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'Arguing'. Moi? I like to think of it as offering an alternative viewpoint.
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(Post Link) post #27 of 46 Old 10-05-16 Thread Starter
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In the meantime because the guys are preaping the car for respray and ca wheels are off, i asked them to send me a picture with the rear suspension
Also please check the video
I dont know for sure what is the problem but the spring CUP dont look quite good in my oppinion
Bumps stop seems to look ok
Springpans have a little corosion but they are fine, there are no holes in it )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c840CYtP42c

I didnt see it with my own eyes because didnt have time to go there, only in this video file
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(Post Link) post #28 of 46 Old 10-05-16 Thread Starter
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and a picture with the car stripped
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Doesn't look too bad. You have the original bumpstops so definitely need a gap between them and the springpan as they are hard rubber with very little give in them.
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(Post Link) post #30 of 46 Old 10-05-16 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by spankdanny View Post
Doesn't look too bad. You have the original bumpstops so definitely need a gap between them and the springpan as they are hard rubber with very little give in them.
CUP's, yellow bump stops and new pair of anti roll links are on the way already
Dont know if the yellow bump stops are longer then what i have right now
I undertand that the yellows are softer, but hope not to be longer
In Clive's picture with bumpstops, seems the yellow one are longer
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When it's back together you can jack it up under the springpan and check for clearance. Careful it doesn't come off the axle stands. You might someone large to sit on the boot. Also bear in mind the tyre probably grows due to centrifugal forces at speed.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by traian1981 View Post
CUP's, yellow bump stops and new pair of anti roll links are on the way already
Dont know if the yellow bump stops are longer then what i have right now
I undertand that the yellows are softer, but hope not to be longer
In Clive's picture with bumpstops, seems the yellow one are longer
The yellow ones are longer but softer, they both should fully compress at the same 'height' & you can shorten the yellow ones, by cutting the very soft part off**, if you wanted initial clearance.
**2nd pic shows cut yellow, 3rd pic shows 2 cut off parts from another pair of yellow bump stops.....not the one in the picture which is uncut.

If you can re use your old black ones they are better & stronger, the yellow ones break very easily & end up sitting on the springpan inside the spring.....so even when broken they still work to some degree. The first part of the black one is soft & if your suspension is sitting hard on them when stationary then you have a problem.....like the wrong, too short, springs. From an old note book I'm sure the Eibach rears should have 6.5 coils, check yours as I can't quite count them correctly from your photo.

When the bump stop is fully compressed that's where the suspension travel should stop to prevent rubbing. If you remove them, or shorten them some more, then that's when you get tyre clearance problems.

Here's a link to an earlier post in a thread you might like to read:

http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-...l#post14739602 (Advice on replacement wheels)

Lowering & fitting larger/wider wheels & tyres isn't an exact science but more like a trial & error, sometimes different people report different findings!? ( I think sometimes they 'bend' the truth!!).

Added some more pics I found. Red spring(Eibach I think) + early bump stop, yellow spring(Apex) + cut down later bump stop. Both pics taken with cars on the ground.

Another way to check where the tyre clearance issue is: remove spring & shock**, fit wheel & tyre, push upwards to see where & when the tyre touches. You could also try holding the cup & bumpstop in place while doing this, two person job & easier up in the air on a ramp. Obviously the car's weight will be more than you can safely push but as I said earleir....'it's trial & error'.......or just fit it all & 'suck it & see'.

** I think we removed the drop link as well.

Don't forget to confirm your wheel's ET.

Clive
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Last edited by CGTVs; 10-05-16 at 12:12. Reason: add info + more pics etc
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(Post Link) post #33 of 46 Old 10-05-16 Thread Starter
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Ok Clive,
I will wait for the cups, stops etc and see how will be
I didnt see very well through the wheel if the car is sitting on the bump stops, need to check again at car service, they have a hole in the ground and i can easily check if seats or not
Maybe all is in my head
As i told you, when i was driving to the paint garage i had so bad roads and heard somehing suspicios, but i didnt have mounted one anti roll link and probably thats why the car made some noises
The springs are new, its possible that they are weekened, malfunctioning from the factory?
On the front are great compared to the ones in had before them

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Quote:
Originally Posted by traian1981 View Post
Ok Clive,
I will wait for the cups, stops etc and see how will be
I didnt see very well through the wheel if the car is sitting on the bump stops, need to check again at car service, they have a hole in the ground and i can easily check if seats or not
Maybe all is in my head
As i told you, when i was driving to the paint garage i had so bad roads and heard somehing suspicios, but i didnt have mounted one anti roll link and probably thats why the car made some noises
The springs are new, its possible that they are weekened, malfunctioning from the factory?
On the front are great compared to the ones in had before them

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Even with weak/old/worn springs, if the bump stops are in place then there should still be clearance...no rubbing.

Don't forget to measure wheel centre to arch when on the ground & confirm wheel ET before taking it apart.

Clive
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Originally Posted by CGTVs View Post
Even with weak/old/worn springs, if the bump stops are in place then there should still be clearance...no rubbing.

Don't forget to measure wheel centre to arch when on the ground & confirm wheel ET before taking it apart.

Clive
As i see in the photo, red springs with black bump stops, the car is quite sitting on them, not like the yellow springs
As i saw through my wheels maybe is the same and i am overeacting
ET for sure is 28, all 18" Siena's have the same
I will make the measurements before i will take all off and replace
Will aslo come with feedback after all will be changed
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Originally Posted by traian1981 View Post
As i see in the photo, red springs with black bump stops, the car is quite sitting on them, not like the yellow springs
As i saw through my wheels maybe is the same and i am overeacting
ET for sure is 28, all 18" Siena's have the same
I will make the measurements before i will take all off and replace
Will aslo come with feedback after all will be changed
Don't forget my 'yellow one' had been cut/shortened. I changed it later to the black early type...far better.

The bump stop clearance isn't the important thing here it's the wheel/tyre position at full compression/stop.

Clive
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So if the bumps are not really the inportant issue, ET of the wheels is correct, Siena's are made for this car, springs and shock are new
What else can influence the ride hight, cleareance to the wheel arch?
Spring cups have an influence to it?


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So if the bumps are not really the inportant issue, ET of the wheels is correct, Siena's are made for this car, springs and shock are new
What else can influence the ride hight, cleareance to the wheel arch?
Spring cups have an influence to it?


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No they don't affect stationary ride height, they support/locate the bump stops which in turn stop the suspension travel upwards.

Wait until you've measured it........like we 'agreed' a few days ago.

Clive
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Ok
Think will take some time because now the car is in paint preaping and have the wheels off
Will come back

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Hi all
I still have the same problem with height on one side
I changed also the cups, i kept the bump stops because they were in good conditions
is low on the bolth sizes but on pasanger side on the rear is i think with 1 cm low, i cant enter my figer between the arch and the tyre
everything is new besides the rubber mounts, as you see in the picture the top rubber mount on that side is quite damaged
can this rubber mount affect the height on that side?
I cant find it anywere to order it, on local dealerships, ebay, etc
if you can help me with a link from where to buy them i will be very happy
the car in my oppinion looks great now after full respray and CUP kit but i am still upset regarding this rear cleareance issue
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Hi Clive
Any new ideas?
I didnt make the meassurments

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Hi Clive
Any new ideas?
I didnt make the meassurments
Well without any measurements it's hard to tell.

From your pictures there's nothing there which would affect the height.

Many aren't exactly equal but normally, in my experience, it's the fronts that can have approx 10mm difference. It doesn't affect how they drive, they're not exactly precision racing machines!

Clive
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That rubber top mount need replacing. Try a main dealer in the UK or Italy as you are in Romania. If none are available try a breakers. This is getting to be quite a problem finding new parts for our cars. Someone on the forum may have some if they are breaking a car that could be better than yours.
I would change that first and then get a 4 wheel alignement carried out, if the camber on the wheels is wrong it won't help the ride. I have 18's on my Spider with 235.40's. I had a 4 wheel alignement carried out, as the camber on my rear wheels was way out of what it should have been for driving on normal roads. You will find that on bad roads with pot holes, even with new suspension the ride will be rougher than on 16" or 17 " wheels, on the motorways it is great.
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I will make 2 photos and measure but now os raining here
Will come back

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That rubber top mount need replacing. Try a main dealer in the UK or Italy as you are in Romania. If none are available try a breakers. This is getting to be quite a problem finding new parts for our cars. Someone on the forum may have some if they are breaking a car that could be better than yours.
I would change that first and then get a 4 wheel alignement carried out, if the camber on the wheels is wrong it won't help the ride. I have 18's on my Spider with 235.40's. I had a 4 wheel alignement carried out, as the camber on my rear wheels was way out of what it should have been for driving on normal roads. You will find that on bad roads with pot holes, even with new suspension the ride will be rougher than on 16" or 17 " wheels, on the motorways it is great.
I will also try on breakers here in RO
There are some gtv's available
Problem is the majority have those top mounts in bad shape
I also had a gtv and.brake it, bought it just to have the Cup splitter )
Also, the top mounts were very bad
Will come back with pictures on bolth wheels to see

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meantime
Is not stamped on the rear lower side
Need to use shorter stampes, thats why look like this now
Will solve it tommorow

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...52059f77b3.jpg
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...d49a9ceb3f.jpg

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