164 americana 1992 V6 3.0

[brit01]

Hi guys,

Nice looking 164 here with just 150K on the clock.

I currently own a 33 1.7 and never been in this section before.

In summer we do a lot of motorway driving in high temperatures (30-40 degrees) with my 2 year old.

This looks like an attractive and comfortable driving experience.

Are these known to have major mechanical issues (expensive repairs) after 150k?

Vendo O Premuto Alfa Romeo 164 V6 3.0 Version Americana - Año 1992 - 150000 km - en MercadoLibre

[brit01]

I guess I need to know when the clutch was last replaced. Any issues with the water pump, when last changed if at all. Any syncro issues.

Pulling this engine to repair clutches, gear parts will not be cheap at all I imagine.

[A-team]

Che, I would check when the cam belt was last changed. Though I don't know if it's possible to know for sure when it was changed.

By the way which mechanic do you use for your 33? Are there many Alfa specialist mechanics in Montevideo?

I have a 166 but it's in Europe. In Uruguay the car prices are like highway robbery because of the taxes and because you can't import used cars unless they are very old.

saludos de un extranjero en UY

[brit01]

Che! jeje

Cambelts I would change as soon as I buy a used car just to be on the safe side.

Most work on my 33 is done by myself. Self-taught mechanic and much more prolijo than most mechanics working for a living here! Here is Oliveto for AR but complete daylight robbery.

Just rebuilt my whole boxer engine, complete down to the cleaning/polishing and measuring the crank using plastiguage. Bujes/small ends were done by Santiago (Lovecars). Don't own a press and the associated tools for that work.

Otherwise I've used Jose Sabah down Av.Brazil a couple of times. Before that it was Classic cars (Martin Lopez).

I'm an expat (Brit). Been here over 7 years now.

Yes all car prices are daylight robbery here but the 164's are relatively cheap considering the performance you get from them.

Saudos de otro extranjero en UY! (where are you from? I'm guessing USA because of your verbiage used 'highway robbery')

[Avocet]

I think they were one of the best-built cars Alfa ever did, to be honest. You hear of plenty of them clocking up big miles. I scrapped my last one at a quarter of a million. The big problem is that parts are getting very hard to find. For that reason, I don't use mine as a daily driver any more.

[A-team]

There's also this one. Less tarted up with after market products and cheaper: http://auto.mercadolibre.com.uy/MLU-...-164-v6-30-_JM

[brit01]

Thanks A-team.
165K - good one.

I think they were one of the best-built cars Alfa ever did, to be honest. You hear of plenty of them clocking up big miles. I scrapped my last one at a quarter of a millio

Good to know. What parts tend to fail first?

[Alfaomegatron]

On the structural side you may want to request pics or examine the following areas:-

Rear Subframe
All jacking points
Boot or trunk floor/wheel arch seam {need to remove boot carpet}
Chassis area below the main car battery
Front subframe where radiator and AC condenser sit
Rear wheel arches where rear bumper and plastic side moulding join

On the fittings side of things:-
Ask about the external door handles, are they cracked or deformed in any way. Check the inner door levers are also working and not broken.
All electric windows work.
Is the sunroof working or has the fuse been removed
Rear screen demister does it work? VERY Important you check the condition of the fuse in the boot beside the battery, they have a habit of melting.
Indicator lenses are they secure?
Fog lamps working and undamaged

Will leave the HVAC and mechanicals to others, except to remind you to check that the ventilation controls can be selected and actually work, in particular the directional controls.

[Avocet]

In my experience they are very tough, durable cars. As Alfaomegatron mentions, corrosion can be a problem (although the UK has a notoriously damp climate, so this may not be a problem elsewhere)!

Mechanically, they are great, if not neglected. Early manual transmission, 12V cars in Europe used to destroy their front gearbox bearings - clearly an expensive job, as is a clutch). There is an uprated part available, which was fitted to later cars.

The hydraulic timing belt tensioner contains parts that are no longer available.

If fitted with cliamte control, there are two geared stepper motors - one for temperature and one for direction of the air. Both are famous for stripping their plastic gears, and the dashboard needs to come out to change them - BIG job!

They all burn oil (even when new)!

They sometimes suffer from "apparent" low oil pressure - this is because the pressure sender gradually fills with oil and stops working properly. There's a quick and cheap fix for it!

Engine mountings can deteriorate and are expensive / difficult to get - especially the right hand front one (as you sit in the car). Poor engine mountings reduce the life of the exhaust flexible sections (which are also getting hard to find).

Rear springs can sag, front springs can break. There was a recall (at least in the UK) early in the car's life because the bottom front spring pans can rust. Not sure if they're still available.

Front wishbone bushes (the big ones at the back of the wishbone) don't last long and the car will tramline and torque-steer terribly if they're worn.

The bushes at each end of the rear trailing links can deteriorate. The large front ones on each link can only be bought as part of a complete link, and are getting rare.

[brit01]

Originally Posted by Avocet

In my experience they are very tough, durable cars. As Alfaomegatron mentions, corrosion can be a problem (although the UK has a notoriously damp climate, so this may not be a problem elsewhere)!

Mechanically, they are great, if not neglected. Early manual transmission, 12V cars in Europe used to destroy their front gearbox bearings - clearly an expensive job, as is a clutch). There is an uprated part available, which was fitted to later cars.

The hydraulic timing belt tensioner contains parts that are no longer available.

If fitted with cliamte control, there are two geared stepper motors - one for temperature and one for direction of the air. Both are famous for stripping their plastic gears, and the dashboard needs to come out to change them - BIG job!

They all burn oil (even when new)!

They sometimes suffer from "apparent" low oil pressure - this is because the pressure sender gradually fills with oil and stops working properly. There's a quick and cheap fix for it!

Engine mountings can deteriorate and are expensive / difficult to get - especially the right hand front one (as you sit in the car). Poor engine mountings reduce the life of the exhaust flexible sections (which are also getting hard to find).

Rear springs can sag, front springs can break. There was a recall (at least in the UK) early in the car's life because the bottom front spring pans can rust. Not sure if they're still available.

Front wishbone bushes (the big ones at the back of the wishbone) don't last long and the car will tramline and torque-steer terribly if they're worn.

The bushes at each end of the rear trailing links can deteriorate. The large front ones on each link can only be bought as part of a complete link, and are getting rare.

Hi guys,

A new year is upon us and I'm still running around in my old 33. Now as my son gets bigger and we do more long distance trips I am again contemplating buying a more comfortable car. One with A/C for the 40 degree summers!
due to prices of new cars here the 164 comes to mind again as prices are low here (due to rare spare parts - used to this with my 33, one of only a handful here).

Looking at a very nice red 164 here. Only 119,000 kms. Fully serviced at the AR official workshop here.

How good is the A/C on these big cars?
Rust won't be an issue here (no road salt or snow!)
But as I see from your comments a lot of things that can go wrong with these (as with any modern luxury cars I guess)

tempting indeed.
3.0 V6 very nice indeed.

Alfa Romeo 164 Super 3.0 V6 Impecable - Año 1994 - 119000 km - en MercadoLibre

[Avocet]

Aircon is not so good, I'm afraid. But I don't know what you are comparing it with! The aircon system in the 164 was designed to use the (now banned) R12 refrigerant - which was a better refrigerant than the current R134a - which is what should be in that car. Normally, the manufacturer just increases the size / efficiency of the condenser to make up for the less effective refrigerant, but Alfa kept all the same hardware, so the later cars are not as good. It's fine for the UK, but I wouldn't like to say you'll be OK in 40 degrees ambient! If you go on the American Alfa 164 fora:

164 Discussions

and

Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums

There always seem to be lots of people from the Southern States complaining about their aircon!

To be honest, the cars are very electrically and mechanically reliable, by and large, but I don't know if I'd trust one as a daily driver with no backup. They really are "classic cars" nowadays, and don't udnerestimate the downtime if you get stuck for a part!

(The one in the ad looks tidy though)!

[brit01]

Originally Posted by Avocet

Aircon is not so good, I'm afraid. But I don't know what you are comparing it with! The aircon system in the 164 was designed to use the (now banned) R12 refrigerant - which was a better refrigerant than the current R134a - which is what should be in that car. Normally, the manufacturer just increases the size / efficiency of the condenser to make up for the less effective refrigerant, but Alfa kept all the same hardware, so the later cars are not as good. It's fine for the UK, but I wouldn't like to say you'll be OK in 40 degrees ambient! If you go on the American Alfa 164 fora:

164 Discussions

and

Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums

There always seem to be lots of people from the Southern States complaining about their aircon!

To be honest, the cars are very electrically and mechanically reliable, by and large, but I don't know if I'd trust one as a daily driver with no backup. They really are "classic cars" nowadays, and don't udnerestimate the downtime if you get stuck for a part!

(The one in the ad looks tidy though)!

thanks for the feedback.

The AC really needs to be very good. I'm talking about 50+ degree temps in the direct sun, baking eggs on the paint surface.
35-40 in the shade!

[TomX19]

Originally Posted by Avocet

To be honest, the cars are very electrically and mechanically reliable, by and large, but I don't know if I'd trust one as a daily driver with no backup. They really are "classic cars" nowadays, and don't udnerestimate the downtime if you get stuck for a part!

(The one in the ad looks tidy though)!

I have used mine daily for over a year now, but I was off the road for a month when a coolant hose blew, as I had a month wait for Samco ones to be made. In hindsight I think maybe I could have found the parts quicker with a bit more effort. If the cambelt hasn't been done be aware that the tensioner is not the same as the other 24v cars (166, GTV, etc.) and is hard to find. I've just had my cambelt done and was very lucky that my local Alfa specialist (which is within walking distance) had one spare.

Apart from one non-start when the immobiliser relay went, it's been fine on reliability. I think it's a well built car, and I say this as someone who has had seven of the 80s tank-like SAABs!

[DNA]

We have owned quite a few 164's, all 3.0 24v's and they proofed to be ultra reliable.
My friend Ryan has some issues with his 164 3.0 24v though.
Mine's a/c was fairly good in our South African weather 30-35deg C.
Check timing belt.
Do waterpump.
If the engine runs bearings it is a very expensive exersize thou.