164 3.0 V6 24v engines - known faults? - Alfa Romeo Forum
You are currently unregistered, register for more features.    
 
Thread Tools
(Post Link) post #1 of 9 Old 06-01-11 Thread Starter
Status: Skint, due to my Italian mistress
AO Member
 
Yendig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: United Kingdom
County: Warwickshire
Posts: 110
164 3.0 V6 24v engines - known faults?

Hi Alfisti

Could anybody out there please let me know what the known weaknesses are on a 164 3.0 24v engine

I'm getting a fully re-built one fitted into my 1985 GTV6 and am keen to know what (cough, cough) issues to expect

Thanks in advance
Yendig is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Status: zzzzzzzz
AO Platinum Member
 
symon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: United Kingdom
County: Oxfordshire
Posts: 37,096
I am pretty sure they are more prone to cambelt issues than the later 24V unit fitted to GTV's, 166's etc so the change interval is shorter.

This is because the waterpump is driven by the cambelt itself, not the auxillary belt as on later engines.

Other than that they are pretty strong as far as I know.
symon is offline  
Status: -
AO Platinum Member
 
David C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: London, England
Posts: 29,976
Cambelt coverage on the rear most cam pulley is far less with the 164 24v than the later GTV/156/166 24v engines.
Because of that the 164 24v is more prone to the cambelt jumping.
Also, I'm sure the cambelt tensioners for the 164 24v are no longer available...
David C is offline  
(Post Link) post #4 of 9 Old 07-01-11 Thread Starter
Status: Skint, due to my Italian mistress
AO Member
 
Yendig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: United Kingdom
County: Warwickshire
Posts: 110
Hi folks

'Cambelt jumping' sounds interesting

Any mods that can be carried out to minimise the risk of this happening Does it usually happen at higher mileages (ie approaching belt-change time), or is it a luck-of-the-draw type of failure?

Cheers

Paul
Yendig is offline  
Status: zzzzzzzz
AO Platinum Member
 
symon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: United Kingdom
County: Oxfordshire
Posts: 37,096
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yendig View Post
Hi folks

'Cambelt jumping' sounds interesting

Any mods that can be carried out to minimise the risk of this happening Does it usually happen at higher mileages (ie approaching belt-change time), or is it a luck-of-the-draw type of failure?

Cheers

Paul
I would guess that changing the cambelt more often would help eliminate the potential belt slip issue.

You might be better off looking at a Later 24v V6 from a GTV or 166
symon is offline  
Status: Remembering why I dislike working on old cars....
AO Silver Member
 
ChrisS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Worcestershire
Posts: 2,712

Member car:

Mercedes C350e

Usual issue with the early 24V slipping cambelt is at cold start, typically when the engine is raced on startup. The belt also drives the oil pump on this engine, so as noted, the wrap around the rear bank exhaust cam is woefully poor so they tend to jump one or two teeth. One tooth fine, it'll just run a bit rough. 2 or more...bent valve time. A good tensioner is critical...and you can't get new ones. If I was using one of those motors now, I'd probably opt for a static tensioner mod personally. Replace the tensioner with a bolt and locknut arrangment. Static tensioners on 12V motors have long been proven to work well - no reason why not on the 24V. Of course, ensure the ilder and tensioner bearings are in good order.

Waterpump is driven by accessory belt as on all Busso V6 engines, pumps are fine as long as they have a metal impeler, but it's always worth swapping it if you are doing the cambelt unless you KNOW it's only done limited duty. FWIW, I took the original pump of my old 155 V6 at 117k miles and it was just starting to get a bit grumbly so wouldn't have lasted much longer.

24V accessory belt idlers are hard/impossible to find as well I think. Not the end of the world, but just a bit more joy.....

Crank damper can delaminate, although it's rare. Keyway can wear as well, again, rare.

Valve guides and seals at big miles of course.

Seen more than one 24V with a shot bottom end. Seems to be something of a Busso weakness, or perhaps just poor servicing???

Typical Alfa thermostat issues of course.

Some parts getting hard to come by.

Probably about it I think....any more anyone??

Given a choice, I too would opt for the latest possible version - 166 or late GTV ideal. Or GTA of course....

That said, as long as the cambelt stays put, nowt wrong with the 164 24V motor.

HTH
ChrisS is offline  
(Post Link) post #7 of 9 Old 08-01-11 Thread Starter
Status: Skint, due to my Italian mistress
AO Member
 
Yendig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: United Kingdom
County: Warwickshire
Posts: 110
Looks like I visited the right site for advice!

I originally wanted a 3.2 GTA engine but was told it would be too fiddly and awkward to convert for rwd use

I believe my engine was previously in a 164 Q4; hopefully, during the re-build, all mods & updates were applied to make it a little more reliable....only time will tell....

Thanks for your all of your help
Yendig is offline  
Status: got his new 3.2
AO Silver Member
 
fetta head's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: United Kingdom
County: West Yorkshire
Posts: 1,226
alfagtv6.com is the website for all your 116 transaxle questions including 24 valve conversions for the gtv6
iwas going to go down this route but opoted for the 75 v6 transplant much simpler just plug in and play
fetta head is offline  
(Post Link) post #9 of 9 Old 11-01-11 Thread Starter
Status: Skint, due to my Italian mistress
AO Member
 
Yendig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: United Kingdom
County: Warwickshire
Posts: 110
Quote:
Originally Posted by fetta head View Post
alfagtv6.com is the website for all your 116 transaxle questions including 24 valve conversions for the gtv6
iwas going to go down this route but opoted for the 75 v6 transplant much simpler just plug in and play

Thanks FH

I've already tried to register with AlfaGTV6.com but have not had my account activation email from them yet (I registered on 6 Jan) How long do they usually take to activate I've had email confirmation of my username and password; only need to be activated now.


UPDATE: as at 6.30pm, I'm now activated & good to go

Last edited by Yendig; 12-01-11 at 00:08.
Yendig is offline  
Reply

Go Back   Alfa Romeo Forum > Supported Alfa Romeo Models > Technical & Vehicle Assistance > Engines (TS, JTS, JTD & V6)

Tags
164 , 24v , engines , faults

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Who's got the highest Mileage 166 on the forum? Stephen Manjai Alfa 164 & 166 578 2 Weeks Ago 18:07
Alfa Romeo Engine Numbers TS,JTS,V6,JTD biffa Engines (TS, JTS, JTD & V6) 35 27-03-17 21:58
Alfas in computer games? K18 NOB General Alfa Discussion 24 03-06-11 20:51
Drove my first Alfa today - Few Questions 2.5 V6 156 Gwedo Alfa 147, 156 & GT 21 13-06-10 22:48

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome