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Anyone ever tried this Alfa 164 Chip upgrade?

6K views 18 replies 8 participants last post by  AlfissimoInternational 
#1 ·
I recently bought one of these and wondered if anyone else has tried one and what was the result? I'm only really interested in the torque increase, I just don't care about "fuel economy" me :D

Bought from Ebay USA for a whole £16.41 ! - So thought its got to be worth a punt, put in my spare ECU and give it a try... If its any good I might try and get it copied..

Details below:

Alfa Romeo 164 Performance Chip. For cars with the 3.0L 12 valve engine. This chip increases fuel economy and power by optimizing fuel and ignition curves using 91+ octane fuel. Increases of 18HP 12 lb/ft TQ. depending on other mods can be expected. Excellent for cars with bolt-on mods as well as internal performance modifications.

Increased gains of:
Horsepower 18 HP
Torque 12 lb/ft

ECU# 0 261 200 117

91+ octane is required for maximum performance and fuel efficiency. This performance chip will increase fuel economy and power by optimizing fuel and ignition curves for supreme fuel. The chip will also remove the top speed governor.
 
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#4 ·
No, the chip is optimised for fuel with a rating 91 RON and above, the more the RON the better it'll perform. Standard fuel in the USA is 88 RON and thier Premium fuel is 92 or 93 RON. We here in UK have 95 as standard and 98 or 99 as our premium,as you know.

My guess is that due to the USA having to pay $3.00 for regular fuel, no-one wants to pay for premium at $3.30. (They want to try buying fuel in UK for a while!!) Plus Alfa 164 12v is an older model so they have decided to cut thier losses and punt the chips on cheaply.
 
#5 ·
Don't install it! :tut: :rant: These cheap chips are either rip offs or home grown jobs that have not been tested. Why do you think the pros sell them for 300 plus? You can end up seriously damaging your engine by advancing fuel curves beyond normal parameters. Fuel will remain unburnt and drip down the cyilinders mixing with your oil and thinning it out. Eventually you'll loose your rings, liners and/or crank will go south. If you want performance that will not damage your engine there is very rarely a cheap option. Remember you get what you pay for and if it sounds to good to be true then it probably is! :rant: [rant over]

I personally would not install anything other than squadra or autodelta chips. After all the problems you've had I would just enjoy as is for a while! ;)

J
 
#6 ·
With respect (and to balance the debate) these tuning chips that you see advertised all over theplace are often just exact copies of the £300 ones you see elsewhere. The blank chip itself costs pennies, what you pay for is the development time someone put in and the equipment needed to copy. In recent years the equipment used to copy these chips has come down in price. Squadra uses a anticopy device which is supplied with his chips which I assume is becasue they know very well that they could be copied for approx 99p :)

I am not saying this exact chip is 100% kosha or that is can do what it says but to say that a cheap chip is dangerous in some way is not 100% accurate.

Several years ago a friend of mine purchased a tuning chip that he had specifically mapped for his Audi S2, he copied it and seold it to other owners for £5 a piece. go figure.

Personally I wouldnt bother with it unless I could afford to take the risk.

ps: If anyone wants a genuine Squadra chip made for Alfa Code 164 24v Cloverleaf PM me, I have one for sale :) :)


Mike
 
#11 · (Edited)
Without boasting - I can afford to take the risk, I have spare 164 engine & gearbox, and every ancil. plus all the sensors etcfrom 164 donor cars.

The thing is, this is a genuine Alfa USA chip from a US Alfa dealer, it is not a copy. I emailed the guy and asked about its history and in short it's NOS (new old stock), that they are clearing out because they simply don't have any call for it nowadays - they had one on the shelf collecting dust and thought to Ebay it rather than bin it. Don't know what these went for back in the day, but as its genuine I cannot see too much of a threat from this chip.

I will use the standard chip until I take the car to a rolling road, test out the standard version and then swap ECU's over and test out the "performance chip" to see the comparison.

I know theres stacks of cheap chip upgrades out there ( I have owned several Lancia Integrale 8v's, 16v's and Evo 2 ) I always left my road cars standard and let my fellow Grale drivers mess around with SuperChips and the Evo Engineerings chip that always over fuelled the cars that they were fitted to. The only performance chip I ever used was the B.B.R. chip that was written for my Bob Brain Developments Grp N powered Lancia HF4WD. That was a stupidly fast car called "mongrel".:D
 
#12 ·
MattNoVAT said:
I recently bought one of these and wondered if anyone else has tried one and what was the result? I'm only really interested in the torque increase, I just don't care about "fuel economy" me :D

Bought from Ebay USA for a whole £16.41 ! - So thought its got to be worth a punt, put in my spare ECU and give it a try... If its any good I might try and get it copied..

Details below:

Alfa Romeo 164 Performance Chip. For cars with the 3.0L 12 valve engine. This chip increases fuel economy and power by optimizing fuel and ignition curves using 91+ octane fuel. Increases of 18HP 12 lb/ft TQ. depending on other mods can be expected. Excellent for cars with bolt-on mods as well as internal performance modifications.

Increased gains of:
Horsepower 18 HP
Torque 12 lb/ft

ECU# 0 261 200 117

91+ octane is required for maximum performance and fuel efficiency. This performance chip will increase fuel economy and power by optimizing fuel and ignition curves for supreme fuel. The chip will also remove the top speed governor.
I have had a Weber Starchip fitted to my 164 3.0 Lusso Auto for 10 years. I have got used to the performance boost but it undoubtedly exists and is noticeable when I drive a non chipped car. I have never had the car on a dyno but can say from the seat of the pants that mid range torque is way better and the car revs more cleanly. Top speed does not appear to have increased. A very experienced Alfa mechanic drove my car shortly after I had the mod done and expressed surprise in how well it went. Another mechanic said that it is the easiest way to to increase the performance of an Alfa.
I think the claim of + 18 HP may be a bit optimistic, however.
 
#13 ·
Those are pirated chips copied from a company in California. They were not good chips to begin with. 16hp is the max you can get out of the 12V lusso. They have been OK chips as far as performance but they leave the CEL on all the time.
They tend to ping as well under load.

They are pirated chips which means you don;t know what your getting. They could have maxed out all the permeters of the chip to run the ECU at MAX which in most cases is not a good thing. Could run the engine much hotter amungst other things.

I would not want to put a chip that cost only £16.41 in my ECU.

Go with squadra. Very nice chip. Satisfaction gauranteed, anything goes wrong you can have them fix the problem. Not somce ebay guy selling copied chips.

You actually beleive that it is a performance chip from an Alfa dealer? NOS?? No. Alfa never made performance chips for the 164.

Do not install it, you will regret it sooner or later. Just because you have an extra engine, why in the world would you want to spend £1000's to replace an engine for a £16.41?? When you can spend a couple hundred and do it right without any worries??

Just does not make sense to take a chance??

jason
 
#14 ·
I've had a cheap Ebay chip in mine for a couple of years now. It's not that make, it's a "Blitzchip". They claimed about another 10BHP, which isn't unreasonable.

I have to say that I haven't noticed any more power at full throttle & full revs but the car does definitely seem to have a fair bit more mid range "poke". The engine note is also different - crisper, and it is more willing to increase engine speed quickly when the throttle is "blipped".

The downside? Well, it's a fair bit thirstier! There's a popping from the exhaust on over-run so presumably they've done away with the over-run fuel cut off. They've probably also given it more acceleration enrichment. I've gone from average consumption over a week of about 30MPG to about 27.

I haven't managed to make it "pink" at all - EVER, under any circumstances. That said, it feels like there is a bit more ignition advance in the mid range. I've tried using the high octane fuels like Shell Optimax and the BP equivalent but other than a (could be imagining it) smoother idle, I have not found any benefit to doing so. It is fine on premuim unleaded.

I agree that some cheap chips could increase the fuelling to the extent that oil was washed from the bores but that doesn't seem to have been my experience and the engine has nearly a quarter of a million miles on it now!
 
#15 · (Edited)
AlfissimoInternational said:
You actually beleive that it is a performance chip from an Alfa dealer? NOS?? No. Alfa never made performance chips for the 164.

Do not install it, you will regret it sooner or later. Just because you have an extra engine, why in the world would you want to spend £1000's to replace an engine for a £16.41?? When you can spend a couple hundred and do it right without any worries??

Just does not make sense to take a chance??

jason
I generally don't belive anything anyone claims on Ebay but after exchanging several emails with the guy I'm happy that he is working at an Alfa Dealer. And OK, so Alfa don't actually make the chip themselves, (I should have stated this in my earlier post) but if it's being sold by an Alfa dealer that to me is far better than buying one from some Max Power crowd that claims all sorts.

I could go to a Mitsubishi Dealer tomorrow and buy a upgrade chip for my Mitsubishi, the chips not written by Mistsubishi but its sold by thier dealer! Does that make it a crap chip?

£1000's To replace an engine?:eek: ? Wow - Last time I changed a V6 in my car, A complete 164 cost me £300 it took me 9 hours to do a complete engine & box swap and drive mine up the road! (OK, shortly after I eventually found 2 damaged earth wires in the injector loom - but hey ho! ) The parts to renovate the engine (Engine set, belt etc etc came to more than the car cost me but the engine still stands me in at less than £650. - I sold off some of the 164 parts and made back what the car cost me:D If I wanted to swap it again now, all it would cost me is a days work to swap em over!

When it does arrive I'm testing it out at a rolling road that also does ECU work - these guys can show me whats good/bad with the chip and I trust thier expertise - so I'll post up the comparison/results.

Seems that there is an equal balance out there of those who have actually tried upgrade chips and seen positive results and those that are dead set against them - (they don't state if they have actually tried upgrades that haven't increased performance, had a bad chip cause them problems or just if they are just playing safe).

Don't think I'm daft enough to blindly install a chip into a car and just hope for the best, thats why I asked on the forum and thats why I'll be checking first at the rolling road.:)
 
#16 ·
I also see from searching this forum that Squadra chips have been fitted to cars that were running fine, only to render them VOR when the new Squadra chip is installed. I don't immediately label Squadra as rubbish chips.

Someone like Squadra will have to resolve problems caused by thier chips after the fact, which I think is only right and fair. But thats the customer service/aftercare and thats nothing to do with the quality of thier chip programming.

Any upgrade chip carries a potential risk, the best any of us can do is ask around to identify if your pioneering something or whether its been done before and if so, you can learn from others experience. If you are pioneering, then do it in a controlled environment, or as controlled as possible.

I've searched the Fiat Forum, I've found people on there who have fit Weber Starchips to thier cars and wound up with a dead motor and a fat bill from Fiat.
So what does one do? As theres people on this forum that have had a positive result and 10 years of experience with no detrimental effects and another with a couple of years of experience with a similar results other than a slight decrease in MPG. Or do I just sit and "play it safe" because I'm paranoid an engine might go pop?
 
#17 ·
Just a thought, as 164 ECUs are so cheap nowadays I've been thinking of getting one from a breaker with a standard chip in so I don't have to prise the modified chip out of its holder if I want to swap chips. If you're going to do a back-to-back rolling road test (and I'd be very interested if you do!) it might be easier than trying to prise the lugs apart on the ECU casing to swap the chips. Ideally, if time permits, you ought to do a run with the standard chip, a run with the modified chiip and then another run with each chip to verify that the results are consistent.
 
#18 ·
Avocet, You have hit the nail on the head - that is exactly what I will be doing. Thats what I class as a "controlled environment".

I'll somehow get the results of both scanned and then post them up - wont be for a few weeks yet as I'm getting married and then on honeymoon for three weeks.

After that we should be moving house! :eek:

But I will be doing it, as my cars are my toys and I need to play with them to keep me sane.
 
#19 · (Edited)
Not really what I meant! I was just pointing out to be cautious! Thats all.
engine replacement....checkbook mechanic, not DIY.
I have a squarda chip, I have installed them on over 25 164's with good results. never had a single problem except for one guy who installed it himself and took off the anti-copy chip, had to have a new one made.
My other point was that at least you have a guarantee with squadra. Not sure what this guy is guarantee is? What alfa dealer?? Not saying alfa dealers can't make good chips. I know many places that make good 164 chips! I persoanlly am sckeptical of ebay chips, thats it!
I was just trying to help! Was not intending you where daft??? Where did you get that from?
I just gave worst case senerio! Most likely won't happen! Most likely the chip will be fine, maybe somethings you don't like about. or it is wonderful.
No need to get snippy about it! You did ask on a public forum for god sakes!!
Good luck!

"My guess is that due to the USA having to pay $3.00 for regular fuel, no-one wants to pay for premium at $3.30. (They want to try buying fuel in UK for a while!!) Plus Alfa 164 12v is an older model so they have decided to cut thier losses and punt the chips on cheaply."

This is a guess for sure, don't assume. No one is punting on their chips. The guy you bought from copies chisp and makes a living fo it. I seriously doubt he put in the R&D for all the cars he has chips for.
BTW, Premium here is $2.54.+/- Most 164 owners use premium no matter how much it costs as it only runs good off premium. When you always have had cheap gas I guess you gte concerned when it goes up $1.50 in a short amount of time especally for 91-92 octane. If it where 95+ then I am sure we would not complains much and really we don't. Only the idiots complain! I complain because our president or monkey if you will is a moron! Oil war crazy cowboy~!
J

PS:
is it this ebay chip:

Alfa Romeo 164 Ricambi Performance Chip

Seller: brealovesyou

or same chip from this guy:

xg_motorsports

They are both chips copied from:

http://www.arricambi.com/

Chips were OK like I said, good performance but CEL on all the time and MPG reduced along with a bit warmer running car.

You should be OK though! I think your the only person I have ever heard of buying this chip. Most on alfabb and 164digest would not touch it with 10 foot pole. But for that price I guess why not??
 
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