etc.) which is fine for anybody who already knows the story, but it's a bit cryptic for somebody outside of the country. Now as I had already seen the topic discussed (including a link and quotations) on a different forum, I didn't need to go searching for answers, but I'm guessing other people do.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not picking on emgee at all. It's only natural that people in a similar situation (i.e. country of residence) can understand short-hand references to current events, but in the past (yes I know I'm whining about how things used to be again ) there was a bit more awareness of the fact that this is (or used to be) an international forum so posters would generally include links, summaries, etc. Also, as I said, it used to be a bit more commonplace for Europeans, Aussies, North and Central Americans, etc. to share their opinions on threads that were centred around British-based topics. Today that just doesn't seem to happen.
--Toronto
Toronto Spider is offline  
Status: Busy busy busy!
Club Member
Membro Premio
 
Pud237's Avatar
 
Club Member Number: 71
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cumbria
Posts: 44,883
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by rarebear View Post
Pud237... its plain dangerous in traffic that's why ! and in the countries where it is culture (sic) to hide women , women our not even allowed to drive cars !!
So is there a rule that says you can't wear a bag over your head while driving, or doing something else that obscures your vision? If so, that rule would also apply to religious head gear also (I agree there should be no exception made for religious head gear).

If there isn't a rule that stops someone from obscuring their vision through clothing/accessories while driving then thats the first thing that needs to go through parliament.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rayq81 View Post
are motorcyclists asked to remove helmets in Garages, shops etc ?? shopping centres are banning hoodies ?? so why not ban the bhurkas in similar circumstances, personally i dont care if they want to wear them in the street and risk the abuse thats their choice, but its the old story i recently was in Tunisia and the western women were told to cover up in certain places or risk breaking religious laws no one argued everyone done it out of respect for their laws and religion....when in Rome
I believe firmly in personal property rights, so I think it should be up to the owner of any shop/property who he lets in and who he serves, regardless of his/her reasons for doing so. If a hotelier doesn't want a homosexual couple sleeping in his hotel, thats his prerogative. If a shop owner doesn't want to allow in women in Burka's, then thats fair do's. Same if he doesn't want to allow in women in trousers, or goths, or chavs in hoodies. I believe the law should back up the property owner on what he does or allows to happen in his own property (including whether or not he allows smoking on his premises).


EDIT: But I believe in a public place, wearing any form of clothing (religious/cultural) should be legal.

Autolusso Penrith - UK's leading independent Alfa Romeo specialist with branches in Bedfordshire, Cumbria & Dorset

Wizard Exhaust systems available here

Tel: 01768 879 171
Pud237 is offline  
Status: Life is good atm. I do not take that for granted.
Global Mod Team
 
PaulR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: United Kingdom
County: Suffolk
Posts: 22,971
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Spider View Post
Tangent Alert.



Sorry Ghosty, I'd like to request a bit of clarification.

Do you mean that just the part you quoted you consider good (i.e. the part about me not having the right to comment on what's going on in the U.K.) or did you meant that you liked the whole post?

I only ask as I'm a bit sensitive about popping into threads that are so strictly U.K.-based.

When the balance here was a bit more even between U.K.-residents and those outside of the U.K. there was a much more comfortable atmosphere with regards to commenting on threads (especially more serious threads) that discussed issues outside of our individual national borders. Since the influx of more members, the balance has shifted and what used to be three or four or five U.K AOers to one foreigner has become something that feels more like 20 or 30 (or more) to one. With that shift has come more of an inward-looking perspective and more of a feeling (intentional or not) that foreigners aren't as welcomed to contribute.

Now I'm not saying it's anything blatant. Instead it's more the little things. For example in this thread, the initial post almost seems to be written in code ("cobblers, old codger in a frock," etc.) which is fine for anybody who already knows the story, but it's a bit cryptic for somebody outside of the country. Now as I had already seen the topic discussed (including a link and quotations) on a different forum, I didn't need to go searching for answers, but I'm guessing other people do.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not picking on emgee at all. It's only natural that people in a similar situation (i.e. country of residence) can understand short-hand references to current events, but in the past (yes I know I'm whining about how things used to be again ) there was a bit more awareness of the fact that this is (or used to be) an international forum so posters would generally include links, summaries, etc. Also, as I said, it used to be a bit more commonplace for Europeans, Aussies, North and Central Americans, etc. to share their opinions on threads that were centred around British-based topics. Today that just doesn't seem to happen.
--Toronto
An interesting post T.

Unlike you I am a relative newcomer so I just interject with all of my colloquial expressions which, I admit I take for granted, I think everyone understands.

To be fair I have noticed that if people don't understand they usually ask and the responses are more often than not helpful.

Like anything forums change with time - the demography shifts and at times individuals feel that "it was not what it was". However shifts are continual and, if you stick with it, it often comes back to what it was.

I think, in my own stumbling way, I am saying don't abandon us TS - we still have something to offer you (whoever we are now).

Paul.

Seen an offensive/spam post? Report it! Click the or button next to the post.
AO Rules - AO Gallery - AO Classified adverts - AO Club - AO Traders

Last edited by PaulR; 07-02-08 at 19:17. Reason: I missed an "s" from "something"
PaulR is offline  
Status: Busy busy busy!
Club Member
Membro Premio
 
Pud237's Avatar
 
Club Member Number: 71
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cumbria
Posts: 44,883
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Spider View Post
it used to be a bit more commonplace for Europeans, Aussies, North and Central Americans, etc. to share their opinions on threads that were centred around British-based topics. Today that just doesn't seem to happen.
--Toronto
I wish that happened a bit more, its good to get an outside perspective.
Pud237 is offline  
Status: One foot in, one foot out!
AO Platinum Member
 
zulu ferret's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: wgc
County: herts
Posts: 42,278
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Storm in a teacup? Time for the Archbishop to step down? Prior to this bit of news, I had been watching CNN, where the reporter was with a young professional lady in Saudi Arabia,giving a rendition on the extreme restrictions on females over there. What a ludicrous world we live in.
Time to look to the Techie' stuff for me, and trip myself up a little on that front.
zulu ferret is offline  
Status: -
AO Silver Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,301
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

[QUOTE=Toronto Spider;1564492

--Toronto[/QUOTE]
Great post, love it.
John.
ludite is online now  
Status: Breraless :(
AO Platinum Member
 
Squadrone Rosso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: United Kingdom
County: Neath Port Talbot
Posts: 30,126
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

The AB of C is as barking as the Queens' hubby

If I understand his ramblings correctly, he's saying that Sharia Law should be applicable to the Muslim folk in the UK as it can be more effective than the good ol' law of the land

I want to know what Sharia's take on speeding is? If I can drive like a nutter and not accrue any points, where's my nearest Mosque
Squadrone Rosso is offline  
Status: Molto felice
AO Rosso Alfa Member
 
Gibbo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: United Kingdom
County: Bristol
Posts: 54,872
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Probably best not jump to conclusions here and find out what he really said



Gibbo is offline  
Status: zzzzzzzz
AO Platinum Member
 
symon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: United Kingdom
County: Oxfordshire
Posts: 37,079
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

If people living here don't like our laws they you go and live somewhere else. Not try to impose change on those that already accept our way of life.

As for Rowan Williams, sack him.
symon is offline  
Status: -
AO Platinum Member
 
nomad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
County: -
Posts: 43,564

Member car:

RRS TDV8 HSE

Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Quote:
Originally Posted by symonh2000 View Post
If people living here don't like our laws they you go and live somewhere else. Not try to impose change on those that already accept our way of life.
As for Rowan Williams, sack him.
Exactly What He Said !!

I should have tried to implement a similar thing - i.e. Impose UK laws for Expats - when I was in the UAE... I'm sure the authorities would have been more than happy to do that !!

Thinking about it... it would be a bit like trying to force your posting style and personally desired thread content/lamguage on the rest of the AO members !!

Who the :sw: in their right mind would try to do that

Last edited by nomad; 08-02-08 at 07:49.
nomad is offline  
Status: The BSD says konnichiwa
Global Mod Team
 
BigFoot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Japan
County: Tokyo
Posts: 114,689
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

Although I sympathise with symonh2000's statement, I have the impression that the people demanding changes are not Johnny Foreigners, off the boat, type people, simply other British (Muslim) people who have a different view.

I think if some part of society (animal lovers) fought and won to get fox hunting banned (I think that was the case) would that be classified as "others who don't like our laws"?

That statement of yours symonh2000 is fallacious on that basis.

Therefore, I think that trying to change the laws of a country is simply part of the democratic process.

Yet, I wholly agree with Toronto Spider saying that all people in a country should live under the same rules and laws. That's the basis for a harmonious and honest society. So, someone trying to change the laws so that different set of rules apply to a section of society simply because of religious beliefs should be rejected at once.

I mean, my faith obliges me not to pay taxes. So, the government should apply a different set of rules for me and stop bugging me for money

Seen an offensive/spam post? Report it! Click the or button next to the post.


1934 - 1938 - 1982 - 2006
BigFoot is offline  
Status: zzzzzzzz
AO Platinum Member
 
symon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: United Kingdom
County: Oxfordshire
Posts: 37,079
Re: This Sharia law cobblers

The thing is though BF, that with the hunting ban a majority of people supported the ban, we are supposedly a democracy after all..

The UK is a majority Christian/Atheist country, Why should we change laws to make the other 3% odd of other religions happy.

Having said that Public Floggings would be a good deterrent for antisocial behaviour...
symon is offline  
Reply

Go Back   Alfa Romeo Forum > Misc Lounges > Community Discussions > Rant Room

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome