156 ts wont start, help please - Alfa Romeo Forum
You are currently unregistered, register for more features.    
Reply
 
Thread Tools
(Post Link) post #1 of 43 Old 22-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

156 ts wont start, help please

i have just got a 156 2.0 ts, i bought it as a non runner for very little money

the seller told me that it runs but had a knocking from the crankshaft bearings
after getting the car home and trying to jumpstart it turns over but does not start, it had an aftermarket immobiliser/alarm fitted which i have removed, checked the fuel cut off switch, checked it has fuel, the code light goes out so no problem there, engine management light goes out...

my next things i will be trying are compression test, check for a spark from the plugs, check maf (and of course removing the sump to check the damage)

does anyone have any suggestions?

also, would damaged crankshaft bearings be noisy on turnover? as it sounds normal when turning it over?
pcbuild2k is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Status: 6 YEARS LYMPHOMA FREE!! :)
AO Silver Member
 
ronan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Belfast
County: Down
Posts: 4,998

Member car:

156 1.8 Turismo

...what about the crankshaft sensor ?
ronan is offline  
Status: faclifting a 156
AO Silver Member
 
biffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Lancashire
Posts: 3,199
Try charging the battery fully...
biffa is offline  
(Post Link) post #4 of 43 Old 23-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronan View Post
...what about the crankshaft sensor ?
how can i check the crankshaft sensor? if this is at fault will unplugging it work or do i need to replace it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by biffa View Post
Try charging the battery fully...
will have a try of that one, the battery is on charge at the moment

thanks for the input guys, much appreciated
pcbuild2k is offline  
Status: faclifting a 156
AO Silver Member
 
biffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Lancashire
Posts: 3,199
If the Crank sensor is knackered you will need to replace it, how fast does it turn over?
biffa is offline  
(Post Link) post #6 of 43 Old 23-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

when turning over it sounds just like it should, its not turning slowly and no strange noises

is there any way of testing the crank sensor? multimeter etc..
pcbuild2k is offline  
Status: faclifting a 156
AO Silver Member
 
biffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Lancashire
Posts: 3,199
its an inductive sensor you could check to see if its opencircuit...

Are you looking at rebuilding the engine?
biffa is offline  
(Post Link) post #8 of 43 Old 23-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

i am undecided yet, i may rebuild or replace the engine or i may break it for parts, i wanted to get the engine running before i decide as if the engine is basicaly good other than the crankshaft bearings i will most likely rebuild it, but if there are other issues i may replace the engine or break it
pcbuild2k is offline  
(Post Link) post #9 of 43 Old 23-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

i would prefer to get it running and rebuild the engine though, would be much nicer to get it back on the road
pcbuild2k is offline  
Status: faclifting a 156
AO Silver Member
 
biffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Lancashire
Posts: 3,199
Its a good feeling to rebuild it yourself and cheaper than an unknown secondhand unit (if your doing it all yourself)...

i have a knackered crank sensor in the house which only failed when it heated up.
Does the EML go out when you crank it? Do you have Alfadiag if not its a worth while investment...
biffa is offline  
(Post Link) post #11 of 43 Old 23-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

if i am going to rebuild i will be having a go at it myself, like you said its a satisfying feeling completing a job like this, the engine management light does go out, i dont have alfadiag (or a cable) its somthing i will probably invest in (have been meaning to do so for quite a few years)
pcbuild2k is offline  
Status: faclifting a 156
AO Silver Member
 
biffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Lancashire
Posts: 3,199
if the EML light goes out i dont think it the Crank sensor but i'm not sure... have you checked for spark and fuel?
biffa is offline  
(Post Link) post #13 of 43 Old 23-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

not checked for spark and fuel yet, but there was a smell of fuel after turning it over for a few mins so im guessing the fuel is coming through

do you know if i can check for a spark off the second set of plugs (do they spark on turnover?) just makes it a bit easyer to test (coil packs can stay in)

Last edited by pcbuild2k; 23-01-10 at 21:24.
pcbuild2k is offline  
(Post Link) post #14 of 43 Old 25-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

well.....
fully charged battery, compression of 12 bar on all four cylinders and fuel definately getting to the engine still nothing....

tryed with and without maf connected

havent managed to check for a spark on the plugs, i have some testers but you cant actualy see them once they are on the plugs and the coil packs are ontop of them

should i get a spark if i remove a coil pack from its rail and earth the plug somewhere on the car or does the coil pack need to be earthed in its rail to give a spark?
pcbuild2k is offline  
(Post Link) post #15 of 43 Old 25-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

managed to check for a spark

its sparking ok

anymore ideas guys?
pcbuild2k is offline  
(Post Link) post #16 of 43 Old 25-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

tomorrow i will try to bump start it, see if that gives any success, im getting stuck for ideas as to why it wont start
pcbuild2k is offline  
(Post Link) post #17 of 43 Old 25-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

so far......

plugs sparking
fuel getting to engine
turns over ok
fully charged battery
all cylinders hold 12 bar on compression test
code light goes out
engine management light goes out
tryed with and without maf connected

not having much success getting it to start

does anyone know if the engine would knock on turnover with a knackered bottom end? as it sound perfect on turnover, just wondering if it was wrongly diagnosed with bottom end failiure??
pcbuild2k is offline  
Status: 6 YEARS LYMPHOMA FREE!! :)
AO Silver Member
 
ronan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Belfast
County: Down
Posts: 4,998

Member car:

156 1.8 Turismo

What about that crankshaft sensor ?
ronan is offline  
(Post Link) post #19 of 43 Old 25-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronan View Post
What about that crankshaft sensor ?
if the crankshaft sensor is faulty will the engine start if i disconnect it?
pcbuild2k is offline  
Status: 6 YEARS LYMPHOMA FREE!! :)
AO Silver Member
 
ronan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Belfast
County: Down
Posts: 4,998

Member car:

156 1.8 Turismo

Doubt it, but I'm sure others will know......chaps ??

I had same problem and a new sensor solved it.
ronan is offline  
0of0
Status: - Update
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I assume all is OK with the cambelt & therefore the timing?
 
Status: Looking for a V6 again
AO Member
 
TOPKIT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 491
I am not sure, i had this problem with a TS GTV last year a friend was helping me sort an idle issue out and he swapped a couple of wires over somewhere and then swapped them back again and then the car would turn over etc but not start i ended up checking some relays in the engine bay (up by the bulkhead) I gradually swapped them one by one and tried to start the car after each one, i can't remember which particular one it was but the car suddenly started and was fine after that, So if you have any realays up by the bulkhead on a gtv they are on tha passenger side and there are about 6 to check, a 156 can't be that different, its worth a look.
TOPKIT is offline  
(Post Link) post #23 of 43 Old 26-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

Quote:
Originally Posted by 0of0 View Post
I assume all is OK with the cambelt & therefore the timing?
as far as i can tell, the cambelt looks to be in good condition, no splits etc. so i am assuming the timing is ok
pcbuild2k is offline  
(Post Link) post #24 of 43 Old 26-01-10 Thread Starter
Status: No more GTA
AO Silver Member
 
pcbuild2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Cheshire
Posts: 1,496

Member car:

156 JTS

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronan View Post
Doubt it, but I'm sure others will know......chaps ??

I had same problem and a new sensor solved it.
where is the sensor (used to working on the v6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TOPKIT View Post
I am not sure, i had this problem with a TS GTV last year a friend was helping me sort an idle issue out and he swapped a couple of wires over somewhere and then swapped them back again and then the car would turn over etc but not start i ended up checking some relays in the engine bay (up by the bulkhead) I gradually swapped them one by one and tried to start the car after each one, i can't remember which particular one it was but the car suddenly started and was fine after that, So if you have any realays up by the bulkhead on a gtv they are on tha passenger side and there are about 6 to check, a 156 can't be that different, its worth a look.
i have tried pulling and refitting all the fuses and relays i can find (in case of bad or corroded connections) all to no avail
pcbuild2k is offline  
Status: faclifting a 156
AO Silver Member
 
biffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: United Kingdom
County: Lancashire
Posts: 3,199
to be honest it sounds like the crank sensor but its just the AM alarm thats bothered me...

crank sensor location

https://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/engin...ml#post3175913
biffa is offline  
Reply

Go Back   Alfa Romeo Forum > Supported Alfa Romeo Models > Technical & Vehicle Assistance > Engines (TS, JTS, JTD & V6)

Tags
156 , start

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
So how many and where are the GTA's ??? 156GTASW Alfa GTA 608 27-10-11 09:11

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome