Do you believe in climate change? - Alfa Romeo Forum
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View Poll Results: Are we affecting the climate?
Yes. 18 33.33%
Yes but insignificantly. 20 37.04%
No 12 22.22%
other 4 7.41%
Voters: 54. You may not vote on this poll

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EddieGTA
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Do you believe in climate change?

Reading more and more about this and I am sick to death of it. I just wonder what people here think?

Personally I think what we do may affect the climate but it will be so insignificant, history has shown climate changing back and forth long before the car and industrialization.

My concern personally is not with climate change, but our over dependancy on fossil fuels, that will eventually run out.

In the bigger picture I see nothing available at present other than nuclear power that would meet our energy needs should we have no oil.
 
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

I wish we could concentrate on how to deal with the phenomenal waste that man creates rather than dwelling on catastrophe theories.

The more you tell folk that 'The end is nigh', the more they ignore you. Just ask the chap with the sandwich board at Hyde Park Corner



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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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I wish we could concentrate on how to deal with the phenomenal waste that man creates rather than dwelling on catastrophe theories.
Exactly Mr G.
 
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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I wish we could concentrate on how to deal with the phenomenal waste that man creates rather than dwelling on catastrophe theories.

The more you tell folk that 'The end is nigh', the more they ignore you. Just ask the chap with the sandwich board at Hyde Park Corner
Very true Gibbo

I often how much time and energy is wasted on trying to 'educate' all us thickos as to how bad C02 emmisions are and coming up with crazy ideas.

I even read that the olympic flame in London will use low carbon fuel, I mean ffs!!!
 
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

Yes - Climate Change is a fact. The cause is (slightly) debatable (the bulk of evidence points to CO2 and other greenhouse gas emmissions). The consequences could be disastrous.

The fact that there have been natural changes in the past is burying our heads in the sand. A natural change would have dire consequences as well.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

I think it is happening, but it is part of a natural cycle. I do think that human activity may be speeding the process up though.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

I believe climate change is real, but 100% natural.

I still care about the planet so i like to minimise waste and recycle where possible.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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Yes - Climate Change is a fact. The cause is (slightly) debatable (the bulk of evidence points to CO2 and other greenhouse gas emmissions). The consequences could be disastrous.

The fact that there have been natural changes in the past is burying our heads in the sand. A natural change would have dire consequences as well.
Well put.

The evidence is pretty clear. Even the George Bush and the oil companies in the US (i.e. those whose self-interests are best served by denial) are finally accepting the mountain of evidence.

Meanwhile, most of us just go about our daily lives reading the speculation and BS in the papers, and watching TV and believing in whatever we want to believe in - regardless of the evidence which is there to be found (if you try).
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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Originally Posted by Gibbo View Post
I wish we could concentrate on how to deal with the phenomenal waste that man creates rather than dwelling on catastrophe theories.
The more you tell folk that 'The end is nigh', the more they ignore you. Just ask the chap with the sandwich board at Hyde Park Corner
What He Said !!
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

The world has started to go thru one of it's many climate changes,as it has done in the past.we cant stop it or slow it down,that would be interfering with mother nature herself.so we'll have to go along for the ride and see what happens.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

The climate changes all by itself, countless ice ages have proven this, people should stop whinging about it and stock up on canned goods and warm clothes for the onset of a very long winter
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

My take is that the climate has always changed, ever since the world started.

We're bound to be affecting it, but I'm not sure by how much - I think 'a tiny amount' might be about right.

Big problem is that there is 'science' on both sides but only the "man-made global warming" side seems to get much media coverage, with anyone who disagrees being labelled a "climate change denialist".

Might be more constructive to look at how we can best get through an inevitable climate change than to spend so much time trying to prove that man is/isn't causing it.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

I think the person who came up with the term "Climate change denialist" works for government in the taxation department.

I don't see how CO2 emmisions can carry on as they are anyway, oil will run out soon, and the cycle will reverse.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

I recommend that you read the wikipedia page on the subject (search for Global warming). Much more enlightening than ten Jeremy Clarksons, George Bushes or the Daily Mail.

Remember, it's lazy just to jump to the conclusion that best fits your own self-interest, and it rarely leads to the correct conclusion. You need to question such beliefs more strongly than those which have neutral consequences to oneself.

Does that make sense? I am not very lucid today!
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

The "climate change is natural" response has been around for a while now and there is a great weight of evidence against natural cuases this time. Previous climate changes have seldom been global, with effects seen only in localised areas or even reverse effects on the opposite side of the globe. The current trend IS global.

Also, sun-based warming starts at the Equator. The largest and most rapid changes we are seeing at the moment are at the poles; this is consistent with warming caused by the greenhouse effect.

As for the scientific divide - there isn't one. Less than 5% of scientists argue against anthropogenic causes, and many of those who do are in the pay of the oil companies and others with a vested interest.

On the bright side (no pun intended) recent trends show a slight reduction in the rate of warming, but whether we should simply cross our fingers and hope or adopt the precuationary principle, is worth considering.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

The only problem with Wikipedia is that it can be changed by anyone, and the person who wrote the article is probably a strong climate change believer, and not a sceptic like many people.

The government say they would love us to all buy electric cars to cut CO2 emissions. What they then fail to mention is that we would need new power stations so that we can charge them. Unless these are powered by renewable sources then we are not really any further forward, and quite possibly CO2 emissions from the country as a whole would rise.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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The government say they would love us to all buy electric cars to cut CO2 emissions. What they then fail to mention is that we would need new power stations so that we can charge them. Unless these are powered by renewable sources then we are not really any further forward, and quite possibly CO2 emissions from the country as a whole would rise.
I wasn't aware that the Government did say that, but you're right that electric cars are not the answer. I have heard it said that they are more efficient at converting energy to movement but that misses the point; the efficiency is lost when you convert fossil fuel to electricity at the power station. The only real benefit you get from electric cars is lower local pollution levels, but from cradle to grave they are an environmental disaster.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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I wasn't aware that the Government did say that, but you're right that electric cars are not the answer. I have heard it said that they are more efficient at converting energy to movement but that misses the point; the efficiency is lost when you convert fossil fuel to electricity at the power station. The only real benefit you get from electric cars is lower local pollution levels, but from cradle to grave they are an environmental disaster.
Yup, that's fairly well documented, all those batteries to dispose of in a eco friendly way. I wonder why the government doesn't put more into advertising sustainable transport. Sustrans have been opening up a lot of the old branch lines as cycleways as part of the national cycle network.

It's something I've been thinking of looking into as an alternative to driving to work on nice days. There's a canal at the bottom of my road and a canal runs about qtr of a mile away from where I work, they have to meet up somewhere but i'll be buggered if I have to cycle to leeds then back out to huddersfield (there's a big hill in the way and I dont do hills), it's be something like a 80 mile round trip to work each day

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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

Climate change is occuring, that's undeniable.
It's also increased hugely since the industrial expanse of the last hundred years, that too is undeniable.
It is just possible that humans are having little or no effect on this, and it's largely natural, BUT statistics, whether you like it or not, do suggest otherwise.

I believe that if there is even a 1% chance that climate change can be slowed or stopped, then it is our responsibility to do everything we can to do just that, sitting back and saying 'we can't do anything' is massively irresponsible given the stakes concerned.

We're not the only race that lives on the planet, and it's hugely arrogant to think that we have the right to sit back and do nothing if there is even a minute chance to help.
 
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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As for the scientific divide - there isn't one. Less than 5% of scientists argue against anthropogenic causes
I'm sure you know far more about the subject than I do, but 95% vs 5% sounds very much like a divide.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

In the past, I found this site : http://www.climate-skeptic.com/skept...ies/index.html a slightly interesting read. I'm not claiming that any or all of it is true (the domain name itself makes me doubt it) but still. I've not watched any of the videos on it, just read from 'Chapter 1...' onwards.

Like I say, I'm not making any claims about it's accuracy - all I'm saying is that it's an interesting counterpoint to the story we're always told. I don't take everything it says as gospel, any more than I take the BBC's man-made global warming evangelism as gospel.

As with everything, I expect the truth is somewhere in the middle.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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The only problem with Wikipedia is that it can be changed by anyone, and the person who wrote the article is probably a strong climate change believer, and not a sceptic like many people.
I think wikipedia is BRILLIANT!!! Sure at any one time it can be hijacked, but in the end the facts always win.

If you really want a counter-argument, and it isn't posted on wikipedia already, it probably isn't plausible.

If you really want to deny the evidence posted there (and Fraser is right, that in academic circles there is a very broad concensus), then you are going to have to do some original research of your own.

We have been sleepwalking the planet into disaster, but it is reassuring to know that the reasoned arguments are winning, against the powerful vested interests, at last.
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

This all reminds me of a recording of street corner interviews I did for British Gas in 1977. They thought that natural gas would last for 15 years.
The question was "What will you do when we run out of gas?"
About 90% said "Change to oil."
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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

Are we unable to comprehend the possibilty that, as in any democratic decision, the majority may be wrong

Or are you so hooked in to the infalibilty of scientists that you just can't allow yourselves to believe that is possible

So by saying that scientists virtually all agree (if that is true) you simply fall into the Lemming category. And now we find out that Lemmings don't actually commit suicide even though the majority of scientists believed they did



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Re: Do you believe in climate change?

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Are we unable to comprehend the possibilty that, as in any democratic decision, the majority may be wrong

Or are you so hooked in to the infalibilty of scientists that you just can't allow yourselves to believe that is possible

So by saying that scientists virtually all agree (if that is true) you simply fall into the Lemming category. And now we find out that Lemmings don't actually commit suicide even though the majority of scientists believed they did

Are we unable to comprehence the possibility that we have looked into the research over many decades, and found the evidence to be so overwhelming that it is highly unlikely to be false?

Just because you agree with the majority on an issue doesn't make you a Lemming, as long as you are with the majority because you have looked into the research yourself.

And I stand by my earlier point, the stakes are so high, that to stand around doing nothing while we um and ah about who's to blame borders on the criminal.

We've reached a point where doing nothing isn't an option. If we work hard and find it was non essential, the situation slows naturally then that's fine. If we work hard and start to reverse the trend directly, then that's great. If we work hard and find we can't do anything to halt the change, then that's fine too, because at least we didn't sit on our backsides watching it happen without a fight.

I'm not a big fan of backside sitters
 
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