V6 bottom end problems spider 916 - Alfa Romeo Forum
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(Post Link) post #1 of 22 Old 18-06-16 Thread Starter
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V6 bottom end problems spider 916

My newly aquired spider v6 has serious issues!
I knew there was a bottom end noise so went about investigating and recognised dmf noise. Having been "reliably "informed that the v6 bottom end is bomb proof as long as oil hasn't been lost I went about fitting a gta flywheel and clutch ( not easy but did it on my own on the drive with subframe on). Old clutch was shot but on starting the old knock was still there worsening as she warmed and particularly on reving overrun. Bottom end!
So I dropped the sump (again not straightforward but doable ) I found one big end pummelled with shards of shell in the sump. The bearing had spun and so I tried cleaning it up and fitted new shells as the journal looked serviceable. I was wrong! Didn't last 5 minutes!
So what to do? New crank, new rod or rods? Or replacement engine?
I'm tempted to put in a replacement engine from autolusso or the like and rebuild the original collecting parts over time but I'm undecided. Any input would be welcome and if anyone knows the whereabouts of any reasonable parts or replacement 3.0 engines it would be much appreciated.
I would love to get her running for some of the summer.
Cheers
Tim
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I'd fit another engine & forget about this one, seems like you know what you're doing.

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There is someone breaking a V6 on eBay in Cirencester. Says it's drivable & running.
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(Post Link) post #4 of 22 Old 19-06-16 Thread Starter
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There is someone breaking a V6 on eBay in Cirencester. Says it's drivable & running.
Thanks. Contacted cirencester chap and he's already sold the engine.
Search continues
Tim
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(Post Link) post #5 of 22 Old 25-06-16 Thread Starter
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Well I've ordered a used engine from autolusso which Liam tells me is checked for compression and head gasket leakage. I've got all the usual service parts and cambelt on their way too.
So now a simple swap....how hard can it be?
Do I pull the engine out the top or drop the whole lot with subframe? If I drop the whole lot I can check/clean it all but I'm itching to get behind the wheel for the summer, when it comes, so I might haul it out the top.
Can't find my cam locks either at the moment! There's always some buggeration and I'm sure it won't be the only one.
Anyone out there know where I can find a conrod and salvageable crank to rebuild the old motor?
Regards
Tim
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Drop the whole lot out.

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+1 on the above. The subframe will be rusty in places anyway and now would be a good time to stop it getting any worse.
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I dropped mine, but left subframe fitted, as I wanted to wheel car out the way when done. Very tight but doable.Id think it better removed to replace engine though.
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(Post Link) post #9 of 22 Old 25-06-16 Thread Starter
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Does anyone know of a guide or of any pitfalls?
I guess, very basically, i disconnect pipes and wiring
Remove front exhaust pipes,
Break track rods, undo rack bolts and hang rack
Undo strut tops
Undo subframe and bobs your uncle
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(Post Link) post #10 of 22 Old 25-06-16 Thread Starter
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That's a Haynes manual version!
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(Post Link) post #11 of 22 Old 02-07-16 Thread Starter
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What a few days!
Took the engine and box out the top in the end as had no access to a ramp. Involved job.
The new motor arrived from autolusso, a 166 lump so a few studs needed changing over as well as the top engine mount.
Timing kit etc. fitted (what a joy with the engine out). Manifolds, wiring, pumps, alternator etc swapped over. Gta clutch and flywheel fitted and dropped it back in. I say dropped as I almost did. It pays dividends to have the proper kit as usual, and a second pair of hands would have been a great help and speeded things up no end!
Three days on my tod and it's back in bolted up. Still a lot to do next week and not looking forward to the blessed oil cooler pipes.
Next time, when I've rebuilt the original engine, I think I'll go for dropping the whole subframe method as I was advised! Still I know what to watch out for and the angles nesessary . I would advise anyone attempting this to have an engine crane with an adjustable cradle.
Next week I'll attach everything and start her up and then get her on the road in time for the start of summer. I'll try and post some pics as well.
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Bravo mate..!

Can you please explain more the process of installing the GTA flywhell and clutch?

You just removed the dual-mass and bolted the GTA flywheel? DId you need different bolts for the new flywheel?

I am about to do it too, so any help & photos would be greatly appreciated!
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(Post Link) post #13 of 22 Old 02-07-16 Thread Starter
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Desame.
It's straight forward but you need the correct bolts and "ring" with the holes in which the bolts go through. I got mine with the used flywheel.
Mine simply bolted on, fitted new gta clutch kit and bolted up to torque with thread lock. The release bearing has a tapered sleave around its tip which covers and retains a spring. Make sure this is covering the spring. The release bearing is slid over the gearbox input shaft and engaged with the release fork by the 2 lugs. When the gearbox is mated to the engine the clutch actuating arm is pulled back from the engine which pushes the release bearing up into the clutch pushing the tapered sleave back and releasing the spring which engages with the clutch with a click.
Job done!
Sorry, no pics. I hope this makes sense.
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(Post Link) post #14 of 22 Old 02-07-16 Thread Starter
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Desame.
It's straight forward but you need the correct bolts and "ring" with the holes in which the bolts go through. I got mine with the used flywheel.
Mine simply bolted on, fitted new gta clutch kit and bolted up to torque with thread lock. The release bearing has a tapered sleave around its tip which covers and retains a spring. Make sure this is covering the spring. The release bearing is slid over the gearbox input shaft and engaged with the release fork by the 2 lugs. When the gearbox is mated to the engine the clutch actuating arm is pulled back from the engine which pushes the release bearing up into the clutch pushing the tapered sleave back and releasing the spring which engages with the clutch with a click.
Job done!
Sorry, no pics. I hope this makes sense.
PS the clutch is of the pull type thus the nose with the spring and sleave faces engine side.
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thank you!

i know the process, just was curious about the bolts. So i'll need to get new bolts!
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(Post Link) post #16 of 22 Old 08-07-16 Thread Starter
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Snagglings

Well all plumbed in and running.
Only a few problems other than the expected clips and bolts. A pool of oil formed underneath and after the initial panic it was power steering fluid, a holed return pipe. There was a concerning noise from the cambelt area. This was partly the powered steering pump pumping air but also the crankshaft pulley wobbling. It's shot so any ideas of where to find one at a reasonable price (I've seen one at 250 half the price of an engine!)
My main issue is that I have a spare socket in the black box attached to the plenhem and I'm not sure what should plug in there. My feeling is the front o/s knock sensor, can anyone help?
Also the other side knock sensor where does it plug in? I have a 2 prong plug left over by the thermostat housing!
It runs alright, picks up great but returns slowly to idle and sometimes runs a little rough on idle. There are no fault codes.
Wish I'd taken a load of photos and marked the wiring up better.
Any pointers will be gratefully received.
Thanks
Tim
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Well all plumbed in and running.
Only a few problems other than the expected clips and bolts. A pool of oil formed underneath and after the initial panic it was power steering fluid, a holed return pipe. There was a concerning noise from the cambelt area. This was partly the powered steering pump pumping air but also the crankshaft pulley wobbling. It's shot so any ideas of where to find one at a reasonable price (I've seen one at 250 half the price of an engine!)
My main issue is that I have a spare socket in the black box attached to the plenhem and I'm not sure what should plug in there. My feeling is the front o/s knock sensor, can anyone help?
Also the other side knock sensor where does it plug in? I have a 2 prong plug left over by the thermostat housing!
It runs alright, picks up great but returns slowly to idle and sometimes runs a little rough on idle. There are no fault codes.
Wish I'd taken a load of photos and marked the wiring up better.
Any pointers will be gratefully received.
Thanks
Tim
Will have one pulley for sale, in a week or 2, if you cannot find elsewhere till then!
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(Post Link) post #18 of 22 Old 17-07-16 Thread Starter
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Just to update. Knock sensors connected. Ecu reset completed and running well with maybe a little bit of a rough idle and a bit of auxillary belt noise from wobbling crank pulley, but my ears are mega sensetive!
Can't wait for a proper blast! Mot next week then roll on summer!
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Change that crank pulley sooner rather than later or you could end up with a big bill for engine repairs ....
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(Post Link) post #20 of 22 Old 22-07-16 Thread Starter
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Change that crank pulley sooner rather than later or you could end up with a big bill for engine repairs ....
Is that experience talking?
Got a gta one of for the time being, been assured it will be fine
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Is that experience talking?
Got a gta one of for the time being, been assured it will be fine
It is indeed
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(Post Link) post #22 of 22 Old 07-08-16 Thread Starter
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Thumbs Up Mot

Just an update.
Took the spider in for an mot as an exercise and she passed! Only a few advisaries two of which concerned the rear brakes which is no surprise given the lack of use, a small water leak which I've fixed and a dust cover on a front wishbone which I intend to replace shortly.
Done 100 miles ,tentative to start with, and what a lovely car! Given her some welly now and wow. The busso engine is such a magnificent all rounder. I knew this from my 164 cloverleaf days but having a v6 once more has brought it all back.
I love it. And now with wind in the hair, superb!
Happy man.

PS a couple of minor snagglings ............cooling fan resistor needs replacing and fuel guage a little tempremental but heyho totally forgivable.
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