I just picked up my 2011 GQV with 40,000Kms on the clock and drove it around for the first time on my own outside the dealer.
First thing I noticed was the amount of soft bouncy body roll it has.
Firstly let me explain where I have come from. My previous car was a GTV V6 with Koni Sport Shocks with bigger 18" wheels and lower profile tyres to match. The handling was very good almost like a cart but the ride was very firm. In fact main reason I sold it was I was sick to death of the firm ride (and it was getting old etc etc)
So get into a more modern car like the GQV and the ride is 1,000 times more comfortable and I thank the gods for that. But it feels so bouncy compared to my cart like GTV. Is this normal ? and what can be done to control the bounciness ?
What about sway bars ? maybe firmer shocks however I dont want another hard riding car like my GTV. I love the comfort the way it is its perfect.
Bounciness, great term
I presume you mean the time it takes for the car to settle after going over bumps or do you mean amount of lean going into a corner?
If it is settling down after bumps/undulations, I'd consider new shock absorbers as a first step.
I would not consider sway bars, as stiffer sway bars will improve the amount of body roll but make the car bumpier in a straight line, and if you get the front//back sizing wrong you can change the oversteer/understeer character of the car.
My car is on 19 inch wheels and fitted with Novitec lowering springs. I don't think the body rolls that much but it is a firm ride. Feels like sitting on a cloud compared to my old Mito on 18 inch and coilovers though!
I thought that was a classic alfa characteristic. I remember my first
alfa, a
Sud, was very soft in the suspension. But it cornered beautifully. Maybe you should leave it for a couple of hundred miles to see if you get used to it. Then consider changing the shocks
I just took it for a quick drive last night and did notice it does hold the road very well and points and steers exactly where I want it to go so no complaints there apart from the Wild Turbo boost but thats another thread.
So compared to my old GTV V6 it just rides over bumps at high speed with no problem at all where as my GTV would be struggling at half speed just to negotiate the bumps in the road.
So I can see where the comfort factor comes in as a perfomance enhancer on public roads.
Maybe I will keep driving for a few more weeks to see what I want to do.
Have more time in the car now and I really like how so comfortable the car is. It handles and performs quite well and happy with everything but just a little concerned with the excessive body movement and it "floating" around a little especially at higher freeway speeds.
Not sure if sway or torsion bars will solve this problem or not, but I dont want to change anything else like handling or comfort are perfect, just the body movement is what Id like to control.
Or then again should I just not worry about it. My low slung GTV had none of this but the Giulietta sits much higher so maybe its just a characteristic of the car ...
The rears are easy but the fronts are harder due to them being part of the strut.
I am using them with Eibach Springs at the moment, but I did run them with standard springs for a while and they were a huge improvement over the originals.
I'm running my G and my previous G up to 200km/hr with stock suspension and I don't notice floatiness at those speeds. I find the ability to soak up the bumps and not lose grip is more important However, I was considering the Bilsteins to replace worn shocks.
Other than coarse chip bitumen I think the road quality on main roads is fairly similar between Germany and Australia.
So the B4s are better than OEM ? and have the same level of comfort ?
My car is a 2011 model and only done 40,000km so I think the shocks are reasonably fresh. Of course if they were worn I would replace them with Bilstein in a heartbeat but dont think they are that worn at all. Or what are peoples thoughts at 40,000km ?
I cant change shocks myself would need a mechanic.
And Symon what is the ride quality like on your car now compared to OEM ?
Now it is better than OEM as I also have eibach springs.
With standard springs and B4 dampers I would say the comfort was very similar to OEM, but the body control definitely felt better and the rear of the car was much less likely to step out at the back if a bump was hit mid corner.
Alfa do seem to set the cars up as standard with slightly stiff springs, and slightly soft dampers, where as most manufacturers have soft springs and better damping.
Maybe the roads in Italy suit that setup?
The last Alfa I had which I considered to have a decent spring and damper balance which suited UK roads was the 164 V6 Lusso. But that was a good 18 years ago and the roads are much worse now than they were then.
Mines the JTD-M with the sports suspension and I noticed the rear has a tendency to bounce and it can be a tad unsettling. However, the car is on cheap (Chinese) tires at the moment, they'll be due for replacement soon so I'll replace them with something good like ContiSport Contact 5 or Michelin Pilot Sport 4's. The difference on my other car (Saab 9-3) between the Pirelli Cinturato P1 vs the ContiSport Contact 5 is out of this world, so much more grip, a settled ride and so much quieter. I haven't tried the MPS4's but I've heard good things.
So if you don't already have good tires maybe that's something to consider.
When I had the same setup as you, the rear would become unstable during hard braking. I only replaced the rear springs with QV springs and every hint of unease was gone. I had the original P7 at the time in 225/45R17.
The sports chassis is officially called dynamic chassis and I do believe their aim was to make the car more playful other than more efficient. There used to be videos on youtube released by Alfa that confirmed this. The rear stepped out more during fast maneuvres with dynamic chassis.
As you are accustomed to your GTV V6 with very hard springs and shoks I would drive your G for a week or two to get accustomed to it. If you still feel it roll too much find the parts like stiffer anti roll bars etc.
I've driven my G120 TB for soon 1½ year and I'm very satisfied with it driving dynamics. But we are all different.
Have driven it for a while now and Im starting to get used to it as you say it is a much higher stanced car in comparison to my low slung GTV to start with.
First things I will look at are :
1) Tyre Pressures
2) Anti Roll bars
3) Bilstein Shocks
I increased the tyre pressure today from 36/34 documented nitrogen PSI on previous owners invoice slip to 40/40 PSI on hot tyres all round.
I was very surprised that the car "hardened" up quite a bit and became alot more like a sports car. The body movment was reduced enough for it to be almost acceptable but the ride comfort was greatly reduced also where it was banging over bumps and feeling every irregularity in the road. I then started to look for bumps to avoid like my old GTV which was terrible over bumps.
Anyway went back to the garage and asked them to put the tyres on 38/38 PSI all round and I think this is a good compromise now between comfort and performance for now. I like the car to just ride over bumps like there not there and I dont want to be hunting for bumps on the road to avoid all the time.
If you run the rear tyre pressure to high the back can feel loose as it has less weight on the tyre. I used to deliberately do this on a FWD race car, to induce aggressive lift off oversteer.
I run my car at max values in the book as I prefer to trade a little ride comfort for better fuel economy and in my view slightly better grip.
I run max values aswell (usually high speed values or maxload values) but not for grip but rather handling: it's one less component that unsettles over uneven roads or during weight transfers.
no lap times. besides being slower than most, it was too busy to set decent times anyway.
I really went to properly test the behaviour of the car. I wasn't let down except for the tyres but that wasn't unexpected (Hankook ventus prime 2 in 215/50R17)
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