Is undertaking on motorways a sin? - Alfa Romeo Forum
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View Poll Results: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?
YES!....I'd rather follow a Kia Pride for 50 miles..... 11 15.28%
NO...Just do it.....carefully mind! 54 75.00%
OTHER...Convincing views from the liberals please? 7 9.72%
Voters: 72. You may not vote on this poll

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Bert Cheese
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Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

The idiots who sit in a 65 mph queue in the outside lane while the two inner lanes remain empty............

Do you pass them on the inside?.......I do and they flash their little headlights as they fall in behind me.....so grateful to have been woken from their trance

What are folks views on this emotive subject?........the fact its "against the law" aside.
 
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

It's not right and I know I shouldn't do it, but I'm afraid I do

I've tried sitting patiently behind people and I know you're not supposed to intimidate other drivers, but I do flash them to pull over, and if that doesn't work, I will go up on their inside. It just drives me mad when you've got a dual carraigeway and they sit in the outside lane doing 60 with no hope of catching the car on the inside...or even worse, because they want to turn right three roundabouts ahead

BTW it's not actually illegal to go up someones inside if the lane you are in is moving faster so long as it's not an undertaking move. So if your on the motorway and it's doing that thing where the inside lane is moving the fastest, then it's okay if you are travelling faster than the lane outside you....and I got that from a traffic cop!

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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Yep..there are times when you have to do that...the way I look at it if they flash their lights it keeps them amused

I read on another forum (shock horror he's a member of a non alfa board, just spreading the good word don't ya know) where this bloke came up behind a car doing about 60, he flashed his lights to get the driver to move over, the guy in front gave him the old jam on the breaks routine, and so he under took him...just as he did another car came up behind the same bloke. Flashed his lights, and the bloke jammed on the breaks again, only this time it was an un-marked car. On came the blue lights and they pulled him over.
Moral of the story is these people do get caught, not often enough, but they do get caught... Man thelook on his face must have been priceless..
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Well it's okay in the US. And Israel.


And if there is someone sitting in the outside
lane and the middle and inside lanes are clear,
and they won't move over and there is no other traffic
around, then I won't deny that the manoeuvre would
be given some consideration......
(EDIT: By moving into the inside lane and keeping a whole
lane between you and them.)


Last edited by Nev; 07-08-06 at 22:21.
 
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Guilty M'lud....there are two situations when I undertake..

One, as you describe when traffic is running at different speeds and I gently swap lanes...illegal yes, but also makes sense. Wouldn't happen if everyone woke up and used the roads properly.

Secondly...when chief muppet decides they're not moving out of my way and are quite content travelling at 70mph thankyou! I tend to be a little more assertive in my manouvre but maintain a watchful eye as I swiftly undertake them and try to control the reflex arm movement that usually follows. Wouldn't happen if said idiot wasn't so self rightous and learned some courtesy.

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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Here in New Jersey USA, the first thing that the vast majority of drivers do when entering a motorway is make a beeline for the passing/fast lane and simply refuse to move over. Must be in their DNA! Since most of the traffic is creeping along in the passing/fast lanes, the only way to get anywhere is to drive in the lane that has virtually no traffic.
For me, undertaking is a way of life!
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

I drive in which ever lane has a gap. I generally spend most of my freeway driving in the left hand lane undertaking everyone as its the fastest lane because everyone jumps out into the middle lane and clogs up the road. People are too scared of merging traffic and actually driving properly to follow the keep left law. Most of my family included! Well not the side that I learnt to drive from, Grandma still drags young 'ens off at the lights.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

I didn't do a count, but I'm sure I did it at least a dozen times (if not more) on my last trip down the highway (100km) today.

I also hate to admit it, but a fair percentage of those "passes" were essentially two lane passes.

It really ticks me off that I have to drive that way, but a lot of the time the only way to get around the moron sitting in the passing lane is to drop back cross the middle lane, pop into the slow lane, speed up enough to get past the "cautious" driver who is just doing a tick or two under or over the limit (and who wouldn't ever think of driving in the slow lane) in the middle lane, then getting back into the passing lane in front of the boob who wants to lead a parade. I'd love to stick to the slow inside lane, but with all the on and off ramps and the transport trucks using the lane as they are supposed to, it is only possible to make so much progress before being forced to head into the "faster" lanes.

I'm another driver who tries to drive the gaps. The fewer people around me on the highway, the happier I am, as I don't trust other drivers. (Actually I trust them to be unaware of their surroundings and to pull lane changes without checking their mirrors or signalling their intentions.) Every move I make is done with plenty of space. I don't cut people off. I signal every lane change, but I know that if I'm ever stopped by the cops, I'll be the one charged with "aggressive" driving.

Of course when there are four lanes of traffic and there are transport trucks across three lanes, it is no wonder that drivers get conditioned to sitting in the outside passing lane and doing as they please.

We really are the most undisciplined, inconsiderate drivers compared with Brits or Europeans. We don't even have the "flash to pass" procedure. If you flash somebody here, you are likely to start an incident of road rage.
--Toronto

Last edited by Toronto Spider; 08-08-06 at 05:32.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Undertaking, middle taking and overtaking all Legal here in the land of OZ

On any multi-lane road, with a speed limit over 80kph (50 mph), it is illegal here in Victoria to sit in any lane other than the inside(left) lane, unless you are overtaking another car.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

I voted 'Other' because I know its wrong, but occasionally do do it.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Spider

We really are the most undisciplined, inconsiderate drivers compared with Brits or Europeans. We don't even have the "flash to pass" procedure. If you flash somebody here, you are likely to start an incident of road rage.
--Toronto
Sounds just likwe the UK, we may have the unofficial flash rule but it's likely to incite road rage here as well To be fair, some people realise and move over, but most get pretty annoyed!

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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

I dunno why the Brits get the a*** when you flash them. I see it on the continent and all it means it that there's a car coming up behind you that would like to get past. Dunno why the Brits are so up-tight about being flashed.

When I had my works Merc' C-class I used to anchor it to the bootlid of the car in front until the driver's nerve crumbled. My theory is if you're going to hit him, you'll have a softer impact from 6" (15cm) off his bumper than from 6 feet, (2m) as the closing speed at impact would be more similar.

I was younger then.. had the reflexes of a gun-fighter. Now, I'm mere "fighter-pilot" so I have to hang back about a foot.
Any more than a foot and some hoon in a Golf diesel will cram his car into the space, dammit! There's some mad f***ers on the M25...



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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

I've voted 'other' too as I have done it before, but to be honest it is a dangerous thing to do and I have seen a motorway smashed caused by it. What we need is better lane discipline.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Depends on the circumstances TBH. There's no excuse on a free-flowing, moderately trafficked motorway (there must be sections somewhere!).

I have to admit that it is hard not to on heavily loaded routes like the M60/M62.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

It probably is a sin but I do it when it becomes necessary. On the M25it is the norm!
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrinx
Sounds just likwe the UK, we may have the unofficial flash rule but it's likely to incite road rage here as well
wrinx
I've given up on flashing people for exactly that reason. Same goes for tailgating; Once they've gone past a couple of gaps where they could have moved over I just undertake them.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

As has been mentioned, it's not an illegal manouvre unless it's a concerted effort to move over and directly undertake.

I do it if the motorway is busy, but not at speed, just enough to creep past. Those vital few seconds you save in the course of your journey won't mean much, really.

I do enjoy cruising on a quiet motorway in lane 1, coming up behind an idiot in lane 2, pulling out behind them, whacking on main beam as I move to lane 3, then moving back across in front of them, though.
You'd be surprised how many people still don't move back over.

Quote:
Lane discipline
238: You should drive in the left-hand lane if the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower moving vehicles it may be safer to remain in the centre or outer lanes until the manoeuvre is completed rather than continually changing lanes. Return to the left-hand lane once you have overtaken all the vehicles or if you are delaying traffic behind you.
Quote:
Overtaking
241: Do not overtake unless you are sure it is safe to do so.
Overtake only on the right
BUT:

Quote:
242: Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.

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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

I tend to, because on the M4 on a Friday morning it's the only way to get anywhere.

I do try and avoid it where possible, because I always feel that undertaking is the sort of thing usually left to BMW drivers. But if I do, I'll pull into the lane to the left of whoever, then try and stay in it as long as I can, so it doesn't LOOK like an undertaking manoeuvre. Not sure I fool anyone.......
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

This forum is ****ing **** tbh

Last edited by robk147; 21-04-11 at 13:00. Reason: This forum is ****ing **** tbh
 
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Well Happy Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Ia'm a Sinner do I repent? no way It's something that you just have to do at times. I do a fair amount of m way driving and have been often put in the position of having to undertake because some idiot won't move over
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 73GTVJim
Depends on the circumstances TBH. There's no excuse on a free-flowing, moderately trafficked motorway (there must be sections somewhere!).

I have to admit that it is hard not to on heavily loaded routes like the M60/M62.
I'm with Jim the M60/62 has to have some of the worst drivers in the country.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

My opinion is that if they are that ignorant about fellow road users, they should be on the bus.
I'll flash and do whatever I need to do -overtake- legally.
I'll sit 2 foot from their rear and indicate right.
I've even beeped.

I then rub it in by overtaking at a moderate speed, and join them in the left-hand lane... as I should.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The highway code
or if you are delaying traffic behind you
Interesting.

I voted yes by mistake. I should have voted no. I hate to do it, but sometimes you have to. It's usually worse at weekends, which these days is when I do most of my driving.
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrinx
Sounds just likwe the UK, we may have the unofficial flash rule but it's likely to incite road rage here as well To be fair, some people realise and move over, but most get pretty annoyed!

wrinx
When I say we don't have the "flash to pass" practice I mean we don't have it at all. Nada. Nyet. Nichts.

Brits may ignore a flash or get mad at the flash, but they should (at least) understand what it means. We have absolutely no culture of "flash to pass." The only way we can indicate our desire to pass is to sit on someobody's back bumper and we all know how well that works.

I should say it is not illegal to undertake in Ontario, but it is not suggested as the best option. Drivers are supposed to stay right to drive and pass on the left, but that requires lane discipline, a concept which is almost as foreign as "flash to pass."

From Sections 148 and 150 of the Ontario Highway Traffic Act.

Quote:
Passing vehicle going in same direction

(8) No person in charge of a vehicle shall pass or attempt to pass another vehicle going in the same direction on a highway unless the roadway,

(a) in front of and to the left of the vehicle to be passed is safely free from approaching traffic; and

(b) to the left of the vehicle passing or attempting to pass is safely free from overtaking traffic. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 148 (8).

Quote:
Passing to right of vehicle

150. (1) The driver of a motor vehicle may overtake and pass to the right of another vehicle only where the movement can be made in safety and,

(a) the vehicle overtaken is making or about to make a left turn or its driver has signalled his or her intention to make a left turn;

(b) is made on a highway with unobstructed pavement of sufficient width for two or more lines of vehicles in each direction; or

(c) is made on a highway designated for the use of one-way traffic only. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 150 (1).
http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/DBLaws/S...08_e.htm#BK213
The official Driver's Handbook (which is used to instruct people studying for their licence) doesn't even address passing on the right. All the instructions are for passing on the left (i.e. turn on left turn signal, etc.)

So it is not a sin, but as I said, traffic cops are on an "aggressive driver" crackdown right now, and part of what they view as an aggressive driver is somebody who passes on the inside and tries to work his/her way out of traffic.
--Toronto
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Re: Is undertaking on motorways a sin?

i voted NO...cos i like it
 
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