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(Post Link) post #1 of 19 Old 18-05-08 Thread Starter
TNM
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Bad MPG

MPG doesnt bother me too much but i was intrested to see what my car was doing to the gallon.

So a few weeks ago i reset the trip meter when I filled up.
Tank was empty again on friday night and i looked at the mileage and made a note.

When I got home i worked out my car has been doing 15.8 miles to the gallon!!

Now it does need a service badly! Bought the car and the woman had told a few white lies about the service history meaning it hasnt been serviced for 4 years. 4 YEARS!!

Any one else getting any that crappy?
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Re: Bad MPG

f....f....f.....fffour years???

Service it NOW! (four year old oil and sparkplugs will be wrecking your economy, The timing belt must be a ticking timebomb too).
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Re: Bad MPG

Yes, my mpg is crappy, never above 20 mpg. But that's because the trip computer is wildly inaccurate. When I actually measured it, I was able to get 29 mpg. So check it yourself without the trip computer to see what it really is.

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Re: Bad MPG

Mine is about 22 mpg, but considering the engine is only a 1.6, I was expecting something better than that... Would a new variator improve the mpg? I'm having my variator changed next Wednesday.
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(Post Link) post #5 of 19 Old 18-05-08 Thread Starter
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Re: Bad MPG

cambelt has been done! I did that two days after getting it.

Service will be done soon when i can get space in the workshop.
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Re: Bad MPG

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Originally Posted by Shoulun View Post
Mine is about 22 mpg, but considering the engine is only a 1.6, I was expecting something better than that... Would a new variator improve the mpg? I'm having my variator changed next Wednesday.
not really. your mpg is probably about right, tbh you would get much better economy out of 2.0, the 156 is a heavy car for a 1.6.
Or you could just buy a 3.2 and get similar economy.
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Re: Bad MPG

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Originally Posted by Shoulun View Post
Mine is about 22 mpg, but considering the engine is only a 1.6, I was expecting something better than that... Would a new variator improve the mpg? I'm having my variator changed next Wednesday.
if your variator is so bad that you have lost the VVT then yes, replacing it would make a difference to your MPG.
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Re: Bad MPG

My 166 will do about 25mpg on a run, but normally it's about 20.

I'm buying a Fiesta to run daily and will use the 166 on special days!!
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Re: Bad MPG

When the airflow meter on a V6 goes, it reduces power but does it also impact fuel economy?
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Re: Bad MPG

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Originally Posted by gtachris View Post
not really. your mpg is probably about right, tbh you would get much better economy out of 2.0, the 156 is a heavy car for a 1.6.
Or you could just buy a 3.2 and get similar economy.
hmmmmm....I've just got mine about a month ago, so...can't upgrade to a 2.0 shortly and I know the 2 litre engine has much more fun than the 1.6 this one is my first Alfa I was trying to play safe....but I'm looking at changing to a GT at some point in the future

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Originally Posted by ransoman View Post
if your variator is so bad that you have lost the VVT then yes, replacing it would make a difference to your MPG.
I'm still quite a newbie Afla driver, what's VVT? But I don't think my variator is in a bad bad condition. It is now just making that diesel noise on start-up, the car drives OK, I think



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Re: Bad MPG

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Originally Posted by Shoulun View Post
I'm still quite a newbie Afla driver, what's VVT?
VVT is a common abbreviation for Variable Valve Timing. It's not a unique Alfa term or anything. The variator varies the valve timing on the intake camshaft of the 16V Twin Spark motor, based on engine revs. When it starts to goof up and not do its job at the correct revs, it causes that rattling noise.

For every possible combination of engine speed, load and desired application, there is an ideal timing for the intake and exhaust valves to open and shut, and even an ideal amount by which they should open. Old engines like mine have fixed valve timing and opening, and that's obviously a compromise. The Twin Spark's variator is a slight improvement over fixed timing - it adjusts only the timing and only of the intake valves. Other manufacturers have more sophisticated systems that will vary both intake and exhaust valve timing in a more ideal manner, meaning their engines can do a better job of a better range of tasks. Some can also vary the valve lift.
Remember old V8 hotrods with 'lumpy' cams, which would struggle to idle but go nuts once the revs built up? That's partly a result of choosing a fixed valve timing and valve lift which are both optimised for maximum power at high revs. Those settings were a poor compromise for idling and fuel economy. These days you can have both (sort of), unless your variator's busted!

Someone correct all the mistakes in my rubbish technical explanation.

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Originally Posted by 73GTVJim
"PS and you agree with Ben so you must be wrong "

Last edited by Ben_NZ; 19-05-08 at 08:29.
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Re: Bad MPG

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Originally Posted by Shoulun View Post
I'm still quite a newbie Afla driver, what's VVT? But I don't think my variator is in a bad bad condition. It is now just making that diesel noise on start-up, the car drives OK, I think
The noise indicates it is on it's way out. Pop the bonnet and listend and if the engine sounds rough all the time then it is a good indication that it has totally gone.

While driving in 2nd, floor the throttle, when the revs reach 3000 - 3500rpm you should notice a sudden change in power delivery. if you don't feel it then you have lost VVT. it also effects fuel consumption.

When i had my punto HGT, when the variator finally lost the will to live, the engine would stall while it was makeing the diesel noise at start up. MPG was consistantly at 25mpg and at 70mph it seemed unwilling to go faster. when it was replaced the MPG jumped to 28mpg, all running problems disapeared, it kicked at 3.5k rpm and at 70 it screamed to over 100mph easily.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben_NZ View Post
Someone correct all the mistakes in my rubbish technical explanation.
Pretty much spot on i think.

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Re: Bad MPG

I also found that when the cam variator was totally knackered it would rattle slightly all of the time, not just when the engine was started up.

You will loose midrange grunt withouth the variator, although the top enfd probably won't be affected much.

As Ransoman said, the car should pick up noticeably at 3-3500 rpm and rev freely to the red line.

The TS and especially the V6 are not very economical. I actually get better MPG from my Fiat Coupe 20VT than I did my 156 with the 2 litre TS in general driving.
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Re: Bad MPG

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtachris View Post
not really. your mpg is probably about right, tbh you would get much better economy out of 2.0, the 156 is a heavy car for a 1.6.
Or you could just buy a 3.2 and get similar economy.
WHAT!!! 22mpg from a 1.6TS is APPALLING! I used to get nearly 30mpg from the 2L TS GTV with 17" wheels, and it's a heavier car than the 156 AND I didn't hang about! You ought to be getting AT LEAST 35mpg I'd think.
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Re: Bad MPG

Thanks very much to Ben_NZ and ransoman, both are VERY GOOD explainations!
I still can feel the power change @ 3500 rpm, so, I guess my variator is not totally knackered yet, but I'm having it changed anyway (along with the cam belt).


To rabw: wow...er.....35mpg, it's quite a challenge for me now, I'll be really happy if mine can reach that figure one day...I'll have to find out how to make it though. Any tips?

Last edited by Shoulun; 19-05-08 at 20:24.
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Re: Bad MPG

Just give up.

Stop counting.

I have. I do mostly city driving, and struggle to break 18 mpg. I've had it checked, everything is perfect, emissions fine, lambda sensor fine, variator working perfectly. You just can't have a twinny and be worried about mpg, they are just not compatible !
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Re: Bad MPG

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Originally Posted by Cibo View Post
Just give up.

Stop counting.

I have. I do mostly city driving, and struggle to break 18 mpg. I've had it checked, everything is perfect, emissions fine, lambda sensor fine, variator working perfectly. You just can't have a twinny and be worried about mpg, they are just not compatible !
18mpg on a twin spark 2.0?? Mine used to get 25-27 in London and 30 on the motorway (not driving slow either)! Sounds like something's not right, unless yours is actually a V6?
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Re: Bad MPG

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Originally Posted by Commanderfish View Post
18mpg on a twin spark 2.0?? Mine used to get 25-27 in London and 30 on the motorway (not driving slow either)! Sounds like something's not right, unless yours is actually a V6?
Agree, I always (and still do) consider the Tspark to be fairly economical. Compared to other similarly sized/performing engines it certainly isn't outrageously bad! When the GTV TS has the 16" Teardrops on it'd be anywhere between 380 and 420 miles/tank. 17"s lost me around 50miles/tank.
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Re: Bad MPG

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Originally Posted by rabw View Post
Agree, I always (and still do) consider the Tspark to be fairly economical. Compared to other similarly sized/performing engines it certainly isn't outrageously bad! When the GTV TS has the 16" Teardrops on it'd be anywhere between 380 and 420 miles/tank. 17"s lost me around 50miles/tank.
Mines about the same, quite happy with this as I wasn't expecting it to be so good considering that my right foot is a lot heavier than t'other one !
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