1.9 JTDm 16v - Injector Correction Values / Knocking Noise

[MBatey]

I hope someone can help.
I've looked at other similar posts on here and thought i'd ask for peoples thoughts.

The car is an 08 plate 147 Sport Q2 with the 1.9 JTDm 16v inside.
It's been developing a knock on the engine which has been getting gradually louder since i bought the car in Jan.
I know diesels aren't meant to be the quietest (ive owned diesels before), but this is something that sounds wrong. I've had people comment asking if the car is OK when i've picked them up.

When first starting in the morning its sounds like an absolute bag of spanners, and once warmed up its quieter but i can still hear it.
The MPG round town is shocking aswell, I can drive 25 miles down the M6 after work and the fuel gauge wont move, or if it does marginally. But when i get off and drive through town about 3 miles to get home its almost as if i can see it moving (it will drop abt 2 marks on the fuel gauge).
When sat on the drive for 10mins when warm while i was pulling stats off with FiatECUScan, the gauge dropped another chunk.
I've had intermittent hard to starts aswell. The engine would turn over for 2-3 secs then fire up with a plume of whitish smoke emitted from the exhaust.
I've attached a screenshot of the Injector Correction Values from FES, which from reading other peoples posts i think are high and could be causing my issues??
ECUINJ.jpg
(These were taken after a 35mile run on Motorway & A roads without turning the engine off, so should be right warmed up!)

Now heres the best part.
I've taken it in to my local Alfa Garage, which is where i bought it from in the first place, and explained all these points. They've turned round and flattly said that they cannot find anything at fault with the car! I was gobsmacked.

Am i over-reacting, or do you think like i do that i have possibly 2 faulty injectors???

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

[TribesMan]

For earlier engines the correction numbers should be within +-0.9mm3/inj, but yours is a JTDm which has narrower margins of just +-0.4mm3/inj
So yes that could be a problem (but it could also be something else causing this high correction factors as a consequence).
Find a specialist who can test the injectors on the professional Bosch equipment and get them cleaned/renewed if necessary. After that injectors must be calibrated, each one will get a new identification number which must be programmed back into the ECU...
Where I live cleaning costs 50-80€ and complete rework of a faulty injector is somewhere 120-200€.

[TribesMan]

Also you could get the cylinder compression test done... wont hurt.

[MBatey]

Thanks Tribesman. Appreciate that.

Just picked it up last night from the garage, where i expressed my displeasure.
At least that made me feel better and get me money off the diagnostic bill.

I cant believe the service from the main dealer though, its the last time i use them. Just a flat refusal to accept anything might be wrong.
For close to £100 per hour i honestly must love throwing money away on these made up problems!!

I'm gonna take it elsewhere in the summer when i have some time off and get them checked like you said.

[losa]

Could be one of injectors misfiring (go to BOSCH specialist to check and recondition them if necesary)
or
Could be faulty valve tappets making that noise.


If these values are taken when car was idling, I'd say no1 and no3 are bad.
But you need to do that test when driving (when the noise is bad) and see which injector has biggest corrections.
And the best way to diagnose the faulty one is BOSCH test bench...

[MBatey]

When the engine gets revved to 2000rpm the corrections on all 4 drop to about 0.2

[losa]

Originally Posted by MBatey

When the engine gets revved to 2000rpm the corrections on all 4 drop to about 0.2

Probably when car is stationary.

Try to read these values when car is accelerating (engine under load).

[zulu]

Will be interested to see how you progress with this. My 1.9 sounds similar and I suspect an injector issue. It's noisy under load up to about 2500 rpm where is seems to get quieter, but even so just sound like a loud ticking.
has been in to dealer for to investigate a couple of times (last week, and they identified a faulty Fan ECU which is on order) but they can't find anything wrong. I've had the engine management light coming on repeatedly and they can't fathom that out either (doesn't give you much faith does it)
In summary, the best they have offered so far is 'It's probably just a 'noisy' injector, or two. They sometimes are like that, nothing wrong, just some are noisier than others!!!'

It will be due for it's first major service in 2000 miles, and I don't want to take it to the dealer, rather my preferred specialist. Just worried about repercussions of any faults that he identifies that should be fixed under warranty.

[adrianuxx]

I have in my 159 2.4 jtdm 200 cv values between 0.10 and 0.70, but when AC connected, these values change drasticaly, so whey rise at 1,12 an 1,00 in 3 injectors. Is that normal?

[losa]

Originally Posted by zulu

Will be interested to see how you progress with this. My 1.9 sounds similar and I suspect an injector issue. It's noisy under load up to about 2500 rpm where is seems to get quieter, but even so just sound like a loud ticking.
has been in to dealer for to investigate a couple of times (last week, and they identified a faulty Fan ECU which is on order) but they can't find anything wrong. I've had the engine management light coming on repeatedly and they can't fathom that out either (doesn't give you much faith does it)
In summary, the best they have offered so far is 'It's probably just a 'noisy' injector, or two. They sometimes are like that, nothing wrong, just some are noisier than others!!!'

It will be due for it's first major service in 2000 miles, and I don't want to take it to the dealer, rather my preferred specialist. Just worried about repercussions of any faults that he identifies that should be fixed under warranty.

Might be just noisy injector, or wrong code writen in ECU for that injector, it could even settle after a while...
But if the car is still under waranty maybe they could replace the noisy one...

Originally Posted by adrianuxx

I have in my 159 2.4 jtdm 200 cv values between 0.10 and 0.70, but when AC connected, these values change drasticaly, so whey rise at 1,12 an 1,00 in 3 injectors. Is that normal?

Yes that's normal.
When AC is on, total fuel quantity neded to maintain 850rpm is raising, so injection correction values are raising too.