The mess that is stop start... - Page 3 - Alfa Romeo Forum
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You don't even need to raise your foot off the brake. Just release enough pressure and it will start up.
yeah thats what i meant, i dont take my foot off completely, just release the pressure a bit.
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I seem to have lost stop start in my 17 plate car, the battery shows 14.6v while running according to Obd.

I don’t miss it, I do very few miles around “towns”, so I haven’t been too concerned.
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I seem to have lost stop start in my 17 plate car, the battery shows 14.6v while running according to Obd.
So you have correct charging, and running at max allowed (when battery is well charged it drops to order of 13.2V as far as I seen) - thats it. S&S works based on many factors, but in terms of battery aside of its measured temperature, in what state it is - MES displays %-age charge condition/charge level according to IBS and estimated voltage during next start (if start would happen at this time). To read these, you need to connect to Body Computer.
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The stop start on my Apr'17 Giulia Super stopped working about 2 weeks ago. I took to the dealer and they loaded an updated version of the software. After driving it for a few kilometres it's become effective and works perfectly again (straight after loading it wasn't and they told me that the car had to be driven at least 30kms first).
Stopped working again….maybe time to get a battery charger? Lucky I always like my Alfas despite some of their faults...it's part of the fun in owning them!!
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Stopped working again….maybe time to get a battery charger? Lucky I always like my Alfas despite some of their faults...it's part of the fun in owning them!!
That's disappointing, I had hoped that the software update you received would have changed things. The flawed logic which disables certain circuits if battery charge is low is yet to be improved it would seem.

The non-availability of STOP/START is of no concern to me as I generally disable it.

Of much greater concern is that the heated rear window can be disabled with low battery charge.

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Stopped working again….maybe time to get a battery charger? Lucky I always like my Alfas despite some of their faults...it's part of the fun in owning them!!
Take it back. I expect they'll replace the battery next. That's what they did with mine and it's still working fine again.
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Stopped working again….maybe time to get a battery charger? Lucky I always like my Alfas despite some of their faults...it's part of the fun in owning them!!
I think the conclusion from this thread is that - if you consistently do short journeys, especially in winter - then you will have to invest in a charger.
CTEK seems to be commonly used, and also is the OEM for the Alfa branded charger (funny how they do one....).
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How soon do I have to get the charger on the Stelvio and look like I'm mocking the neighbour across the road with his Tesla X model?
Well, he bought one to replace the S type Tesla but he's been driving a loan car for a long time now since they took it in for a warranty job on the heater.
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23 months. I drive about 40 miles everyday and haven't needed a charger. I have been measuring voltage at the 12v charging terminal under the arm rest and I have found some odd charging behaviour. Will post my observations on the other thread discussing thread once I make some sense of it.
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I no longer commute 60 miles per day as I retired early. I sometimes do short distances and currently use the heated seats ,if taking my wife to the station for example. I don't reckon 2 years at this rate.
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I think the conclusion from this thread is that - if you consistently do short journeys, especially in winter - then you will have to invest in a charger.
CTEK seems to be commonly used, and also is the OEM for the Alfa branded charger (funny how they do one....).
I discovered that my HRW wasn't working. Reported it to the dealer when it was booked in for its second service at the beginning of December (Dc 2016 Model QV) and they replaced the battery. I've already had the low battery warning light up once since and charged it using my CTEK. Seems to be OK now but time will tell! Only do low miles circa 5,000pa. Still loving the car though...
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I'm putting mine in for the heated screen issue. Driving to work the last week with no heated rear screen or heated mirrors with thick frost is a pain in the arse. They're also looking at a rattle somewhere low down at the rear of the car. I'm guessing the undertrays. Given that it's going in to Uncle Arnold, I may get it back with in the next 3 months...
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bought a Ctek mxs 5.0 the other day, and i popped it on to charge today. i put in on at about 9.30 this morning. i checked it an hour or so later, and it was on stage 4, Absorption, "Declining current", so it was about 80% (assuming ive understood it the charger manual correctly) it was still in stage 4 when i switched it off at about 3:30 this afternoon so its had about 5 hours charge. will see how it goes over the next few days.
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Given that it's going in to Uncle Arnold, I may get it back
There you go, fixed it for you...
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Still no start stop
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Its not really great that in 2019 you need to buy a charger for new cars
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I'd say needing to charge the car questions the thing being fit for purpose. Especially if you park on the street , as I do.
As for feeling the need to do your own OBD plug-ins for a car while its under warranty, that's crazy.
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i agree. It is a bit annoying, and not good enough.

But what else do i do? until alfa provide a fix for it? changing the battery seems to be the only thing they can do.. Shouldnt be anything wrong with it. it was 7 degrees this morning, engine up to temp, warm enough in the car. no reason the start stop shouldnt work, as the battery had some charge yesterday. but it didnt. Didnt need the rear screen on today, so i couldnt test it. Its due a service soon so i'll raise my issues with the car when i book it.

a car battery charger is a useful tool to have, so i dont mind buying it (this is not my only car) but it hasnt made any obvious difference so far.

It hasnt, yet, distracted from the joy of owning the car. Alfa do need to fix these things though if they want me to buy another one in a couple of years.
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Saw someone on Facebook had a new battery under warranty and they've replaced it with an AGM one.
Should be AGM on a car with stop start I'd have thought. Maybe they've (Alfa) seen sense now?
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As some of you may remember, my battery and BCM were replaced due to HRW and SS not working less than 2 months ago. HRW has been working so far as did SS cutting in quickly. However the SS did not work/cut in the whole 30 min journey today. Battery is new so it's not that. The voltage indicated in the 12v plug extension I have under armrest has been showing ~14.4 V last 2 days, normally it sits ~13.2 V when presumably the State of Charge is sufficient. There appears to be a complex logic to the whole charging algorithm which also controls functionality of HRW, SS etc. It seems to charge at 14.4v when battery SOC as calculated by/reported by the IBS is below a threshold (80%??) and if above the set threshold it drops the charging voltage to 13.2V but raises to 14.4V in quick increments to 14.4V under braking which drops back to 13.2 soon as foot is off brake pedal. This behaviour is not observed during engine braking, only foot braking in all DNA modes, irrespective of whether SS is enabled or disabled (my usual setting).

I wonder if SS is disabled when charging at 14.4V meaning the SOC is not high enough for engine to stop and start? However absurd that logic sounds as the car still appears to have enough charge to stop and starting by driver! I will continue to observe and see if SS works when charging at 13.2V.


I read on VARTA site that fitting AGM battery to non AGM would cause issues with BCM logic due to different charging characteristics. So not sure how they replaced with AGM under warranty??

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I think I read somewhere in Giuliaforums that Alfa has switched to AGM batteries for 2019 cars, at least for US models.
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This morning indicated charging voltage was 13.2 gradually rising to 13.8v over a 30 min journey. SS cut in when I stopped at end of journey, so I think there is some truth to SS not working if SOC is lower than a threshold and charging voltage is maxxed out at 14.4V!
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i got official fca doument with how ibs and s&s works. aside of many other conditions eg. related to ac temperature set vs measured difference etc soc must be above 75% soh (health) 60%, battery temperature above -23Cdeg and sof (predicted voltage during next startup ) above 8.2V if i remember correctly. mes does not have 2 separate % parameters and in my observations ss works when mes reports above 67%.

Last edited by epsonix; 26-01-19 at 09:58.
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I have the official Mopar Tech Authority system description for the battery and charging system and am aware of what you have posted @epsonix . It doesnt however clearly describe charging logic and the cut off voktages and charge levels where individual systems are disabled.

On my return journey today, over 20 miles the indicated charging voltage was 14.4v all the way and the SS did NOT cut in even once!! Same journey, outside temp 8degC , cabin air con off, temp set manually to 22 degC with medium fan speed (exactly how I have been driving over last couple of weeks whilst observing voltage).

So looks like the SS will only work if battery SOH/SOC is above the specified threshold which means the alternator will charge at ~13.2 to 13.8V . If the BCM/IBS has determined the battery needs charging at full alternator capacity of ~14.4 to 14.5V then SS will be disabled! The HRW was working both this morning and evening so that is not affected by the charging voltage. It is however affected by the battery SOH/SOC and when it stops working that would mean the battery is well below the 80ish % charge perhaps??

Not complaining about SS not working as I normally leave it off. The observations however could help determine battery conditions.

Perhaps AR should move to AGM battery indeed which are better at SS and charge/discharge.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metalgod23 View Post
.....
On my return journey today, over 20 miles the indicated charging voltage was 14.4v all the way and the SS did NOT cut in even once!! Same journey, outside temp 8degC , cabin air con off, temp set manually to 22 degC with medium fan speed (exactly how I have been driving over last couple of weeks whilst observing voltage).
.....
Of course as mentioned before, auto start/stop is not ONLY determined by battery voltage, but by a great many additional parameters.......
So it could be any one of those is preventing start/stop kicking in
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