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Fully or semi synthetic?

Ive been running a 147 1.6 ts for a while now, its great, love it. But like most ts's it uses alot of oil. Im running on high quality (high spec) 10w 40 Semi synthetic oil at the minute. My dad runs an Astra with the 2.2 ecotec (same as Alfas 2.2 in the 159's if Im not mistaken?), hes changed from semi synthetic to fully synthetic and his oil consumption has halfed! So, Can the TS engines run on fully synthetic? Would it be worth trying?
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Please do a search there are any number of threads on this.
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Originally Posted by A_Venables View Post
Ive been running a 147 1.6 ts for a while now, its great, love it. But like most ts's it uses alot of oil. Im running on high quality (high spec) 10w 40 Semi synthetic oil at the minute. My dad runs an Astra with the 2.2 ecotec (same as Alfas 2.2 in the 159's if Im not mistaken?), hes changed from semi synthetic to fully synthetic and his oil consumption has halfed! So, Can the TS engines run on fully synthetic? Would it be worth trying?
I bought motul 300v 10w40 fully ester synthetic for my TS, it's regarded as a top oil and is a true synthetic. Guess what, It still consumed oil .

I
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Yes the engine is fine on synthetic, 5w-40 or 10w-40. But it may or may not make a difference to consumption. One thing for sure is you wont know till you try.

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Use the same brand your dad put in his Astra. His wasn't 10W60 was it? That would be a touch thicker.


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Fully synthetic is best!
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Originally Posted by Ralf S. View Post
Use the same brand your dad put in his Astra. His wasn't 10W60 was it? That would be a touch thicker.


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Its the Vauxhall/GM oil, not sure on the number, just know its high spec on the API A3 B3 B4/ACEA SL/CFrating. It is 5w30. As Im in the trade club with my local vauxhall dealer I can get it very cheap. Would this be any good?
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5w-30 is too thin.

A 5w-40 would be perfect though.
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Originally Posted by symon View Post
5w-30 is too thin.

A 5w-40 would be perfect though.
aye, thats what alfa/fiat use now
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Aye! In theory, you would burn more of the 5W30.. It's thinner when it's cold and it's thinner when it's hot.

Whether you use semi or fully synthetic is academic to oil consumption. Your beast wants 5W.. or 10W40 grade and the "only" advantages of synthetic are that it stays in grade longer, acts more consistently when it's old and new.. has ultimately higher protection levels and contains more detergents to clean out the crud, gum and soot that oil has to absorb. It's "better" but that won't stop you burning it.

You can probably get away with 15W40 in the summer and that might help.. as it's a bit thicker than 10W40 when it's cold, so less will disappear to wherever it's disappearing to. You may be losing more oil when the engine is cold as any tolerances between moving parts are greater. When the engine warms up, everything fits more closely so your oil can't nip out.

The only thing with 15W40 is that you need to be a bit more careful when you start the engine up as it's thicker so will take more pumping .. it'll take longer to get to the top of the engine. The difference isn't tooo big but it's worth being aware of if the temperature is particularly low.

How many miles has the beast done? Most 15W40 is sold as "for higher mileage" engines... so you see where they're coming from (high miles = more slop).

But anyway.. my suggestion ... try 15W40 now that warmer weather's coming... but semi-synthetic. It'll be fine for up to 12,000 miles.. and it's not so expensive that it's a shame to bin it when you change the oil back to a 10W40 for next winter.


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True synthetics are less likely to burn off as all of the molecules are the same size. Mineral/semi-synthetics contain a mix of different sized molecules and the smaller ones are likely to eveaporate and ignite fairly easily when the oilis hot.

Also, as semi synthetics are less shear stable etc etc, I wouldn't leave one in a car for 12k. Half that fine, but not more than 10k which is when synthetics should be changed in most cars.
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Lol, 10k?

Loads of manufactueres are doing 20,000 oil change intervals nowadays.

I m trying to stop myself suggesting that you say that cos youre in the business of selling oil, bit like food manufacturers and sell by dates encouraging people to throw out perfectly decent food...too late, didnt manage it! lol
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Originally Posted by typos1 View Post
Lol, 10k?

Loads of manufactueres are doing 20,000 oil change intervals nowadays.

I m trying to stop myself suggesting that you say that cos youre in the business of selling oil, bit like food manufacturers and sell by dates encouraging people to throw out perfectly decent food...too late, didnt manage it! lol
I can see where you're coming from, but have you considered that the manufacturers don't want the cars to last too long? We're finding that more and more people are noticing problems with their Audis/BMWs etc etc that are on the long life schedules and are either reverting to annual/10K changes or doing an oil change between services at the dealers. Manufacturers want a degree of wear to occur, otherwise you're not going to come back for a new car, but they don't want too much as then the brand looks poorly made.
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Manufacturers want to try and minimise the running cost of cars and make them more attractive to buyers on a cost basis. This, I think, is an incentive for them to extend service intervals..

Plus, in some countries (such as the US) the dealers offer deals such as free servicing on new cars, which works out much cheaper for them if the servicing intervals are extended.

And anyway how would the filter cope with having to survive 20k miles, even if the oil could?
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The filters should last 20k, due to needing to meet the OEM specs, but they will be on their last legs by the time the service comes around.

I forgot to mention the bit about making the cars look financially more appealing earlier, but that is a large part of it.
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Also Manufacturers recommend longer service intervals because it makes the cars more appealing to fleets and other company users.

Less time being serviced = less time off the road, and also less money for servicing.


Alfa's 12k interval is far too long. No wonder so many 156's suffer worn cams and other oil related issues.

My last 156 had been serviced according to Alfa scedules using 20k

There was lots of carbon/varnish type deposit everywhere in the cam area. It took me ages to remove it.
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I see your point Oilman, but they usually spend time modifying the engines and spec of the oil to cope with increased srvice intervals-I mean they dont just change the numbers, they usually carry out some mods and test them first.
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True, tests do happen.

With longlife servicing it also depends on how the car is used... If your a rep doing 20,000 odd miles or more a year then longlife oils are fine as you are still going to get a service every year, and oil likes easy motorway use. Oil doesnt like taking the kids to school every morining or a small commute to work day after day and that is when fixed servicing, decent synthetic and changed every 10,000 or once a year, what ever comes first is a better route.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by alid1 View Post
I bought motul 300v 10w40 fully ester synthetic for my TS, it's regarded as a top oil and is a true synthetic. Guess what, It still consumed oil .

I
I used 300V 10W-40 and also Silkolene pro-s 10W50, both considered as top ester PAO oils and the oil consumption was about double of my usual (much cheaper) Castrol 10W-60. I think this is the right viscosity for my engine so I stopped experimenting.
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I used 300V 10W-40 and also Silkolene pro-s 10W50, both considered as top ester PAO oils and the oil consumption was about double of my usual (much cheaper) Castrol 10W-60. I think this is the right viscosity for my engine so I stopped experimenting.
I found the local ASDA brand 10w40 semi-synthetic worked wonders in comparison to the motul. Personally i would not use a expensive Pure synthetic in the Alfa twinspark's because they are known to use oil and the oil ain't cheap

I got a diesel now and was thinking of using the Millers XFD 5W40
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Oil change before last I used 5w/40 and it gobbled it up! I used the recommended 10w/40 on the last change, the difference is incredible!
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i use 5w 40 in my 1.6 147 and it seems fine in mine doesn't it also depend on how hard you drive the car?
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Quote:
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i use 5w 40 in my 1.6 147 and it seems fine in mine doesn't it also depend on how hard you drive the car?
It does. It also depends on the oil, as some makes burn faster than others.
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Quote:
I bought motul 300v 10w40 fully ester synthetic for my TS, it's regarded as a top oil and is a true synthetic. Guess what, It still consumed oil .
I changed from semi 15W/50 Motul to full 300V and I'm burning much more oil just after 1000kms. Does it need a break in to clear out the old sludge? I heard this on other forums.

No smoke and AFR is good, I have a lambda and gauge.

I just topped it up after 1000kms. I do drive pretty hard though in my 33 8v carb.
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I'm currently running 5w40 in the Spider TS and it's fine - no oil consumption to speak of and the oil is retaining its light colour longer than the previous 10w40.

I agree with everyone regarding service intervals. 12k is too long for Alfa engines, I've alwys changed the oil/filter every 6k and will continue to do so with the 5w40.
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