Tuning Brera 2.4 JTDM

For info in case anyone else was interested. Emailed celtictuning about their experiences with this car and the issue of Alfa overwriting the new software during routine maintenance.

This was the answer :

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The Brera JTDm engine we can take from 200bhp and 295lbft torque up to 250bhp and an impressive 369lbft torque. All our maps are developed using the dyno to ensure correct fuelling for MOT compliance and to ensure it is within tolerance of engine and drive train components. The performance once remapped will be impressive and under normal driving conditions you can expect to see an improvement in fuel economy.

The remap is fully undetectable and comes with 14 day money back guarantee which gives you more time to trial the results on the road and ensure it is what you are after. We also carry out pre and post diagnostic work to ensure all is fine with your car.

The cost of the remap is £425 all inclusive for which we come to your location. In regards to the software question. Alfa should not load a new software flash onto the ecu. However, if they do then we will redo the remap free of charge. We have now done about 25 of these vehicles and each one of them are very impressive.

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Very tempted indeed!

Aren't they related to Angel Tuning? Much nearer to you in Warwickshire than Celtic.

Originally Posted by fantom alfa

Aren't they related to Angel Tuning? Much nearer to you in Warwickshire than Celtic.

Hmm .. possible indeed. I will check - thanks.

I was concerned about ensuring that if an alfa spanner monkey overwrote the software, I could get it back without full reprogramming costs.

Originally Posted by bunyarra

.. The remap is fully undetectable ..

I am always surprised about this sentence.

How can it be undetectable? If settings are changed or when you are redirected for instance to other software it must be easy to detect with another software program.

And if the driver feels the difference when a car is remapped, a mechanic won't feel the difference?

Furthermore if for instance the rev limiter cuts in at 7,500 in stead of 7,000 on the TS engine you can see it easily on the rev counter.

With this in mind I personally would never be tempted because I don't want to risk voiding the warranty.

Originally Posted by selespeed

I am always surprised about this sentence.
And if the driver feels the difference when a car is remapped, a mechanic won't feel the difference?

Ah ... a Fiat mechanic detecting the difference?

But, yes, they are valid comments. However, still think I will give it a go when the engine has been run in. I do not drive like a hooligan and respect the car - just fancy a bit more welly

My dealer noticed the difference so I wouldn't assume yours wouldn't, its detectable if they bother to look, its just a case of downloading the code at the end of the day and comparing one piece with another and playing spot the difference.

I was told by a salesman last weekend that you can get Alfa approved remaps that won't void the warranty !!

Is that true

Originally Posted by fantom alfa

Aren't they related to Angel Tuning? Much nearer to you in Warwickshire than Celtic.

Just thought I'd pop in and have a look.....
No we're not related to Angel in any way, Angel is a completely separate company with its own software.

Regarding detectability, Alfa has no software which is able to view the file in any 2d, 3d or hexidecimal manner. The EDC16 ECU's have constantly changing checksums which means they can't compare checksum values like you could with EDC15 as they never stay static. OBDII adds to the flash counter on the ECU which is one way of detecting.... but we dont use this method for EDC16C38/39 ECU.

Cheers

Graham
Celtic Tuning

Originally Posted by nomad

I was told by a salesman last weekend that you can get Alfa approved remaps that won't void the warranty !!

Is that true

We provide remaps for customers of a couple of Alfa garages whereby they validate the warranties still. We have had variouis cars on their kit to look for detectability and is the sole reason they go ahead with it.

Originally Posted by jtd lover

Regarding detectability, Alfa has no software which is able to view the file in any 2d, 3d or hexidecimal manner. ... OBDII adds to the flash counter on the ECU which is one way of detecting.... but we dont use this method for EDC16C38/39 ECU.

What about a remap of the 2.2 petrol, is that possible and if so what is the result ?

Originally Posted by hottrout

What about a remap of the 2.2 petrol, is that possible and if so what is the result ?

Autodelta are supposedly working on this.
200BPH would be a nice round figure.

Yeah, 200bhp and 42mpg would be even better

Originally Posted by hottrout

Yeah, 200bhp and 42mpg would be even better

What you want is a 2.4 JTD.

Originally Posted by hottrout

Yeah, 200bhp and 42mpg would be even better

Not too bothered about the
economy. If it ran on clubbed baby seals,
I'd be fine with that.

Not personally touched or developed the 2.2 as yet.... It will without doubt hit the 200bhp figure though when we do.

There's just something not quite right about having a GM block in an Alfa even though it is essentially Alfa head and internals

Originally Posted by jtd lover

Not personally touched or developed the 2.2 as yet.... It will without doubt hit the 200bhp figure though when we do.

There's just something not quite right about having a GM block in an Alfa even though it is essentially Alfa head and internals

Heh heh, looks like you're in the know.

Originally Posted by jtd lover

Just thought I'd pop in and have a look.....
No we're not related to Angel in any way, Angel is a completely separate company with its own software.

Regarding detectability, Alfa has no software which is able to view the file in any 2d, 3d or hexidecimal manner. The EDC16 ECU's have constantly changing checksums which means they can't compare checksum values like you could with EDC15 as they never stay static. OBDII adds to the flash counter on the ECU which is one way of detecting.... but we dont use this method for EDC16C38/39 ECU.

Cheers

Graham
Celtic Tuning

OBDII flash does add to the flash counter however there are OBDII tools that reset the flash counter meaning it can be even less detectable as you don't need to crack open the ECU to BDM it.

The checksum statement is partially incorrect as the only data that changes is the data in the EEPROM memory area for adaptation. The main binary is static Which is why the checksum needs to be calculated correctly with EEPROM, EPROM and processor content, sometimes this is bypassed by using helper checksums or patches.

A main dealer could detect any remap by simply datalogging of any changed perimeters or the changes they've produced. Anyone claiming undetectability is being very naive.

Originally Posted by somaD

Anyone claiming undetectability is being very naive.

Or lying....


Chris

A very silly statement. They are of course detectable. That's why I always tell people to talk to their dealer if the car is still in warranty.

Out of warranty, you have nothing to worry about!

Originally Posted by somaD

A main dealer could detect any remap by simply datalogging of any changed perimeters or the changes they've produced. Anyone claiming undetectability is being very naive.

I've mentioned this before but I was told by a dealer's Chief Techie:

"If you get a remap tell us as it'll show up as error codes on the diagnostic equipment !"

Originally Posted by nomad

I've mentioned this before but I was told by a dealer's Chief Techie:

"If you get a remap tell us as it'll show up as error codes on the diagnostic equipment !"

Sshhhh!!!
If ARUK read this we'll be had