JTDM Battle: 1.6 Mito or 1.6 Giulietta - need advice buying - Alfa Romeo Forum
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JTDM Battle: 1.6 Mito or 1.6 Giulietta - need advice buying

I decided that my 147 has given up ghost and won't bother fixing it anymore so I am looking at my next Alfa (I still lust em after my love and hate relationship with the 147).

I am doing 100 miles return journey to work everyday and am looking at maximising the MPG because there is a lot of savings made with the littlest of MPG difference due to my commute length.

I'm aware the Mito has 120bhp and the Giulietta has 105bhp but is more practical due to its size and 5 doors. The only reason I am looking at the Mito is because for a small car, 120bhp should be plenty enough... basically its a perfect compromise for performance and economy. I take it both are capable of doing 60+ mpg on a 1 hour drive that's 95% motorway?

Oh, I'm looking at used cars.
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I'm aware the Mito has 120bhp and the Giulietta has 105bhp but is more practical due to its size and 5 doors. The only reason I am looking at the Mito is because for a small car, 120bhp should be plenty enough... basically its a perfect compromise for performance and economy. I take it both are capable of doing 60+ mpg on a 1 hour drive that's 95% motorway?
The Giulietta 1.6 was changed from 105bhp to 120bhp from around late 2015, so depending on budget that might be an option too. In addition there was a Giulietta 2.0 JTDm 140bhp from 2011-2014, which was £30/year tax (less than the earlier 1.6's in the MiTo) and appeared to come close on MPG to the 1.6 in the real-world, so bear that in mind.

Also bear in mind the MiTo 1.6 from 2009 to around 2013 had the General Motors M32 gearbox, which has an appetite for bearings. After 2013 ish it got the same box as the Giulietta I believe. Around the same time the road tax/VED dropped from circa £100 to £30, so I'd look out for one of those ones if I were buying a 1.6 MiTo.
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Also bear in mind the MiTo 1.6 from 2009 to around 2013 had the General Motors M32 gearbox, which has an appetite for bearings. After 2013 ish it got the same box as the Giulietta I believe. Around the same time the road tax/VED dropped from circa £100 to £30, so I'd look out for one of those ones if I were buying a 1.6 MiTo.
Didn't know that :O Does the early 1.3 Mito suffer the same gearbox issues? It's tempting due to the high MPG people seem to be reporting. However, I am apprehensive that it would feel gutless to drive especially coming from a 170bhp 1.9 JTDM engine.

My budget really only allows me to buy pre 2013 cars - so a 2.0 140 JTDM-2 Giulietta seems a bit far from reach unless I buy a high mileage example. But it seems to be the perfect compromise!
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Based on the above, if it was me it would be a Giulietta... especially if you occasionally carry more than one other adult around. On the other hand, the MiTo will be more nippy and fun, I'd imagine, although I'd have to be very convinced that the gearbox is good.

I dunno if the M32 is really that bad, or if it just happens to fail more often than other gearboxes, so gets a bad reputation, but is otherwise a "reliable" box in general overall terms.


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The Giulietta is a better car IMO.

Much better Chassis, better gearbox, better steering, more room inside, 4 doors, and better styling.
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Originally Posted by leepox View Post
Didn't know that :O Does the early 1.3 Mito suffer the same gearbox issues? It's tempting due to the high MPG people seem to be reporting. However, I am apprehensive that it would feel gutless to drive especially coming from a 170bhp 1.9 JTDM engine.

My budget really only allows me to buy pre 2013 cars - so a 2.0 140 JTDM-2 Giulietta seems a bit far from reach unless I buy a high mileage example. But it seems to be the perfect compromise!
As far as I'm aware the early 1.3 MiTo has a different 6 speed box that doesn't have the problems. It's only the 2009 MiTo 1.3 that has the 6 speed box though (the 90bhp version). The gearbox became 5 speed when they upgraded the 90bhp to 95bhp during late 2009 / early 2010. The 85bhp version (which I had for 3 years) and current 95bhp are also 5 speed.

I got the 1.3 JTDm 85bhp after owning a Fiat Stilo 1.9 JTD with 115bhp, and whilst on the move and on the motorway the MiTo felt nippy, it had a massive chunk of lag below 1500rpm and was flat as a fart if you approached an empty roundabout in second and then tried to floor it if something approached. I'd definitely suggest you do an extensive test drive in a 1.3 if you're coming from a 170bhp version of the 1.9. The MPG was never enough on mine to offset the power & flexibility defecit - late 40s to early 50s to the gallon - I got the same in the Stilo 1.9 JTD and get the same in the Giulietta 1.6 JTDm, both of which feel much more responsive and always on-the-boil. If I was buying a MiTo again I'd have a 1.6 JTDm (or maybe a TB petrol).

My 1.6 120 Giulietta feels perfectly quick enough and on a par with the 1.9 Stilo, but you're coming from something with more power than my Stilo and would be looking at the 105bhp Giulietta, so you may feel differently. Given the budget constraints limiting you to the earlier MiTo with the M32 box (which my Dad's experienced on a Vauxhall - 2 sets of bearings by 75k miles), I'd be inclined to hunt down a few Giulietta's to try - both the 1.6 and 2.0. The Giulietta holds on to value better once it's a few years old than previous Alfa's though, so you may have to travel and/or be flexible on colour etc to get one within budget that hasn't done a shed load of miles.
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I got the 1.3 JTDm 85bhp after owning a Fiat Stilo 1.9 JTD with 115bhp, and whilst on the move and on the motorway the MiTo felt nippy, it had a massive chunk of lag below 1500rpm and was flat as a fart if you approached an empty roundabout in second and then tried to floor it if something approached.
Exactly what I felt after my test drive on the 1.3 yesterday. I have to say the MPG is great (Managed to get 68 mpg average) but it is not as grunty as my 147 which I really can't live with (I have points on the license for a good reason). I guess it is the 2.0 140bhp Giulietta for me at the very least, in fact, I am gonna have to say goodbye to my plan of going abroad this summer to afford one in good condition (holidays are overrated anyway, I can go on a road trip to Scotland instead). I also remembered that I told myself last year that I am buying a 4 door vehicle next as in my 10 years of owning cars, they have all been coupes/3-doors. I guess I am getting old now - in fact, I know I will be all over a Giulia shooting brake once it comes out (still hoping) haha!

Thanks for all the advice guys, you've steered me in the right direction
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Last edited by leepox; 29-03-18 at 07:01.
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Exactly what I felt after my test drive on the 1.3 yesterday. I have to say the MPG is great (Managed to get 68 mpg average) but it is not as grunty as my 147 which I really can't live with (I have points on the license for a good reason). I guess it is the 2.0 140bhp Giulietta for me at the very least, in fact, I am gonna have to say goodbye to my plan of going abroad this summer to afford one in good condition (holidays are overrated anyway, I can go on a road trip to Scotland instead). I also remembered that I told myself last year that I am buying a 4 door vehicle next as in my 10 years of owning cars, they have all been coupes/3-doors. I guess I am getting old now - in fact, I know I will be all over a Giulia shooting brake once it comes out (still hoping) haha!

Thanks for all the advice guys, you've steered me in the right direction
I'd imagine that 68mpg would average out quite a bit lower in the 1.3 long-term too, as you do need to floor them a bit in certain situations. You might not find the 1.6 Giulietta too bad - I dunno how the torque on the 105bhp compares to the 120bhp I have, but it'll be a totally different ball game to the 1.3 I can assure you.

You'll probably conclude that it's the 2.0 JTDm for you, but try the 1.6 just in case, as (having looked last night) there are a few available for less than the 2.0s, and the 1.6 was available across all trim levels, some quite nicely specced - I think people saved ££ on the engine and went to town on options instead.
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If you are going to go for a diesel, and make yourself endure the downsides you might as well go for the faster one.

Thats what I did and I an sure I made the right choice. The 2.0 in both 140 and especially 170 is quite rapid in real wolrd use due to the torque, but they will still do 50mpg plus on a run.

You are not going to get much more out of the 1.6, maybe an extra 5mpg or so.
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You're better off getting the right engine even if you need to forego options. Unfortunately the best looking wheels are heavier too and this can affect fuel economy by ten or so percent.
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Symon's point about MPG in the 1.6 is true - I don't reckon it'll be greatly better than a 2.0, particularly the 140 which seemed to be the sweet spot from what I remember on some old MPG threads. The 170 seemed a bit lower on MPG though, & had the higher road tax cost over the 140.

If they'd still made the 140 in the newer G's I'd have had one. I very nearly had the 2.0 150 JTDm (from 2014) but they seem more like the 170 than the 140 for MPG (but are only £20 or £30 to tax) & I decided the 1.6 felt more than quick enough after 3 years of the 1.3 MiTo. The 1.6 doesn't feel like an entry level engine. In fact none of the Giulietta engines are a bad choice, it just depends what suits you.

Given the spec on mine, I wasn't going to turn it down for a marginally quicker 2.0 with less kit. You pays your money though.....
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The 140 has more torque at the lower end of the rev range due to having a smaller turbo.

That might explain the slightly better MPG, as you can potter around at lower speeds.

The 170 does feel slightly flat at just over tickover speeds, but once over around 1200rpm it does fly, and will pull righ to the rev limiter in the first 4 gears.

It really depends how you want to drive.
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Leather seats and a rough little 1.6 diesel?
Doesn't make sense to me.
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Leather seats and a rough little 1.6 diesel?
Doesn't make sense to me.
A rough little 1.6 diesel? At least I know it'll always be the same, which happens to be bags load of torque and 50mpg all day long, unlike a 1.4 MultiAir which might be smooth one day and rough as a badgers arse when the MultiAir unit lets go, whilst delivering 40mpg if you're driving like a nun. If you wanna play that game.....
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The diesels are not "Rough", at least in terms of vibration.

They are just a bit noisy. If you are moving at a reasonable speed or have the radio on you wouldn't be able to tell from a refinement perspective.
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First impressions at start-up; That little shudder can never be overcome, in my opinion, with a diesel. To go from 40mpg to 46mpg? No thanks.
As for all these MA failures, I don't see any on post 2012 cars. And I'm not playing any game. I'm recounting experience. You don't see me commenting on experience of the 1.75tbi. I haven't driven that particular version of the Giulietta. I gather it's good!
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We can easily get 50mpg from our Diesel on a run, more if speeds are kept under 70mph.

From what others have said, as well as the real MPG figures on the Honest john site it would seem that most people get more like 35mpg from the MA

I am not sure the MA is such a huge improvement over the older TB in terms of real world economy and performance.
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I get 40. I got 46 from a 1.6 over a couple of days, enough to judge.
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2.0 140BHP MJet is great for getting your donkey cart up mountain passes.

Can't get away from its agricultural heritage. Especially when fitted under a thin "aluminum hood".


Mine gives 40 too!
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You must be really ragging those Diesels.

I got 15mpg from the works VW Sharan Diesel once.
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No nun-like driving since I collected it last January.

And a lovely smooth petrol engine.

Last edited by cue2; 26-05-18 at 06:22.
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No nun-like driving since I collected it last January.

And a lovely smooth petrol engine.
You seem to be doing unusually well there, I think. As Symon mentioned, mid 30's seems more typical. My 1.6 says the long term average is 46 over 12,000 miles & 13 months, but i've calculated it manually to be 50+ over each tank i've checked.

And then there's the torque. Give me that and the odd tractor impression on start-up over the nagging feeling in the back of my mind that the MultiAir unit's about to throw a hissy fit because some numpty in Alfa's UK dealer network overfilled/underfilled/wrongly specced the oil, or didn't clean the oil strainer, or it just decided it didn't wanna play ball any more. Plus I bought my rough little diesel 11 months old, so didn't pay a premium for the added MPG or engine reliability as I would've if buying new......
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I'm just about managing 45mpg in my 2.0 140, 600 miles per tank.
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Diesels are yesterday.
Looking at the Alfa site I find that the Speciale in 2.0 diesel have a list price £1200 higher than the 1.4 MA and the final payment(value) after 48 months is £500 less. £1700 over 48 months pays for an awful lot of fuel.
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