Motor Control System Failure - Check your Battery

[DAN55]

new maf fitted - warning stil comes on - lets hope it adjusts itself soonish :/

[topalfauser]

Nightmare. Check your coil pack. It sorted mine after 1.5 years of failed trouble-shooting by Alfa dealer. I eventually sorted it myself. Car now runs like a dream.

[horromark]

That is brill to know, because I am getting the same problem, and have had Lambda sensors replaced along with crankshaft sensor, funny enough I have recently had to charge my battery overnight!! Mmmmmm interesting. I think ill invest in a new battery.

Thanks

[DAN55]

hi guys,

mine is running okish when warm - but when starting off from cold it is a nightmare! totally flat when pulling into roundabouts etc

[renorti]

looks like some alfa dealers are still doing a poor job.my farther had older alfetta's and the dealers could never sort these cars out,because their mechanics were not used to twin cams/twin 40's etc as they normally worked on mk1 escorts with single card and pushrod cast lumps!but in this day and age there should be no excuse for misdiagonsed faults,considering how expensive their charges are.

[DAN55]

so many possible things to replace mine just says airflow when the error message is check via ecu

[GTAtuner]

I went through a 12month nightmare, replaced batteries,sensors, including the ABS pump.
In the end I went to an independent auto-electrical shop that works mainly on Beemers & Mercs.
The fault was the alternator. I went back to the dealer, met with the dealer principal. Something unbelievable happened.They gave me a credit & fitted a new alternator at no charge.
The car has been okay for a month now (miracle).
Anyway, check out the alternator & related wiring.
Bye

[chevy]

Originally Posted by ianmbird

Just signed up & for my first post I thought I would tell a short story which might help other Alfa owners possibly save some money.

This is the second 156 I have owned, its 4 years old now & it has been a fantastic car & up until recently it has proved ultra reliable.

Last September I started to get VDC failures on initial start up in the morning – not always but usually once a week . In it went to Arnold Clark in Aberdeen, who put it on the examiner – recalibrated the sensors and all seemed fine for a week. It then started again ( now the funny thing was – it only occurred on the first start up – If I restarted the engine all was fine)

So back it went to Arnold who then said that the sensors would need replacing. It was due it’s MOT in December – so I decided to leave it until then

Well in October I got the dreaded ‘Motor Control system Failure’ ( why does this always happen on a Saturday night/Sunday when everything is closed). Anyway back to Arnold, back on the examiner –“ Ah that will be a new Lambda sensor please”

OK I thought – get it replaced & it will be all sorted, and for a week it was, until one night coming back from Tesco’s I got the “Motor control system failure” again.

So back she went to Arnold – back on the examiner – two days later Arnold called to say that they couldn’t find anything wrong, they reset the ECU (relieving me of £100 in the process) and handed me back the car.

Well guess what another week later “Motor Control System Failure”. Back to Arnold.
“We’ve found the fault – it’s another Lambda sensor” - so that one was replaced. More money to Arnold – but at that stage the wife was getting a bit p**ed off

Great all sorted – or so I thought. You guessed it, within another week – BING – “Motor Control system failure”

Again back to Arnold, now I am trying to be really nice about this – you know , Italian car – Italian electrics, now I bought the Alfa knowing that this is always a possibility., but my mood is not helped when the Service Manager at Arnold in Aberdeen come out with the comment of “ Well you would by an Alfa – what else do you expect” – It wouldn’t be so bad if they weren’t the only Alfa dealer in Aberdeen!

Anyway, I get a call a day later from Arnold saying that – It’s the ECU – you need a new ECU - £500 please.

At this stage, the wife goes ballistic ( not helped by the fact that our other car – a thirty year old Landrover had just passed it’s MOT for the third time in a row – without anything needing done.

Right I thought – time to find a second opinion, Got her booked into CP Garages in Dundee, spoke to Euan (great bloke). Got her MOT done at the same time, and Euan gave me a 146 as a courtesy car (Great fun) – by the way “courtesy car and Arnold Clark – don’t even go there.

So Got a phone call from Euan on the Monday morning to say that the car sailed through it’s MOT. But what about the ‘Motor Control System Failure” - Well Euan had deduced that the Battery was on the way out.

Got the battery replaced – clean voltage now going to the ECU – no more Motor control system failure – no more VDC failures – it’s been six weeks since the battery has been replaced & no nasty error messages.

What’s more Euan had spotted that one of the Lambda sensors, which had been replaced by Arnold, had had the wiring too close to the exhaust & the wiring was starting to melt.

Guess where all my servicing will now be done (also quoted me a good price for getting the Cambelt changed).

Did I really need the 2 new Lambda sensors, who knows. Would replacing the ECU have resolved my issue – Nope – but it would have put more money in Arnold’s pockets.

Now Arnold probably did everything by the manual – but you do wonder If they replaced the ECU and then found out it was the battery , whether thy would have refunded the cost of the ECU.

Hope this story & the moral it encompasses might be of help to other ALFA owners

got the same problem with my gt motor control system failure and vdc light comes when i start up and vdc comes on when iam driving the fuel gauge flicks about and the car misses and runs lumpy ive had this a while so i will check my battery

[katherine]

Looks great! A lot of great thoughts!

____________________
Kit de Conversion au Xenon HID

[mike_147]

Firstly hello, I've used the forum in the past for help, but this time I need something more I think.

An MCSF error, which beeps on ignition, error message lasts for 20-30 seconds, then disappears but the EM icon remains lit throughout the journey.

The car is a Y-reg 147, and have had it for 12 months with no problems. Car had full service from alfa dealer, then soon after a ticking noise devloped. I took it to an alfa dealer (Jamie in Royston), who replaced a broken piston ring.
The car was driven gently for two months, then I started to run it on a motorway and drive it properly again. Soon after I got the first MCSF warning light halfway through a journey.

Since then it has been constant, until one day it stopped - for no apparent reason. Then within a week it came back, and is now always there at startup - for over two months.

I read all the threads here, and had the battery replaced as well as doing an ECU reset using the sequence:

1 - disconnect neg terminal for 45 minutes.
2 - reconnect
3 - turn key, (but not start), for 2 minutes
4 - turn off
5 - turn key & ignition, (but no revs), for 15 minutes
6 - turn off
7 - turn on, and drive properly

The MCSF error remained throughout, and while I can identify no problem with the car - maybe fuel management, maybe something else but cant be sure etc. - the message is a concern.

Any ideas? (or is it just straight back to the dealer?) I would like to find a solution, as I drove it without issue for the first twelve months, and now seem to be in-and-out of the workshop all the time!

thanks.

[leeattwells]

Originally Posted by mike_147

Firstly hello, I've used the forum in the past for help, but this time I need something more I think.

An MCSF error, which beeps on ignition, error message lasts for 20-30 seconds, then disappears but the EM icon remains lit throughout the journey.

The car is a Y-reg 147, and have had it for 12 months with no problems. Car had full service from alfa dealer, then soon after a ticking noise devloped. I took it to an alfa dealer (Jamie in Royston), who replaced a broken piston ring.
The car was driven gently for two months, then I started to run it on a motorway and drive it properly again. Soon after I got the first MCSF warning light halfway through a journey.

Since then it has been constant, until one day it stopped - for no apparent reason. Then within a week it came back, and is now always there at startup - for over two months.

I read all the threads here, and had the battery replaced as well as doing an ECU reset using the sequence:

1 - disconnect neg terminal for 45 minutes.
2 - reconnect
3 - turn key, (but not start), for 2 minutes
4 - turn off
5 - turn key & ignition, (but no revs), for 15 minutes
6 - turn off
7 - turn on, and drive properly

The MCSF error remained throughout, and while I can identify no problem with the car - maybe fuel management, maybe something else but cant be sure etc. - the message is a concern.

Any ideas? (or is it just straight back to the dealer?) I would like to find a solution, as I drove it without issue for the first twelve months, and now seem to be in-and-out of the workshop all the time!

thanks.

Hi my wife has a Y reg 147 2.0 TS and has the motor control failure light coming on the same as yours and while its on during warmup it runs a little bit rough.
Today i did the ecu reset like you have done and the light went and the car drove like a dream then went to asda came out and it was on again!

i might try changing the plugs next and then the battery or get to the local alfa dealer the only trouble is it goes off just when you dont want it too (ive heard that it needs to on for them to diagnose?)

let me know what happens- all the time its running and will get my wife round town I am not too worried but i want it fixed more now to know what it is!

[MC 147]

hi guys,
reading some of your posts and hoping that you can help,
i get motor control system failure on average about once a week along with vdc / abs system failure. changed the battery and its still the same, when i get motor control system failure the fan cuts in and stays on, this only does it on start up like yours ian and when you turn the motor off and on again the fan is no longer running and the managment light will then go off after about half an hour.
the vdc and abs system failure comes on every so often but only when i press the brake pedal and goes away after the the motor is turned off and on again!
my 147 also runs like a bag of crap which i have been told is the maff sensor.
anyone shed any light on these little probs for me :-)
thanks

[fadi1973]

after 3 howrs i turnd the car on
this message appear motor control sys failure
i turnd the car of,then on the message disapper


please replay to me soon,whats the problem in my 147 model 2003

best regards

[cbrites]

Hello all,

I also had that error message, "Motor Control System Failure" and that litle yellow engine always lighten on my GT 1.9jtd.
Before going to the dealer I notice that this hapened at least two times in the day after I fill up with diesel. When the deposit reaches the end the error seems to dissapear.
I dont know how it works in UK, but here in Portugal there are some diesel dealers, joined with supermarkets that have cheaper prices on petrol and diesel.
I bought a diesel engine cleaner, and joined it in a new fill up with a recognized brand BP, or Repsol or Cepsa and I never had that error again!

regards

cbrites
2004 Alfa Romeo GT 1.9JTD

[leeattwells]

finally sorted wifes problem on 2.0ts-

the head had a crack in it and water was getting on the plugs in turn bringing on the motor control failure light, it was just a small crack and did not stop the car from running.

also starter motor went.
exhaust
battery
new plugs
oil filter and oil
cam belt

final cost

£1350 ouch!
hopefully thats it for the moment

still need to get my 156 2.5 v6 serviced!

[fadi1973]

thx all for opinion

i want to change the bettery ,but anyone can tell me

what the right choice for bettery brang

voltage and amper,must i put

thx

[monstermonte]

I had this code come up often , bad times! changed lambda, throttle body etc have a fantastic garage that wouldn't charge to clear it (phew!) but have now passed the car on would have been nice to try battery as the better half had enough of the warnings but on a good note now have the 159ti, good times! p

[gerard3075]

Hi All,
I joined this forum after searching MSF warning for my 2003 156 JTS 2.0 veloce. I had the car off the road for over a year which is a bad thing as although it was garaged it got quite damp. The car started OK although eventually it conked out as I was driving after giving various intermittent warning messages and odd happenings like the cruise control not working.

Anyway I read this thread and dutifully bought a new battery which worked like a dream in clearing up my MSF fault message. However, it came back and after 2 further attempts at disconnecting the battery for over an hour the fault has now cleared (so far!). The love affair was back on but 10 mins. later the air bag warning light came on...such is life with an Alfa. Morale of the story is that a duff battery may be the problem for some or there may be a whole raft of other problems ...all part of the agony and ecstasy of Alfa owning. http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/images/smilies/eek.gif

[Alfa-Red]

Originally Posted by gerard3075

Hi All,
I joined this forum after searching MSF warning for my 2003 156 JTS 2.0 veloce. I had the car off the road for over a year which is a bad thing as although it was garaged it got quite damp. The car started OK although eventually it conked out as I was driving after giving various intermittent warning messages and odd happenings like the cruise control not working.

Anyway I read this thread and dutifully bought a new battery which worked like a dream in clearing up my MSF fault message. However, it came back and after 2 further attempts at disconnecting the battery for over an hour the fault has now cleared (so far!). The love affair was back on but 10 mins. later the air bag warning light came on...such is life with an Alfa. Morale of the story is that a duff battery may be the problem for some or there may be a whole raft of other problems ...all part of the agony and ecstasy of Alfa owning. http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/images/smilies/eek.gif

tbf, that would happen to any car stood for over a year, the worst thing for a car is leaving it in the garage for any long period of time let alone a year.

they sweat, like fruit, moisture in the electrics etc, so probavly statred as a simple battery fault.

morle of the story, dont leave a car stood for over a year, in a humid enviroment and expect it to be all sweet and light a year later

my punto has stood for nearly a year outdoors and its fine, apart from a clutch and the piston rings, starts 1st time though

[Chrisalfa]

I am on my second Alfa 156 JTS and i have had a nightmare of a time trying to diagnose the problem.

I have had 2 garages look at it and they both charged me in excess of £300 so over £600 has been spent replacing the air inlet manifold sensor TWICE, when there was nothing wrong with it and i'm still getting the wretched MOTOR CONTROL SYSTEM FAILURE error along with the VRC error coming up shortly after.

The time, money and stress I have wasted on this is unacceptable but now, hopefully after reading Ian's post, I will be changing the battery and re-setting the ECU to see if this is the magic wand to make these errors go away.
There's nothing worse than starting the car and having the BEEP BEEP BEEP go off with the MCSF sign coming on every day.
I will let everyone know the outcome as soon as I replace the battery and hope that others don't get fooled by other garages into thinking that the air inlet manifold is the problem, or anything else for that matter.
And garages should fix the problem or else give us back our hard earned cash because if they haven't got a clue as to what it is then they shouldn't be in the business in the first place. I am sick and tired of cowboy rip-off garages who claim to know what they are doing. Let's fix things amongst ourselves because with forums like these, knowledge is power.

Happy motoring all!

[topalfauser]

Chrisalfa,

If your JTS is about year 2003, make sure you check the coil pack. Like you, after 18months having to put up with this beeps and several trips to Alfa Garage and lots of cash without success, I sorted it myslef by replacing the coil pack. It did the trick for and I've finally been enjoying my Alfa for the pack 10 months.

The frustrating thing is I reported this to the Alfa garage that messed me about for 18months and he told me that the coil pack probably had nothing to do with it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He didn't make any sense to me so I simply gave up before I started to shout at him.

If your battery doesn't do the trick, try the coil pack. I was told the BOSCH coil packs had a bad batch around that period.

R.

[Chrisalfa]

I found this article which every Alfa 156 owner should read before going to a garage and spending lots of money.
It is a mechanics description of how he diagnosed various problems by trial and error BEFORE giving the customer the option of wasting lots of money on unnecessary parts.

I hope it's useful...

http://www.ads-global.co.uk/ads/html...TRONIC%201.pdf

[snackage]

The stuff they tried is quite interesting. They still ended up charging the customer >£1k, but to be fair it looked like all the stuff needed doing at some point anyway.

I recently had the engine warning light appear after a local drive. Car was still driving fine. The warning persisted for about a week then miraculously vanished 1 morning. I still got the battery changed since the mechanic I use had been on at me for ages about changing it - it was an original and over 7 years old. Anyhoo, not seen the error since [cross fingers].

All electronics rely on a decent power supply - any small niggles that can normally be compensated for are going to look worse to an ECU struggling for juice.

Anyway, thanks for the link - found it food for thought.

[Chrisalfa]

Hello,
Thanks for the advice regarding changing the coil, I will be doing that along with the battery early May and will post the results here..
I'm very anxious to see if this does the trick to get rid of the wretched MOTOR CONTRL SYSTEM FAILURE message....

Cheers for now..

[DAN55]

hi guys - just saw this on another thread - could be worth a look maybe, as mine still stuffed :/
http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-...-for-free.html (DIY EGR Fix - for Free)

cheers
dan