Concerns with temperature

After reading the hot hot topic this has got me concerned with my GTA, it does seem to creep past the 90 in a short period of time, it takes time to warm up which I feel is normal but once its near 90 it creeps past and the fans kick in and will cool it back down they do take a while to do this, does the GTA run HOT I feel the cooling is not very efficient for town driving is this right? Its temp is fine on a run i.e. an A Road. Also is the temperature sensor on the rad or the engine? Thanks for some advice guys, is the solution a new rad?

How old is it? Rad's tend to be knackered by the time they are 5 years old. Mine has just had a rad put in, I assume its 2nd replacement rad as the car is ten years old.

Also, the speed of the radiator fan is controlled by two thermistors, if one is broken the rad fan speed will not increase as the temperature rises, it will be constant.

Have a look here, this might be of some interest to you:

http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/tunin...-new-post.html

Mine has always run at under 90 when moving, and crept over 90 when in traffic before the fans kick in. TBH it hasn't bothered me as I have owned other Italian cars with guages that behaved like this, notably my integrale that would reach 100 in traffic but show as quite cool when on the move, and that was 100% reliable in two years ownership.

Now awaiting to be shot down in flames.

Check your radiator core. It could be early signs that it is starting to go. My 156 used to be like this - started to run a bit hot but the fan kept it cooled down when necessary. Then one day while stuck in a motorway queue it started climbing and just carried on virtually into the red. The core was shot, 4-5 years old, about 50K miles.

Cheers,

Nigel

Ok the car is an 03 so 5 years old, doesnt look like its ever been changed, the fan speed seems constant and they do switch off once the temperature drops I was just wondering where it senses the temparture from I take it not from the Rad. How do I check the core? Thanks all for your advice

the price of having a big engine in a small space! This is also the reason why Alfa fitted an oil cooler....

I dont mind if this is normal for this car

Just making sure it is

OK so here is my question on this. Does anyone own a GTA that gets to 90C and just stay there?

The only two Italian cars I have driven that have done this were my 2003 FIAT Punto, and the GT diesel I borrowed from Autolusso last week. Funny enough the guages look the same on the GT/Punto.

I was still in touch with the previous owner of my integrale and asked him at the time. His response was it had always done that, and had no issues coming through the mountain roads of Italy Like I say, that car despite the reputation was rock solid in two years ownership.

Also I would expect to get rubbish MPG if it were running cool/rich, and I am returning 25 mpg with mixed driving and get upto 35 mpg on a run.

Originally Posted by EddieGTA

Does anyone own a GTA that gets to 90C and just stay there?

Yes! Mine takes a while to get to 90 (between five and ten minutes at a guess), but thereafter, I've never seen it read anything other than 90C.

Cheers
Aubrey

Originally Posted by Aubrey

Yes! Mine takes a while to get to 90 (between five and ten minutes at a guess), but thereafter, I've never seen it read anything other than 90C.

Cheers
Aubrey

I should have worded that 156 GTA, I assume the 147 has the same temp guage as the GT and Punto. I just wonder whether the 156 picks up temp changes more.

I might as well add my gta sits steady at ever so slightly below 90 and once it gets there, it never budges until the engine is off.

Eddie, my integrale did the same thing as well. You miss the car? I do.

Just posted this on the hot thread:
Regarding temperature:
There is a very large thread on here with peoples temps etc.
The thread prompted me to a thermostat change about 2 year ago, the temps I was seeing were around 75 deg normal running, 90deg in traffic, fans always kick in at this, they will also kick in earlier if you are running aircon or the auto (aircon) light is on.
Results were that the car ran exactly the same temperatures with the new thermostat fitted, the old one was tested and found to be fine (left new one in anyway).
It seems that GTA's run lower temperatures than other V6's so don't be too scared. An easy way to check is thanks to the wonderfull software Alfa run as if you watch the gauge from cold it will rise to around 75/80 then you see the temp drop again as the thermostat opens and steadily rise.
If however you don't see at least 70 then it is probably stuffed and should be changed asap.
If you are regularily at 90+ in traffic it is likely to be the plastic impellered pump.
The thing I learnt from this was not scare yourself silly over everything you read on internet forums.

Originally Posted by ohwell

I might as well add my gta sits steady at ever so slightly below 90 and once it gets there, it never budges until the engine is off.

Eddie, my integrale did the same thing as well. You miss the car? I do.

Yeah. Was an unbeliveable car, I love the GTA and after getting rid of the integrale in a moment of madness refuse to sell the GTA despite all the new tax and rising fuel price. Just wish I had a garage big enough for them both.

Originally Posted by gtachris

Just posted this on the hot thread:
Regarding temperature:
There is a very large thread on here with peoples temps etc.
The thread prompted me to a thermostat change about 2 year ago, the temps I was seeing were around 75 deg normal running, 90deg in traffic, fans always kick in at this, they will also kick in earlier if you are running aircon or the auto (aircon) light is on.
Results were that the car ran exactly the same temperatures with the new thermostat fitted, the old one was tested and found to be fine (left new one in anyway).
It seems that GTA's run lower temperatures than other V6's so don't be too scared. An easy way to check is thanks to the wonderfull software Alfa run as if you watch the gauge from cold it will rise to around 75/80 then you see the temp drop again as the thermostat opens and steadily rise.
If however you don't see at least 70 then it is probably stuffed and should be changed asap.
If you are regularily at 90+ in traffic it is likely to be the plastic impellered pump.
The thing I learnt from this was not scare yourself silly over everything you read on internet forums.

Good response, yeah I remember that thread. I think there are two factors here.

1) The type of guage, where the 156 guages seems to give a pretty immedeate reading hence you can watch it move in traffic noticably.

2) Being a more performance oriented car driven normally there is more than adequete cooling.

Originally Posted by gtachris

If however you don't see at least 70 then it is probably stuffed and

Completely agree. If you aren't seeing at least 70 in moving traffice then change ASAP.. This is what pokinacha is experiencing.

Otherwise do not worry.

If it helps ease your mind.

I noticed that my GTV V6 was running at around 75 degrees normal driving, rising to 90 degrees with a bit of welly . Idled at around 90 degrees in winter, rising to 97/98 degrees at idle when its hot.

Called my specialist today and he said that was perfectly normal.

Apparently on the GTV (maybe the same on the 156 GTA?), the two stage fan kicks in at 92 degrees (1st phase) and 97 degrees (2nd phase).

Originally Posted by DelboyMatt

If it helps ease your mind.

I noticed that my GTV V6 was running at around 75 degrees normal driving, rising to 90 degrees with a bit of welly . Idled at around 90 degrees in winter, rising to 97/98 degrees at idle when its hot.

Called my specialist today and he said that was perfectly normal.

Apparently on the GTV (maybe the same on the 156 GTA?), the two stage fan kicks in at 92 degrees (1st phase) and 97 degrees (2nd phase).

But there is a difference between the car not overheating and the car overcooling.

Running at around 75 degrees isn't normal, as the thermostat should stay closed until 85 degrees. If you think your thermostat isn't stuck open, then hold your hand on your radiator and get someone to start the car - I bet the radiator will get warmer from the offset, rather than staying cold until the coolant temp reaches 85, which should then open the thermostat and allow the hot coolant to run into the cool radiator. In fact, this opening of the thermostat the first time the car is started from cold is what causes the little drop in coolant temp as the car is heating up, mentioned by GTAChris..

This is all assuming your coolant temp gauge is accurate, which often isn't the case though, and this complicates things further.

Originally Posted by EddieGTA

OK so here is my question on this. Does anyone own a GTA that gets to 90C and just stay there?

The only two Italian cars I have driven that have done this were my 2003 FIAT Punto, and the GT diesel I borrowed from Autolusso last week. Funny enough the guages look the same on the GT/Punto.

I was still in touch with the previous owner of my integrale and asked him at the time. His response was it had always done that, and had no issues coming through the mountain roads of Italy Like I say, that car despite the reputation was rock solid in two years ownership.

Also I would expect to get rubbish MPG if it were running cool/rich, and I am returning 25 mpg with mixed driving and get upto 35 mpg on a run.

Mine is exactly the same, sicks at what looks like 75 ish. My previous 156 GTA was also exactly the same (thats 100k miles between them!), did this from new and runs sweet as a nut and get good mpg figures aswell.

Originally Posted by Pud237

But there is a difference between the car not overheating and the car overcooling.

Running at around 75 degrees isn't normal, as the thermostat should stay closed until 85 degrees. If you think your thermostat isn't stuck open, then hold your hand on your radiator and get someone to start the car - I bet the radiator will get warmer from the offset, rather than staying cold until the coolant temp reaches 85, which should then open the thermostat and allow the hot coolant to run into the cool radiator. In fact, this opening of the thermostat the first time the car is started from cold is what causes the little drop in coolant temp as the car is heating up, mentioned by GTAChris..

This is all assuming your coolant temp gauge is accurate, which often isn't the case though, and this complicates things further.

Pud, I agree on most points except mine will normally run at 75-80 deg on the move, always 90 in traffic and the thermostat is fine, the old one that came out was fine and there was absolutely no change in the temps experienced when it was changed.
156 GTA's seem to run cooler.

Originally Posted by gtachris

Pud, I agree on most points except mine will normally run at 75-80 deg on the move, always 90 in traffic and the thermostat is fine, the old one that came out was fine and there was absolutely no change in the temps experienced when it was changed.
156 GTA's seem to run cooler.

Well I'm sure it is probably down to a slightly inaccurate gauge. I can't see how the car won't get past 75-80 degrees if in fact the thermostat is working as described and opening only once it reaches 85 degrees. My JTD was experiencing symptoms of over-cooling, only got to around 60 degrees. After a new thermostat it only got up to around 75 degrees, but technically the thermostat should only open at 85 degrees? Sounds similar to your GTA, and is probably down to the gauge..

If you plug in an examiner you can get it to read the exact temp as the ECU sees it though, rather than guessing based on an inaccurate needle on a dial.

Originally Posted by turbole

How do I check the core? Thanks all for your advice

Put your hands on the "fins" that run horizontally in the radiator frame. If they crumble and come away in your hand, the core is starting to deteriorate.

Cheers,

Nigel

Originally Posted by EddieGTA

Mine has always run at under 90 when moving, and crept over 90 when in traffic before the fans kick in.

my 2l TS does same - not a prob, ive had her checked and replaced stat.