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VO2Max
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May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Hi all,

I'm thinking of buying a 156 2.4 JTDm. There seem to be some nice examples with low mileage going for under £10,000! 175bhp with plenty of grunt will see me right I'm sure, and the economy should be better than the 29mpg of my 2.0 Selespeed, even bearing in mind the apparent 10% price premium that diesel seems to be getting at the pumps! I'll miss the sound and revviness of the Twinspark but I'm led to believe the growl of the 2.4 and the push in the back is worth a move to the dark side - a test drive will decide me one way or the other.

Anyway, onto the reason(s) for my post, possible extras that may come with the car which I don't currently have:

The Alfa Satnav, with or without phone connectivity - is it worth it? Does it work well? Do I have to pay a yearly charge or anything and how do I go about getting the latest maps for the thing? Will the handsfree thing work with any phone and how does it link with the phone? I don't need 2 SIM cards or summat, do I? And do you sometimes get one without the other, or do the phone and Satnav always come as a pair?

Also, if the car comes with a Bose stereo, can I connect my ipod to it? How? Will I have steering wheel functionality of FF/REW and Skip? I currently have a funky Alpine XDA-001 head unit which controls my ipod fully and I love it - could I actually fit this in the dash and 'plumb it in' to the Bose system via the phono line outputs?

So many questions, help!
 
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VO2Max
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

*Bump*

...any ideas folks?
 
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Hey Max - not seen you on here in a while. There's some nice Ti spec models about for under £10k, these look the business!

I'd say the first thing you need to go is go for a test drive in one, to see if its for you, before you start worrying about sat nav and Bose connectivity etc. These all come second to whether or not you fit comfortably in the seats etc.

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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Hi Pud,

I know, been busy managing our new Cycling Team, Sport Beans - Wilier, it's taken up all my spare time outside of work! I've popped in for 5 mins here and there but not really had time to post.

I know what you mean about a test drive, but I'm sure I want another 156 so the issues I'm concerned with will still apply, whatever the model/engine type. I want to find out as much as possible and to be in the position that if I find a car I like and go to see it, I'll know how much any extra kit it has will be of any use to me. I want to be able to use my ipod for example, so if it has a Bose system and it won't work with it, I'll discount a car with Bose. Likewise the Satnav, I'll only get a car with the Alfa Satnav if it will work well and have up to date maps. And the phone kit, I'll only want it if it'll work well with my phone. Forewarned is forearmed!

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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Don't do it.

Diesel is satan's fuel.




 
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Sorry Max, for some reason I thought you had a 147 Sele not a 156 Sele..

I would try and get one without these extra's, as you pay a lot more for them and really you can get better stuff aftermarket. For example the Bose kit, its good, but you can get better from your local ICE store for less cash. And the sat nav will never be as good as a TomTom or Garmin etc
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Nev, you're right, but for the money, it will kick petrol's arse and still save me money .

Pud, I'm not really particularly after the Bose or the Satnav etc, I'd rather have a lower mileage car for the same money for example. But 2.4 JTDm saloons aren't all that common, it may be that the one I want (colour, mileage, price etc) happens to have extra bells and whistles. I want to know that the bells and whistles will be of use, not have me wanting to rip them out and start again.
 
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

I bought mine from Black and White garage about two weeks ago. They had about 5-6 examples to choose from at that price. I chose Silver and Red leather...

They fitted an alfa Ipod connector that runs through the standard stereo as a multichanger. It's a little confusing to use as in trying to work out what it'll play next but then I haven't read the instructions yet.

Currently I'm liking it. A lot :-)
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Thanks Dr S, yes, I've had a similar lead before, there should be functionality of track skipping, FF/RW etc (inc. from the steering wheel too) but there wouldn't be any recharging of the ipod, is that correct?

Also, is there any visible information of what track/artist is playing?

To be honest, if there's a standard stereo in the car, I'd probably replace it with my Alpine XDA-001.
 
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Hi Max,
if it's the same as my GT, the sat nav is ok, but not worth getting one just because it's there, but it does look good in the dash, but it's not a deal breaker. updates from navteq are about £90 for UK. The phones are not bluetooth so you would need dual sim cards, or take it out of your phone & put it in the dash every time you get in & out
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

The 156 175bhp JTDm is a brilliant performance option and the engine sounds good (better than the current 2.4). The engine also feels more "cammy" than the current model and therefore more immediate (don't think it is any faster but it feels more responsive). It also has significantly better fuel consumption (regularly low forties; 50 mpg on a cruise). The big downside is the poor brakes and chassis set up (the 159 easily whups the 156's ass in these areas) and I would recommend you get these upgraded if at all possible.

Dunno about the satnav.

The Dension kit is the best way to fit the ipod to the stereo IMO.
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Thanks Brickman and Fraser.

Sounds like the phone connection thingy is a bit pants then really?

Indeed, I tend to have Ferodo DS Perf brakes, I find they work well. I also currently have a Rhoddy Harvey Bailey handling kit on my Selespeed and that's good. Is even the 156 2.4 JTDm Ti not all that good in the handling stakes then?
 
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Good advice from Fraser.

Max - the JTD won't handle as well as your Sele, but that is purely down to the bigger mass over the front wheels. Unfortunately its not Q2 compatible either. If you like good handling, you'd need to buy some replacement springs and shocks. I'd recommend Eibach Pro Kit Springs (10mm drop vs a Ti) and Koni FSD dampers. I've driven a 2.5 V6 with this set up and it is phenomenal.

As for brakes, if you want to go through the windscreen budget for £900 ish. I tried to sort a group buy out a few months ago but no-one was interested. The discount would have been 20% off that. Thats for 8-pot calipers with 330mm discs and Ferodo DS2500s at the front, all fixings and mountings, and braided stainless steel hoses.

Here's an example:

D2 8 Piston Brake kit Front 330mm TOY MR2 SW20 1991-95 on eBay, also Brake Components, Performance Tuning Parts, Car Tuning Styling, Cars, Parts Vehicles (end time 16-May-08 11:39:55 BST)

Should give similar braking power to the Brembo 4-pot 330mm set-up, and unlike the GTA brakes is a direct fit onto the standard 156 uprights

Autolusso Penrith - UK's leading independent Alfa Romeo specialist with branches in Bedfordshire, Cumbria & Dorset

Wizard Exhaust systems available here

Tel: 01768 879 171

Last edited by Pud237; 15-05-08 at 15:27.
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Thanks for the brake info Pud.

Now interestingly, I phoned Autolusso a couple of days ago and the geezer there reckoned that it was possible to fit a Q2 diff to the 2.4 so long as it had the 6-spd box? I'd like to know this for definite because this will have a bearing on whether I choose a 2.4 or the 1.9, which can have the Q2 and be chipped up to 170bhp.
 
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

As far as I know, the Q2 only fits the 2.4 with the 5 speed box, and the 1.9 needs a 6 speed box to take the Q2. The 2.4 6 speed is the Vauxhall F40 gearbox and therefore I'd not expect it to be compatible with the Q2. Unless it can be made to fit in a different way.. Ned knows his stuff, but its an easy mistake to make as to remembering which gearbox it'll fit. The 6-speed in the 156 1.9 is the same gearbox & bellhousing as the 5-speed in the 2.4 and 6-speed in the V6. Its the same box as the 1.9 box in the GT JTDm and GT V6, 147 JTDm and both 147 and 156 GTA's, only the ratio's are different. But it is NOT the same as the one in the 156 2.4 JTDm. But maybe there is also a way of getting the Q2 to fit that gearbox? Afterall, Jamie Porter reckons they can get the Q2 to fit the Brera/159/Spider (for a fair bit more cash) which no-one else says will fit..

However, now you've gotten onto the merits of 1.9 JTDm vs 2.4 JTDm, I would maybe be tempted to say go for the 1.9 if you are a guy who is happy to modify your cars. Q2 is straight forward direct fit, there's less weight over the front end, the car is cheaper to run and cheaper to buy, and its the same engine as the CDTi in modern Vauxhalls, so tuning mods are much easier to come by. In fact there's a fella on here with a 147 1.9 making 270bhp..

You just have to ask yourself if you want big power without much modding, besides the remap, and don't mind spending a few K more in the purchase price, in which case go for the 2.4.. But if you prefer big power and nimble handling, but a don't mind doing a fair bit more work and spending a bit more on the car after you buy it, then I'd go for the 1.9..
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

I don't really want to get into engine mods to be honest - a remap is fine though, and well-tried apparently. I'm not averse to a suspension mod here and there.

Sounds like another call to Autolusso is in order, to double-check what I was told. I don't know if it was Ned I spoke to, but a slip of the tongue is easily of course.
 
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

The 1.9 engine has a shorter power band and is more diesely, if that makes sense. A remapped 1.9 would certainly handle better and be just as quick as the 2.4 - just probably would be as alfa-esque.
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Beware of lowering a 2.4, unless you keep spare sumps in your shed.

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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

I think the feeling of a shorter power-band of the 1.9 is just to do with the mapping rather than an outright characteristic of the engine..
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlfaLincs View Post
Beware of lowering a 2.4, unless you keep spare sumps in your shed.

AlfaLincs
Good point.. But I think the stiffer springs and harder dampers would offer more protection than the standard Veloce/Sportpack set-up, but maybe not quite as much as the standard 4x4 suspension.
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Quote:
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I think the feeling of a shorter power-band of the 1.9 is just to do with the mapping rather than an outright characteristic of the engine..
No, it is real. The engine even hits the limiter earlier.
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Quote:
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No, it is real. The engine even hits the limiter earlier.
Sorry, what I meant was the 1.9 DOES have a shorter power band, but this isn't due to something physical with the engine, but to do with the mapping. I wasn't arguing that the 2.4 doesn't have a wider powerband, only the reasons why.

The limiter is just a programmable value arbitrarily set by Alfa. Not many people would've bought the 2.4 if the 1.9 revved to 5,000 rpm and produced a little bit more power.

Zbrskz on here, with the 270bhp 1.9 has his limiter set at 5,500 I think.. On standard internals may I add The engine is very capable..

If both the 2.4 and 1.9 had similar maps on, I reckon pound for pound the 1.9 would be the more powerful, in terms of bhp/litre or torque/litre..
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

OK - see what you mean.
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

This is interesting stuff chaps: one of my possible considerations was a 1.9JTDm with a Q2 diff and a P-Box chip (or remap). I wonder whether this is the best combination for me? I'd like crisp handling but with plenty of grunt and speed, more than my 2.0 TS petrol. Economy would be a bonus.

I wonder whether it's really the 1.9 I want, rather than the 2.4?
 
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Re: May buy a 156 2.4 JTDm

Having test driven both, the 1.9 in a 159 and the 2.4 in the 156. It'd have to respond very well to mod's to provide any excitement.

When I tried the 159 I was thinking of laying down 17k on a year old model but the test drive just left me completly flat. Tried the 156 2.4 on a whim and was sold after 10miles or so. Still loving it!
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