Retrofitting a Q2 to an existing Alfa

Great stuff guys.
Hopefully somebody will try it on a monster tuned 2.4 JTD with > 330 lb/ft torque.
I'm interested to see how much torque that it, and the gearbox casing, can stand.

Cheers,
TB

Why a 2.4 with any luck and a bit of dosh there could be a 1.9 floating about with more than that in time once I am confident I can find someone to map a custom setup

So thats definite that it will fit a 147 GTA?

John.

Thats the spirit Sandy

BTW a friends (obviously modified!) 147 GTA was dynoed at a 370 lb/ft before the dyno guys had to give up, even with 4 people sitting on the car it was too much of a handful, so if you could increase your output to similar levels it would be useful for test purposes That much torque is at the limit of the clutch type diffs I know about at the moment.

Checking out the German tuned 1.9 CDTis there are 240bhp/385lbft, so its achievable with the same engine, just a matter of time before I've done it.....or before it explodes

Well, nobody can say that you aren't getting value out of your GT

May as well, good little everyday motor, those lofty figures above are probably a pipedream for a 1.9 diesel thats driveable everyday with little lag, i'll take it up in stages and see how it goes, drives well ATM with 180bhp/265lbs TBH, no balls out racer sure but >40 mpg on average means it costs as much as a 1.2 Punto to run on the daily grind with a bit of poke when I need/want it

Fingers crossed this Q2 diff tidys up the grip issues especially on the wet bumpy b roads and in the bends.

Hi,
I've got a 147 2.0 TS 2002 modell with a another ratio then the Q2.
Ring Gear 46442032 RAPP 58/15 M10 3.8667 ratio.
How much do I have to change in my gearbox to fit the Q2?

Originally Posted by sandys

My JTD is being done Thursday can't wait, good to here it went on the V6 no probs as that means it'll be good for me

Sandys, any news on the fitment of the Q2?

It went in no probs, not driven it yet, I left it at the garage for a coupel of days in case of trouble, picking it up tonight, at some point over the weekend I will post up my thoughts on it after I have had a play.

Sandy, did you get the Q2 dif or the Quaife dif?

went for the Q2, parts plus fitting was the same price as a Quaife unit alone and being a tight arse I thought it'd do me might not be as good as other solutions but bound to be better than nothing

Soon find out if the Q2 reviews and infoo from Alfa are hype or not

If you don't mind me asking Sandys, what's the total cost for parts and fitting?

Hard to say exactly as I have misplaced the original reciept for parts I bought the bits with the intention of doing the work with my stepdad but he has more important things going on in his life at the mo, rang a few people locally but ended up going to Adie @ AHMotorsports, really helpful guy answered my dumb questions without laughing too hard It was pretty clear that most of my local garages don't do that sort of work and charge you for box removal, sending to someone else who might know and then refit etc.

parts + fitting +VAT was approx £750

Hard to give an opinion on it at the mo, traffic was heavy and after driving about in his 1.2 8v Punto loaner the GT felt like a diesel ferrari , popped my foot down out of a junction and was speechless at the way it shifted, my advice to anyone if you get a touch usedto/bored of your motor drive a slow city car for a few days you'll have a new appreciation when you get back in your Alfa, even a diesel one.

I did try a quick start and also planted it in a corner with ASR off, no drama, with the road as damp as it was I would get front end hop and wheelspin with that sort of attack on a standing start but didn't get much at all, so very promising, there was a small shade of understeer going in hot into the corner and then it just cut in nice, course I have new tyres on at the mo too so could be that too , with more time on roads I have driven daily for years should show me whats what

Sounds Good.
Adie is a top man and does know his stuff, so your car was in good hands.

I know what you mean about driving something else for a while to be able to appreciate how good the Alfa is, I have a little Fiat Cinquecento for that purpose! The Cinq is a cheeky little thing, but you appreciate the Alfa when you get back in.

Originally Posted by alfasud.ti

The Q2 is a stock part, therefore its price can't be much different in Sweden than in Greece where it costs about €400. Its availability however is a different story.

ti, Sandys, how did you order the Q2 diff? Through Alfa dealership or seller of OEM parts?

Just went to Alfa parts and ordered the bits.

Alfa Dealership. There was only one Q2 diff in their warehouses. Now we have ordered four more but it looks like the demand is increasing along with the waiting time. Some Italians are also retrofitting Q2 to JTDs, in Italy diesel cars are the rule, not the exception.

wow great news!
however.... is the Q2 diffs suitable for track use ? I was under the impression that the Q2 is more suitable for daily driving, cause I'm planning to track the GTA 2-4 times a year

Some people say that a classic clutch-type LSD is more suitable for track use than a Torsen, mainly because its locking percent can be easily changed by adding/removing clutch disks. However a Torsen is a better all-around front diff because it doesn't have any of the disadvantages of the clutch-type, namely its abrupt locking causing steering side effects, its need for maintenance because of disk wear and its noisy operation due to disk friction.

So, for a mixed-use FWD or 4WD car (95% road and 5% track) the Torsen is IMHO by far more suitable. Now, if you are asking whether the Q2 will take aggressive track use without collapsing I have no way of knowing. On the other hand, abusing the diff of a FWD in the track like this guy is asking for trouble and won't give you any better lap times either.

Have to say I haven't experienced any abrupt locking, despite shed loads of extra torque over standard, and having a track biased setup for my clutch type LSD.

Honestly torque steer is very much reduced, (even for insane power outputs ) This would still hold true on a very bumpy road where one wheel might become significantly unloaded (a potential issue for Torsen diffs).
I found driving quickly on bumpy country roads is *much* safer and more predictable even than my much less powerful factory standard GTA.

I can't comment on the typical maintenance yet, for a normal car I would be suprised if it was less than 4 years or so.
My car is modified to the extent that my gearbox casing seems to be the most likely weak link when using an LSD so I'm unlikely to last this long..
(For me personally this could well be the case with a torsen diff too, but I'm interested in investigating alternatives)

BTW The AD diff noise is minimal - practically silent with a gearbox FM additive, which you really should use.

As I posted in the detailed LSD Group comparison thread, where I got to test a Quaiffe diff and a AD diff in two different GTAs

http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-...roup-test.html

..my personal findings on track at least were that the AD diff essentially murdered the Quaiffe diff - on the road I imagine the quaife diff would possibly be the all round the easiest option (fit and forget).

I might yet try a torsen diff at some point but I personally would defintely go for a way more agressive torque split than is the case on the 2.5v6 diff.
I would be very curious to know what the Quaife diff settings for the Focus RS were as compared to the 156 2.5v6.

(If JWayatt is watching, maybe his secret informant might know? )

A Q2/Quaife Torsen diff will be fine for track use too.
Many people race with them.
The only time a Torsen type diff looses out is if a driven wheel is completely in the air with no resistance on it at all.